Is it me or my mother? What have I done wrong? Can it be fixed?

[shelfy74]

Just read the thread re narcissistic mothers and wondered what you would all make of my mum? My gorgeous son is now 7 weeks old. From the start mum hasn't been as interested in this baby as she was my first, now nearly 3. For example she knitted for my first and said she was too busy (she works 4 hours a week) to knit anything for the new baby. She hasn't bought anything for the baby except a shorts and t shirt set yet my first son was showered with gifts.

Mum and dad live 50 mins drive away, it's about 30 miles. Dad is 82 and developing dementia over past few years. She has just turned 70 but is fit and well, very active. I am their only child and there were arguments some years back just after my first son was born about dad driving as he has visual hallucinations. Mum said she felt unsafe with him driving too. Eventually it was agreed he wouldn't drive distances anymore and since then they have barely visited. They have been on bus about 4 times in the past 2 years but this takes 3 hours each way so its not practical. There is a train route but they won't entertain coming this way, I'm not sure why but suspect its because they have a free bus pass but would have to pay for the train. Mum can drive but refuses to drive here as the most direct way involves a short stretch of motorway which she won't drive on. There are several other non motorway routes but she won't try them despite me offering to accompany her, have her follow me etc. So basically she says that she lives too far away to come to me.

When I was pregnant for the second time my biggest worry was who would care for my son when I was in labour. I asked mum. She said she'd come and I spoke about getting a taxi arranged and prepaid etc for her. However nearer the time she said she didn't think she could leave my dad and I should make other arrangements. I was really hurt and struggled to make these I think mainly because I felt this should have been my mums role. But I did arrange for friend to take him.

Anyway to cut a long story short my labour was horrendous, 69 hours culminating in an emergency c section. I lost 2 litres of blood and was very unwell. My childcare arrangements were a disaster as I had only expected at most to need 1 overnight, although friends helped massively mum never offered to come.

My partner obviously rang my mum following the birth to tell her she had a new grandchild and she said she and Dad would visit in 2 days time, not the next day as she had to work (she is a self employed yoga teacher, she runs a 2 hour class). At this point DP had words with her, he felt strongly she should cancel work given how poorly I was (and that she had a new grandson) but she refused. Anyway the next day she got my dad to ring my DP to say it wasn't worth coming for 1 hour (hospital visiting hours). Another row ensued and eventually they turned up the next day having got a lift with friends of theirs. This was a very strained visit, I was pretty much off my head on painkillers and still in bed on drips / catheter etc. She didn't even bring me a bunch of flowers or anything.

Because my son then became unwell with severe jaundice we were in hospital for 9 days after the birth. They didn't visit again.

On return home again no visit was arranged however this was academic because within 2 days my son was back in hospital this time with bronchiolitis. This was terrifying and he ended up on a ventilator (cpap machine) and in hospital for a further 9 days. On top of this I was not recovering well from surgery and had a wound infection. It may sound dramatic now but at the time I thought my baby might die. Also we had major problems with sorting childcare for my older son so we could both be at the hospital. After me explicitly begging her, my mum came for 1 night, driven by friends, and again made it clear she would have to return to go to work and care for my dad (though she happily leaves him for several hours most days to go shopping). She said she couldn't let her class down and needed the money. Money is not an issue for them she has since purchased a brand new car. She looked after my son but expressed little or no concern re the new baby or how I was coping.

Thankfully we are all home and recovered now. Up until today I haven't been able to drive following my section and I'm still sore. I have really wanted what everyone else seems to have; a mum to come and mother me through this awful time. I've been don, in pain, emotionally exhausted, arguing with DP and unable to keep on top of a house, toddler and new baby. I have told her I am struggling, she just says things will get better. A few times she has commented she wished I lived nearer so she could help.

We have been over to mums once with the kids, I felt pressure to go as they hadn't really met their new grandson. She hasn't been here again. She is putting some pressure for me to visit again, making comments like she doesnt know what the baby looks like but she hasn't made any offer to come here.

Am I being unreasonable to feel it's her duty to come to me? When my older son was born I drove over weekly so they could see him and the same is clearly expected now. She doesn't seem to realise (or care?) what I have been through physically or emotionally.

I think that she just doesn't love me and isn't interested in her new grandson. This is unbelievably hurtful and I am consumed with turning it over in my head again and again, wondering if I have done something to cause it, if I could do something to fix it, to give me a mum like everyone else seems to have. I needed a mum over the past few weeks.

What do other people think?

Gosh I don't think your mum is toxic at all... may be stressed out with your DH (and the yoga class is perhaps her lifeline?) and plenty of older people won't risk a motorway where their reactions have to be that bit sharper.

I know you've been through the mill OP, and I wish you a speedy recovery, but your first post does sound a bit self-justifying. May be you need to adjust to you being the one to do the caring primarily now?

You may still not know the real score about your dad... lots of older people take the tack 'least said soonest mended' and your mum may have been trying to avoid off loading all her worries on to you when she knew you were/are vulnerable?

Sounds to me like you may need to offer some generosity of heart to your mum and see what comes of that.

Sorry... not DH ... DF

Hi forkful, thank you, I will look up that book. Yes, my DP is doing his share, my older one still goes to nursery 3 days per week (same as before I went on maternity leave) so in terms of actual help, now I am all healed and the baby is thankfully well and at home, I am coping just fine. I never expected practical help for day to day things, I am a grown up and knew what work another baby would bring. I just felt let down that at a time when my newborn baby was very ill in hospital and I was struggling (and failing) to recover from a 69 hour labour, emergency CS and 2 litres of blood lost, my mother, a fit and active woman who has no problems at all pursuing any of her own interests in her own terms, did not come here to support me or DS1. I am really surprised by the overwhelming view that this was reasonable, my friends in RL have been unaminously shocked and my GP and HV as well as nursing staff at the hospital when my son was in all asked if my family would be coming to help / support me and I felt I had to make excuses for why my mum wasn't there.

In terms of a typical visit, I have been over 3 times since the OP. My mum is always pleased to see DS1, and fusses over DS2 but not as much. She plays with DS1, provides lunch, and generally keeps conversation focussed on DS1. Nothing really of any significance occurs when I am over there, except the complete lack of cogniscence as to the effort involved in getting me, toddler, new baby and all equipment packed into car and driven over, esp as I have been up several times in night! (I think people forget quite quickly what that is like though so not making a deal of this).

Are you sure the macular degeneration explains your father's illness? My mum has had / still has it and it begins v quickly. My mum was told it is an illness which comes on quickly - getting to the optician is essentially for preserving as much sight as possible. You describe your father as being ill for several years which sound potentially like something else in addition to the degeneration.

Also as my parents have had health issues over the last couple of years I have noticed their confidence in travelling, leaving home for anything, getting out of their usual routine more difficult.

Balloonslayer's post does sound like it might be playing a part also especially given what you have said about her comments during your pregnancy.

It could also be that she was hoping to rely on you for help as your father aged - 12 years age difference means it's more likely she will be a widow - and that a new baby and both your resulting health issues have made her realise this may not be possible. Now she is in her twilight years that decision to only have one child may be playing on her mind a lot.

Pickgo - I doubt my mum has been trying to avoid offloading worries - she has had a sore toe recently and made several calls to me to express the view it was probably bone cancer. It's a bunion. Self justifying, how? I think you are right, its clear I will have to do the caring now.

Choux, no I am not sure the macular degerenation explains his illness, I think there are symptoms of dementia, however I have to accept what the hospital said, that the whole seeing things is entirely down to the macular degeneration. My mum was complaining on a daily basis that my dad was seeing / doing strange things, now, following the eye appt she just says that things are much better "now we know theres nothing wrong with him" and apparently all of these symptoms have stopped overnight. FWIW when I speak to my dad on the phone (he's never keen to talk on the phone) he is always lucid if a bit slow. When we go over it is clear physically he is slowing down, and he does have perception problems and is often focussed in the past, but I have not witnessed difficult behaviour / confusion to any great degree (and prior to having the baby I was over for probably a day a week). I do think there is a lot in what Balloonslayer said.

Don't want to be critical OP and add to your woes in any way... but you are obviously aware that your mum and dad have quite a hefty portion of problems on their own plates - none of which are going away, in fact they are likely to become worse over time.
Whilst I know you have been through an awful time with the birth and afterwards, you will recover and move on with the support of your DH too.
Your mum OTH will be facing what can only be a detriorating future, and, practicalities aside, that takes a lot of emotional strength to bear.
The reluctance to abandon her yoga class might indicate that that is central to her keeping her head above water at the mo.
Perhaps she is doing what she has to do just to keep going?

"I have really wanted what everyone else seems to have; a mum to come and mother me through this awful time."

hear hear - it's what every one expects, and deserves.

Mine didn't come either - and actually told me she would drive me home from the hospital -(3 day labour and eventual crash section, with massive blood loss) but at last minute rang up to say that she wasn't coming in to town, that she wasn't feeling up to it, and I could make my own way. How's that for a narc?

I walked home, and carried my babe. I will never forgive her for betraying my trust and abandoning me.

Some daughters do have 'em.

You Mum is a selfish bitch - actually I think you know that? She sounds madly jealous you have two, and she 'only' had one - is she competitive in other ways also?
Oh and yes, my "mum" was also full of shit about her pain etc when i was in such agony post section... ahhh.. classic... brings it all back. BTW Are you my sister??? We do sound like we have the same narc mum.

Congratulations by the way on your lovely family. I wish you nothing but the best, you deserve it. You can break the cycle.

Yes, I can see that things will likely get better for me and worse for her, and it is useful to remember that to keep some perspective. However I have been so so hurt by her inability or unwillingness to offer support on this occasion that I don't know what I can do to move on. I don't feel I can discuss the matter with her, she doesnt "do" discussing issues, she becomes defensive and angry immediately. My mum doesn't have any other support because she hasn't maintained any friendships (she tends to fall out with others over silly things, for example she no longer speaks to her only longstanding female friend because the friend developed another friendship after being widowed). She has alienated herself from the rest of her family too following her behaviour when my gran died (but thats another story), so all of her concerns re my Dad are on me. When she was here for that one night when my son was on CPAP she was worrying at breakfast on the phone to my dad about the possibility he might be constipated and clearly expected me to join in with this concern / talk to my dad in all seriousness about it (because he hadn't been in 24 hours). FGS my newborn was in a HDU and I was desperate to get back to the hospital. Actually, having just read that back I've had a bit of a lightbulb moment wondering why on earth I would think someone who conducts their life like this would be able to properly support me through what happened?!

Dorje - thank you. And at you walking home with your babe; you might be my sister but if you were I'm sure my mother would have rung me up by now to complain about you expecting a lift back from the hospital

She's not there for you Shelfy.
It's shit when you realise that, but liberating also, cos the time is your own now, you don't have to hope anymore that she'll snap out of it and function normally. And you deserve better than wasting you time holding your breath, wishing on a star.

In my experience, my mum is a victim of a victim, so I just draw the line and keep myself to myself wrt her. She'll never change.

I have built a support structure for myself that doesn't include her - and it works.
I don't listen to her whinging about her health etc etc, just humm noncommittally, and meet up only minimally - I time phone calls and when she starts bitching about anyone I just say gotta go!

And that way I have time for the people in my life who mean something special to me and my mumsnet habit, of course!!

Its a way to travel by public transport when you are there age, I feel you expect too much.

Sorry but I do.

They are not young they are old.

Maybe her dad can be described as old, but her mum is old at 70? Unless there are specific age-related problems such as arthritis or dementia then I'm not sure that 70 CAN be described as old these days in the way that a 70 year old was, say, 20 years ago. You do realise most of us on here will be having to work almost till up to that age?

I don't think you can underestimate how quickly people can go downhill healthwise after the age of 70. It isn't just health either, it's confidence, mobility, memory - all sorts start to degenerate. I live with my mother who is now 82. She can still clamber around the rockery bent double doing weeding, but is also very forgetful and has lots of health problems she downplays or tries to hide from us.

OP, you mum may have been able to help out with your 1st child, and understandably you expected the same level of support this time round. But just because she's still teaching yoga at 70 doesn't mean she hasn't lost her nerve behind the wheel of a car. And your mum has probably been shielding you from the full extent of your father's condition. Elderly parents DO still try to protect their DC even when the "kids" are middle-aged parents themselves. When you don't see you parents that often (which has sadly become the case for you) you REALLY can't know what is going on with them, and what they are or are no longer capable of coping with.

You must be feeling very tired and hormonal right now. There is no point in trying to second guess what is happening with your parents- they would probably be very upset to know you feel so let down. Just concentrate on getting you strength back and enjoying your new baby.

Just to add - my mother spent ONE afternoon caring for 3 year old DS when she was 71. After 4 hours, they both flaked out on the bed and fell asleep completely exhausted.

I came home (at only 5.00pm) to find Aged Mama totally sparko unconcious lying horizontal across the bed, with DS crashed out on top of her.

I thought it was funny at the time, but later felt very angry when a friend suggested that I (as a newly single parent ) should leave DS with mum to go back to work. There is NO WAY she could have coped. My friends own DM had cared for her DC when she was in her late 50s/early 60s, but had no understanding how hard it is for older people to care for very young DC. It isn't lack of love - it's just too tiring.

{Totally off topic, I know, OP, but it's got me thinking):

If that really is the case for most people, MrsFlittersnoop, it's quite a thought, then, to consider the amount of childcare that grandparents carry out free of charge at the moment - I wonder how many are actually 70+? If the age at which women give birth to their first child continues to rise then by the time our OWN children become parents then we ourselves are possibly going to be 70+. I wonder how that will then impact on nursery provision etc.

(just pondering.....)

Interesting. I was 35 when Ds was born - DSIL was 38 and 40 when she had her DC . And they live in Australia.

DM is 82. ExDP (DS's DF) is 61. I am 50. DH is 45. All other significant family are dead. Or utterly disabled/ estranged/ demented.

We are all old VV old.