we now live apart, what now?

[winnie]

Dh and I "separated" in April. It had been coming for a while although it happened in unpleasant circumstances and dh instigated it. Since we have been living separately we've remained a couple. The children have been fine with this (as far as I can tell). In fact ds has learnt that he can use this to his advantage!
When dh moved out it was a 'temporary' arrangement. He'd been looking to move out behind my back and I found out accidentally so tbh I expected him to finish the relationship with in a short space of time having moved out. Since then we have bounced from ok to bad and back again and have even had some time of feeling positive. We've been going to relate and we now get regular time together but imo nothing has changed. I still, months later, feel insecure, taken for granted and unloved - well, not unloved but no longer loved in the way he once loved me. Maybe that is the point. Dh has decided he wants us to remain in seperate homes (for the foreseeable future) and I just feel hurt and unable to move on. Living separately functions practically (I was a single mum for a long time previously). However, emotionally, I am a mess.I constantly analyse everything which is emotionally hard work for both of us. DH says he loves me & I do love him. but it's just not the same as it was and what relate has shown me is that if there are things that dh can no longer give me that I need then we are going no where and I need to end it in order to move on. The thought of him not being in my life just feels so sad and so wrong. I feel like I am losing my best friend (hence why I am on here rather than talking to rl friends). I don't want to imagine it but we can't go on like this. I have told him that if things don't change that is it. We talk regularly and dh has said that he doesn't want to lose me but doesn't know that he can do the things I am asking of him. I don't think I am being unreasonable. Friends and family largely think he wants his cake and eat it and think - generally - I should have dumped him months/years ago. Any advice would be appreciated.

Sorry to hear your troubles winnie, I don't have much advice to give but hopefully someone else will have. Fwiw sounds a bit like you need some definition. You are splitting up one minute but the next there is some hope, your friends and family may be right about the cake and eating it

From your post I'd say your friends and family are probably right. I think you need to end it and move on.

I'm so sorry I know it's easy advice to give but not to follow.

(hugs to you, i really hope you feel better soon)

Oh goodness Winnie I really am so terribly sorry to read this. I noticed you were around and was about to post on another thread asking how things were.
I've got no advice based on personal experience but your post here reminds me all too well that strong relationships with two good people in them can still come badly adrift.
Your friends and family are being pretty forthright from the looks of things. Was their opinion of your dh sought, or did they give it unasked ?
And, please forgive me if I'm being unhelpful here, but does your mum's grave illness have any role in this crisis in your relationship? Is she still alive? Please forgive me if you posted to say she has died, Mumsnet is so big these days it can be hard to catch up. But I well remember you posting that she had a terminal diagnosis.
I wish I could say something more helpful. I am so sad for you and dd and ds

Marina, thank you for your kind words.
Yes, a strong relationship gone badly wrong
In answer to your questions firstly, and most importantly, Mum is still - against the odds - with us. She suffers terribly and it ahs been touch and go on more than one occassion but she's still here & remains fighting which is amazing.

As to advice from family (definitely not asked for) and as for friends they mainly are sad that something so good has gone so wrong and admire (I think)our ability to keep trying but one friend particularly thinks I should move on and a couple of others, less vocally, are astounded I am still here but understand why.

I think just writing has helped me see something I haven't seen before today and that is that I do still feel loved by dh and until today, until writing this down I didn't.

I suppose the question is, can I live with this?

Carmenere & Passionkiller thanks for your comments. They don't surprise me

Winnie, why doesn't he want you to live together? What is it that he doesn't feel able to give? Sorry to be so pointed, but I'm trying to understand your situation a bit more.

Bugsy, both of us have proved to be better at organising our lives and finances apart and as we had huge issues over money (we deal with money very differently) I have to admit it feels easier not living together.
As far as giving thats harder to answer and I will get back to that when I've picked ds up from school.

Returning to your question Bugsy, the other reason he doesn't want us to move back in together is my lack of faith & my doubt. If I am honest I have to agree that whilst I still have reservations it would be ridiculous our moving back in together. I suppose even though I know it is not the right thing for us to be doing as a couple I still want him to want us to be living together No wonder he says he can't win

In answer to what he doesn't feel able to give; as much time together as I would like; the romantic/demonstrative elements that he was so good at once. And fundamentally he doesn't give me any sense of commitment/security that we just seemed to share before. This is probably one of the things I feel most acutely. I find it very difficult being married but taking it a day at a time. I suppose, thinking aloud, that means I need to get him and I to plan things for us for the future and maybe that would, at least, give us a sense of having a future together.

Hi Winnie
Sorry to hear of your situation. Everything you say sounds really understandable, and seems like an emotional reaction to the pain of losing something you have invested in. You said in your first post that moving on seemed "wrong" - i think that many changes initially feel wrong, simply because they are not what you are used to. They only come to feel ok when you've got used to them. It is not for me to say what you should do, but sounds like Relate is giving you a chance to view your own situation from a slightly different perspective, which can be useful. Having expectations is both good and bad isn't it? Good because it's nice to aspire to things, but bad because of the pain when they are not met. It is a slow process to shift your expectations, and that may not be what you want to do. But hanging on to illusions is very soul destroying.

Sorry I can't say anything really useful. Just wanted to say that I hope you can keep going, as eventually things are bound to become clearer.

Gosh Winnie, there certainly are alot of areas here where you either don't overlap or you seem to have conflicting goals/ideas. My own view would be that if he can't offer you the type of relationship that you want and he has openly said that - then you are best to move on. I think that probably the only way it will be possible to do this is to reduce or eliminate contact with him. Never easy in the short-term but may well be worth it long-term.

I'm so sorry to read about this winnie. Had also been pleased when noticed your name. Can I just ask, why was he planning, behind your back, on moving out? Hope this isn't too blunt but is there anyone else involved?

Thank you everyone for your thoughts. My dilemma is I agree with all of you. I have been putting off making a decision because I have so much going on in my life and I am incredibly stressed but I also know that I won't move on unless we break up "properly" or I learn to accept this new arrangement and also accept the fact that although I realise he does love me he does not show it in the way he once did. Tinker in answer to your question, no, there was no one else involved.

I wish I felt brave enough and strong enough to say 'thats it' and see where that leads me/us

Winnie, would your life be any worse if you said "No more - that's it"?

Bugsy, I can say without a doubt that my life would be worse if I said "no more - that's it"... there are very good things that I do get from dh.

Hmmmm, ok. If you were formally separated or divorced and still had a degree of contact - would that be easier for your head & heart to cope with?

If we become formally separated or divorced I am going to need a long time without contact before I will be able to even face him. Envisage a life of handing ds backwards and forwards through a mediator - which sounds pathetic DH has said that there is no point in our splitting up as we'd be back together within a few days as we are incapable of living without each other.

You see I really am going around and around in circles.

Oh dear Winnie, I really don't have any bright ideas. Your situation sounds very stressful, not one thing or the other. The only thing I can think of is to keep at it with Relate.
Sorry not to be more help.

Well, the decision was made for me. He has put an end to our marriage tonight. Feel inconsolable. am dreading dd getting in. I just want to curl up in a ball... Thankfully ds is fast asleep. How bizarre to come on here and announce it to the world when I can't face my friends and family. Mum went back into hospital today. I just feel so alone and such a failure. Told my friend today that I had no regrets and I am glad we married as we married for all of the right reasons but wonder tonight how I ever believed in him or us I just feel so heartbroken, so let down and such a fool.

I haven't slept... I just feel physically sick and can't stop crying. I don't know how I shall bear this

Oh Winnie. I'm so sorry to hear of your hurt. I don't know if I can offer any advice, but I just wanted you to know that there's someone here at the moment and that they're thinking of you.

Winnie I am so sorry to hear that the situation with dh has deteriorated so much. Especially coming on top of your mum being admitted to hospital.

You have so much to contend with at the moment but one thing I am certain of is that you are not a failure. Please don't think that.

I don't really have any great advice for you, but be sure to look after yourself, I know you have many friends on here and hope that will help you to feel less alone.x

So sorry to hear this Winnie, you must be devastated. What made him finally make that decision?

Try to keep strong, hugs to you.

Thanks Pindy,Pollylogos, & Pinotgrigio. In answer to your question Pindy who knows? He is just full of contradictions. Can't eat or sleep, am worrying about the latest complications with Mum, have a very big day workwise tomorrow and am moving soon and all I actually want to do is curl up in a ball and cry!

winnie sending you loads of hugs
thinking of you
xxx

Oh Winnie I am really sorry to hear this. It is an awful feeling I know like you have run head first into an oncoming train. Physical pain in your stomach. I am sending you a big