I am too old for sex and games like this ...

[EveHarrington]

Leaving one relationship and tentatively stepping into the world of dating, I have come to the conclusion that I am too old for sex where I do all the giving and get little in return.

My first "date" post-split. Ok, it didn't start off as a "date" as such - I doubt he initially knew what my intentions were. It was just meant to be an innocent lunch. It ended up with me back at his. Having done pretty much everything other than actual sex, he stops and says, "No, I don't want to do that yet." I tried to find out why, but he just said he wanted to "take things one step at a time." Fair enough, I am old enough to understand when no means no, and that applies to men as well as women, so didn't push any further - I would never want to rush someone into something if they aren't ready.

What pissed me off mightily was that this followed me going down on him, etc etc, whilst I got the benefit of a few hard kisses and fingers (yup, he didn't even return the favour! Grrr!). Yes, TMI, but a lot of has been consumed. It wasn't a bad experience - dare I say, it was even extremely pleasurable, but I was not out for a heavy makeout session, and the whole thing has left me feeling somewhat dissatisfied (for want of a better word).

Off to bed to try and erase the utter frustration out of my mind ... God, that was his plan all along, wasn't it?! Hold out and she'll come running for more I so don't want to fall into that trap, so women of MNet, give me the strength and wisdom to proclaim loudly that I am too old for sex and games like this!

Or tell me that I am being highly immature and really should appreciate someone wanting to take things slowly. The only thing is I am definitely not out for a meaningful relationship - I simply have an annoying six month old itch that needs to be scratched with nothing less than diamond-strength vigour!

Maybe he realised he couldn't manage to, er, raise the flag-pole successfully a second time?

I must admit, that thought did cross my mind, but he definitely managed to raise it again (though perhaps, may not have been able to raise it all the way)

Wow- you are certainly upfront.

possibilities- one is that maybe he would have felt an idiot saying no when you were so upfront. he shouldn't- but he may have. he also lied about the condoms- which to me says that he possibly intended to change his mind.

he gave you a lot more than you implied by your first post.

When you say "frustrated" do you mean sexually frustrated at lack of penetration- or frustrated that you didn't get what you set out to get?

Was there any chance too that he simply could not manage "Round 2", after the BJ- and didn't feel the need?

I'm sorry but I can't really see what you are asking- other than venting about being, IYO, short changed.

If this was a man posting about a woman who had said yes, then decided no, what do you think people would say?

Maybe, being blunt, he simply does't like you that much in bed.

I think wait and see if he gets in touch again. I suspect it's likely he just thought his performance would be lack-lustre, after round one.

I guess sexually frustrated at the lack of penetration. I understand that not every sexual encounter needs to include/end with that to make it fulfilling - it's just that it would have been great if yesterday's had.

As for not being sexually compatible, that could definitely be a possibility, and that's fine. I don't expect to be sexually compatible with everyone I meet/sleep with - I try to make sure I'm as open as possible with people I sleep with, and it would be nice if they felt that they could do the same.

I'd have no problems with someone telling me that they just didn't think that it would work out sexually - partners I've been with in the past have done that, and I certainly have (in the kindest way possible - I'm not out to decimate anyone's confidence!) I've just never done well with the whole mixed messages thing.

He has texted me since yesterday's encounter and said he'd enjoyed it very much, albeit it had taken him by surprise ( I mean, how much more blatant/explicit could i have been?!), and would like to meet up again.

I just have to decide now whether I want to and, at the moment, I'm not so sure. I'd hate for it to come across as though I'm punishing/playing mind games with him for not getting what I would have liked, but again, I don't want to end up in a situation where (either of our) wires get crossed and/or we end up dissatisfied or feeling we have to do things we don't want to just for the sake of it. I'll probably speak to him about it and see what he thinks - preferably in a non-sexual setting.

Do you think there is any chance that you are being a tad insensitive?

when you wrote this:
He has texted me since yesterday's encounter and said he'd enjoyed it very much, albeit it had taken him by surprise (hmm I mean, how much more blatant/explicit could i have been?!)

the guy met you for lunch; you have bee n friends/colleagues/acquaintances whatever for months. Sex /date was not on his menu.

That's what he meant by a surprise.

You come across as a bit overbearing /domineering TBH- certainly not chilled.

You are still interpretting his "no" as mind games.

Maybe he was flattered, wanted a BJ( or rather couldn't say no once you started on him) BUT does not want to change your friendship into a relationship.

You seem to be assuming that and always putting a "playing games" label on him simply because he is utterly within his rights to say no, take a step back, whatever works for him.

he doesn't owe you anything else and if you psuh or fret you will come over as desperate.

I'm fully aware that he doesn't owe me anything and that it is within his rights to say no. That's his decision and I'll respect it and go along with it. I'm certainly not pushing (although I am probably fretting over it more than it deserves, especially as I made it clear to him at lunch, before we started AND after we finished that I was not looking for anything serious, and he concurred).

It's up to him how far he wants things to go. Whether or not I'm happy to move along at the same pace or not is up to me.

I wouldn't deny that I may be predatory, but I certainly don't hide it. If someone does not want to go along/deal with that, then I'd just prefer that they were as open with me as I am with them.

But I guess we all can't be the same and/or get exactly what we want - that way, boredom lies

Anyway, fun was had, we'll see what (if anything) happens next. One thing I'm certain about though - no more Tsonga straight after sex!

He doesn't like condoms, Eve. That's my diagnosis. He's one of these blokes who suffers immediate willy-wilt on contact with rubber.

"I wouldn't deny that I may be predatory, but I certainly don't hide it. If someone does not want to go along/deal with that, then I'd just prefer that they were as open with me as I am with them."

Maybe though Eve, you are not allowing for people to say one thing whilst feeling another- for a myriad of reasons. or for having a mind change somewhere along the line.

IMO men sometimes say yes, because part of theri brains are telling them they'd be a fool to turn it down when it's offered on a plate- but another prt of their brain is thinking about the emotional fall out /responsibility.

They may have been bitten by women who say they don't want any emotional connection after sex then turn into bunny boilers.

I'd say you need to allow for people's emotions re.. sex to be a bit more complex than they are for you, and they are not consciously game playing- they are just a bit unsure perhaps.

I hope not SCBG, but then again, if that's the case, quite glad we didn't attempt to go down the whole penetration route - I wouldn't have appreciated it turning even more awkward or having him feel embarrassed (not that a mid-sex wilt is anything to be embarrassed about, mind - it happens to the best of us, even those of us that don't have penises!).

I hear what you're saying strawberryjelly. I understand that not everyone may think like I do, and I would never have them think that that is a problem they have to deal with. He was/seemed happy enough at the end of it, and in some ways, so was I. So, again, time will tell. I guess the whole "wanting to take things one step at a time/slowly" worried me because, when people have usually said that to me, it's because they think something more serious will come of it, despite me being explicit as to the contrary. Like I said, I'm probably reading much more into it than I should be, but I won't be ending back up in bed with him again until we have a serious honest conversation about what is is we are both looking for/expecting (which I had thought we had done in the first place, but maybe not as well as I'd thought).

I told him that I found him attractive and wanted to sleep with him.

Perhaps he didnt realise you meant right after lunch... perhaps you were a bit too full on for him..

Most men wouldnt expect a blow job quite so quickly with someone they hadnt even slept with yet...

I think you actually scared the life out of the bloke to be honest...

Well if he is scared of a woman who likes sex and is upfront about it, he's a wuss.

You're overthinking, Eve. Stop it this minute!!

You and he did have sex. I understand what you mean (it doesn't feel 'right' to me without PIV - or, I seem to remember it didn't) but you were in genital contact and you both orgasmed. That's definitely sex! You got two to his one, so he was neither ungenerous nor inconsiderate.

Possibly he doesn't like muff-diving and has, by of compensation, developed his digital prowess (can I have his number?) Possibly he can't come twice in one session. Maybe he hates condoms. Perhaps he was just a bit weirded out and not ready for PIV with you. These questions only matter if you're planning a re-match, when you'll be able to discuss it. It sounds as though he's up for a second run so, if you are too, there's no problem.

No problem, either, if you don't want to go there or to have that conversation.
He's not playing games. Neither are you!

See? No problem :)

eve would just like to say age doesnt enter into it, whatever dates that might lead anywhere the same rule apply as when your a teenager, only now your old enough to know sex is a two way thing not just a guy getting a bj.

My first impression: reading way too much into the situation. Why second guess him. Why not see if he calls again....and then see him again. You were both a little drunk...people do stupid things when drunk.

You did say it was pleasurable and he probably got those vibes from you. You're not out for a meaningful relationship, so just see what he does next.

And NO - NEVER TOO OLD!!!! lol Trust me.

Maybe he has some weird idea that it isn't respectful to penetrate on a first encounter??

He does sound lazy, like he wasn't really out to impress you that much. Hmm, if it was still fun though, why not do it again anyway and see what traspires next time.

But yes, have a proper talk if you are sure you don't want a relationship with him and you fear he may.

I think he was put off by the fact you were carrying condoms with you.

There's a fine line between sexual confidence and sexual aggression, to be honest, and if I were him I'd feel that I couldn't get out of it and remain friends.

That could be true, Imperial. Then again, if it is, I'd find that attitude a bit silly/immature, especially if the same person had mentioned that they had condoms and were happy to have full sex prior to that. It begs the question why I shouldn't have been put off at the fact he had condoms with him at home, but then I wouldn't - I much prefer that someone takes their sexual health seriously enough to know that they wouldn't want to be caught short at inopportune moments (which they should if they are happy to accept someone round to have sex in the first place).

But I'm in agreement with those that say I've been/was over-thinking it. I'll just let the dust settle and leave the ball in his court as to if/when he'd like to meet up again. As for remaining friends, I told him prior to going back to his that I would like to, but I would understand and respect it if he felt that he couldn't.

Oh, and again - we weren't drunk

But Eve you seem to contradict yourself here.

In your earlier post you wrote that he said he had condoms at home- but in fact didn't. You had to use yours.

The more I've read this, the more i feel that this man found the whole experience a bit overwhelming.

If you can try to see it from his perspective:
he was out for what was supposedly a platonic lunch. You asked him for sex. He agreed, possibly because a) he felt he'd be a wuss/fool to turn you down and b) possibly didn't want to offend you.

However, once you had had a roll around in the sack, the non-willy part of his brain started saying "Hang on, this is all a bit fast for me- and where will it be taking us?"

At that stage you were up for more- and he, in more than one way, wasn't.

Maybe you should remember that some guys, even though they want sex and find it flattering to have a woman come on to them, like to feel they are in control of things. I think you took that control away.

And the other point is, even though you say he was still aroused after the BJ, it can take most men several hours to feel ready for another orgasm, if they want it at all.

I think he's been the perfect gent under the circumstances, assuring you he had a good time, but maybe you need to think about whether some men really like the full -on, dominant female bit. I agree with the other poster who said she thinks you frightened the life out of him.

p.s. you talk about sexual health and condoms- but did either of you discuss your sexual histroy before the event?

You might like to take on board that 1:4 people is infected with genital herpes virus- which lies dormant. However, some people carry the active virus which is shed without symptoms. Condoms do not prevent transmission. herpes is a bit like Russian roulette.

There is also the lovely matter of warts.

If you hadn't talked about this kind of sexual history then maybe that was another reason why he didn't want to return the oral sex favours, and was holding back.

That is true, strawberryjelly. We had discussed our sexual history beforehand, including both of us confirming that we'd both been recently tested. We'd had a similar discussion in the past ie well before Friday, but that was around a platonic conversation about finding out about previous partners cheating on us, so we'd already established that we were both in the habit of getting tested on a regular basis (though I guess there's no way to verify if he or I were telling the truth, though I certainly was). Every form of sexual contact carries an inherent risk, so I guess I'm happy to accept some and not others. But the whole carrying a condom thing when expecting the possibility of sex - that's an inherent instinct which I'm not about to give up.

He does like to be in control, and so do I, so that brings us back to the whole sexual incompatibility thing again. That came out from a brief chat we had this morning where he admitted that he'd already thought about the possibility of something happening well before we'd agreed to lunch but that he felt that things were moving too fast for him and that he would like to take things slowly. I've reiterated that I'm happy to do this, but that he should have no illusions to the fact I'm not after anything serious. He apparently feels the same, and asked if I'd like to meet up again this week. I've agreed to dinner, but have made it clear that it does not have to lead to sex (given that we both enjoy each other's company in a non-sexual context as well). I don't think it will prove awkward, but time will tell. He is lovely really, but we may just have to accept we're after different things.

Either way, I think we'll withstand the events of Friday, whether as just friends or "friends with benefits".

Nice you've had a chat and cleared the air, so hope it all goes well from now on.

I think that you should say to yourself and maybe to him, that there is to be no rompey pompey this time...just enjoy each other's company; sexual bonding can wait a little longer?

Tdada. Bollocks to that, they are not teenagers, they both enjoyed having sex and have both discussed the fact that they are not looking for commitment, so promising each other that they'll keep their hands on their hapennies next time is a bit pointless and wierd.

TDada...thought it was rumpy pumpy! Or maybe that's just me!