My life is a huge mess!

[scouserabroad]

This might end up being longer than War and Peace quite long, sorry. And thank you if you read it. :) I have posted about Dh before a while back under a different name but can't find the thread anymore. We have been together 7 years, married for 5, two DC aged 3 and 4.5.

Basically he has been verbally aggressive in the past, and threatened violence although he never went through with it though it came damn close a number of times. He stopped the threatening behaviour when I stood up to him.

He always said that he behaved badly because he didn't like his job, and now that he has changed jobs it will be OK, and it mostly has been OK, for the last 18 months or so. The thing is, whenever there is a problem in his life he takes it out on me, or starts the silent treatment. Obviously I can't solve all his problems but I would try to help if I could.

Now, I think he just doesn't love me anymore. He never wants us to do anything together, all he wants to do in his spare time is sit at home and look at the TV. I like TV as much as the next person but I would love to go out somewhere too. He refuses, and doesn't want me going out with friends either. I'm not trying to force him into going clubbing or anything, I'm open to suggestions of what we could do.

I know from experience that if I do go for a night out he kicks off (I did not come home very late / pissed or anything). I do go to an evening class and he doesn't mind that.

He does take the DC to the park etc. but doesn't want me to go with them. If I ask he just says no, and if I push it he says to leave him the fuck alone.

He is still interested in sex, but I am starting to feel worse and worse about it because it seems to be the only thing he likes about me.

Sometimes I get upset about all of this and then he says he does love me and why do I think he married me in the first place? He is totally against separation although if he's in a mood he does sometimes threaten to leave.

He is my first and only long term relationship and I have nothing to compare this to. I moved abroad to be with him and now my life is here but I feel very alone right now. I suppose that would be the case no matter where we were.

I am unemployed at the moment and I think that's making it all worse because I have too much time to sit on my own moping thinking. I am torn between feeling like I've been a prize doormat and partly that he has actually improved and I should count my blessings and just get on with it. Plus he has a nice side too and if he wanted he could be like that more often.

Life might be like this for another 20 years or even forever and I can't face that.

I don't get the racist idea (unless it somehow resonates with the op) - I think he's left the marriage.

My dh is very similar and it means that ds is being brought up in a seperated household. It's only just ocurred to me. Any family days are organised by me but anything else he either won't participate or will take ds out and I'm clearly not invited. I've told him this but he doesn't get it.

I'm in my home country but dh is from overseas and I do wonder that we've drifted apart and now he's missing home (or his culture) and I don't remind him of home on any level. He also tries to replicate his home country here and that just doesn't work (for me at least).
You sound miserable. You haven't been home and in part as when you were thinking of travelling he gave up his job and you decided that with lack of funds a trip wasn't in order at that time - a time when he gave up his job.

Perhaps you're due a break to see your folks and some time apart where you can concentrate your thoughts on you and your future.

giveitago i do suspect that some sort of misplaced feeling of shame may be at work here. Not necessarily a colour of skin thing, but some sort of dilution of cultural identity issue.

the central theme here seems to be an unwillingness to be seen in public with the OP.

it's obviously out of order but i wouldn't rule it out unless of course OP is positive that it is not a factor.

scouser hang in there, you're a brave woman and you will come out at the other end i have no doubt.

just me then that reckons he has other woman/women ?

AF - can't rule out other women either.

Lots more posts... Thank you all so much, writing things down is helping me make sense of my thoughts.

Anyfucker: I don?t think that there are other women, he is too religious and wouldn?t do anything so blatantly against Islam. I feel as though I don?t know him sometimes, but his faith is the one thing I?m sure of.

BellaMagnificat: He is Muslim, and I follow all the 'lifestyle' rules, IYSWM. No alcohol, no pork, no male friends, etc. I think Dh takes all this for granted tbh. Once I went out for a drink (of cola for me!) with a people from work, and he went nuts, 'You are MY wife and you were out with other men? I don't want my wife behaving like a dirty whore!' Then I said 'I don't want MY Dh talking like a member of the Taliban!' and that's when he tried to punch me. Then I backed right down and apologised. The DC were not present during this sorry episode, luckily. He has calmed down a lot since then but rather pathetically, I never did go on another night out.

I spent three months with his family in Algeria just after we were married and have some understanding of his culture, he introduced me to his family and friends over there, he wasn?t ashamed then. I understand how men & women live quite separate lives, but even MIL & FIL go out for picnics together! I get on with his family and did think of talking to them when Dh was being aggressive, but there?s nothing they can physically do and I?m not sure what they?d say or think anyway.

I am 28 and he is nearly 35. I don?t think age is an issue as I was his first proper relationship too although he has had time to ?live? more, as I got married straight after uni and he was nearly 30 by then.

Queenstromba: He is very strict with the DC, they don?t put a foot out of line when they are with him, but he is not abusive with them. They are always happy to see him, when they see his car arrive they run to the front door and wait for him.

Giveitago : I do think it must be difficult for him being in a different culture. Does your Dh go home at all? Mine won?t, he says he isn?t going until he?s ?made it? in Europe. I don?t understand his outlook, and neither do his family apparently, as they keep asking when he?s going to visit.

This is all so difficult, I know that he is a good person, it's just that his inner wanker has well and truly taken over. I have decided to write him a letter, it will be easier to get my point across.

Sorry I have just written another essay!

Forgot to say that I don't think he's racist, but religion is definitely an issue. I think he'd feel better about me if I became a Muslim, but I have read the Quran and some of the Hadith and don't want to convert right at the moment.

his inner wanker is now an outer wanker also

'You are MY wife and you were out with other men? I don't want my wife behaving like a dirty whore!'

Scouser - that seems terribly unreasonable of him, at least to me. Are your DCs going to be subject to such stringent rules when they grow up too?

Oh dear, while I might have been wrong about the race issue, the problem is worse: you've got a partner who uses his imaginary friend to justify his abuse of you. While there are plenty of religious believers who manage not to use their beliefs as a way of bullying other people, and in whom belief in gods is a harmless quirk, there are far, far more who conveniently forget all the stuff about being kind and fair and focus in on the stuff about Great Pumpkin having told them that men are superior to women and women must just suck it up and do as they are told (or indeed the stuff about gaybashing and killing infidels).
HOnestly, this relationship is doomed. He's a bully and a selfish prick and in his opinion you are a 'woman' and therefore not a person and he feels entitled to bully, punish and control you.

ha ha jasper!

I know it's not the same exactly, but there are similarities in culture.

'H' is egyptian. When we lived there, I never used to go out at all, followed all the 'rules' and a few more made up on the spot.

My H is not very religious at all, does drink, but no pork, no praying in spite of the immense pressure to do so by his 'peers'

I know you think he may not be with other women, but you do know that it's his 'right' to have 4....

And (got in trouble for wrongly phrasing this before so I'll be more careful this time) Foreign wives of muslims can sometimes not be viewed too well by some muslim women, in that they are easily dispensed with, she is giving him papers money etc and then he will be free to marry a proper muslim woman, or so they think, and therefore some of them feel utterly entitled to make extremely overt plays for MM, if he is married to a woman from outside the faith/nationality. So don't rule it out entirely.

'H' also is not bothered by anything to do with us. You made a comment about him taking it for granted about you following HIS rules etc, but this IMHO is where my 'H' and I went wrong.

We are splitting, he frequently says how did it get to his, I say ask yourself. I adored him, worshipped him, my heart skipped a beat when he came in the room. After the years of him taking us for granted, ruling me like a tyrant, when his key turned in the lock I felt sick with fear. From one extreme to the other in 6 or 7 years?

I could understand his insistence for you to adhere to his 'rules' if you were living in Algeria. (understand but not agree with IYKWIM..) You are in France though FGS.

I think a conversation needs to be had and you need to remind him that you follow all these rules, not because he tells you to, not because it is the way of the land you are living in but only out of respect for him.

If he were to start TELLING you how to live, then there would be a problem. You are living in a liberal european country and have equal rights and opportunities enshrined in law.

You are entitled, as all of your neighbours and fellow french citizens to go where you want, do what you want within reason and that is fine. You make the choices you do, out of respect for him and as such he ought to be a little more appreciative of the limits placed on your life that being with him have made a part of your every day.

He needs reminding that you have a choice of where and how you live, and you choose to live with him because you love him, you respect him and want to be with him.

If he can not trust you to allow you to make your own decisions, can not show you and your family that he is a keen father and husband who cares passionately about everyone's happiness and well-being, then tbh he is not much of a friend, let alone a partner.

FWIW, you converting would probably STILL not be good enough... you'd be forever made to feel as if you are playing catch up islam.

I've met a ton of converts in Egypt and competitive islam is just mad at times.

Come back to the UK for a while, get your head together. I fear you have lived like this for so long you are almost used to it, institutionalised, and have forgotten what living freely IS.

Interesting comment about not visiting his family until he has 'made it' in Europe. So he does not see himself as having made it yet, which could be a big source of disappointment and loss of self-confidence. And he hated his job until changing it (18 months ago?). And all he wants to do in his spare time is sit at home and look at the TV.

It doesn't excuse his shitty behaviour, but could he be depressed? Hating my job did it for me, and I wasn't pressuring myself to 'make it'.

Pinecones: It seemed outrageous to me at the time, and he knows he shouldn't have spoken to me like that. I worry about what will happen when the DDs are teenagers, but the eldest is only 4 and I will make sure that we are not still in this situation ten years from now.

The thing is he would never in a million years speak to anyone else like this, only to me. At one point his brother was asking for a huge gift of money loan (equivalent to a year's salary) and MIL & SIL were putting pressure on Dh to give him the money. Dh never told them 'No' but bent over backwards to explain why he couldn't afford it. The whole couple of weeks this lasted he was awful to me, shouting and swearing and didn't even explain until later why he had been so angry.

I suspect he might be depressed but he says not, and refuses to see a doctor or read about it online or anything. I have tried talking about it but it has reached the point where I just want to leave him to it, tbh. I know that sounds harsh.

Littlemisshissyfit : I am sorry to hear that you are splitting up with your H. Was he always against you going out, or was it a gradual thing? My H has always been religious but he used to be respectful of the fact that I am not Muslim. I am happy about some parts of the 'rules' but I don't like the way he unilaterally decides things and I don't have a say. He was not like this before we got married, it has come gradually over the last few years.

I know about the four wives but I don't think he would. His grandfather had two wives and there have been problems within his family ever since!

No, we lived in London for 5yrs before going to his country. When we got there, literally he changed the same night as the bags were being brought up.

Different even to how he had been when we had visited on holiday.

H never wanted me to convert, never mentioned it, at one time he might have been accepting of that, but for the last 5 or so years has been dead against it.

My serious worry with you scouser is that he is no longer as respectful of you NOT being a muslim.

My cod theory on this is that as people get older, they get more circumspect in general, and naturally start to think of death and therefore religion Add to this over the last few years the heat has been turned up in islam again generally. there is more pressure for muslims to unite, more discussion of discrimination both by and against muslims.

As the heat has been increased, believers would be more active/vocal in their practice, which could be why you are getting some kind of shift in respect WRT your religion.

Taking decisions for you is another aspect of their upbringing, clamping down again is either him following what HIS parents did, or as he grows older he gets less tolerant.

You need a break love. You need to re-evaluate. He has changed. He will continue to head on this path too. You need to be involved in decisions. You have EQUAL say. You are not even in a muslim country and it sounds like you are on the way to living inside a muslim dictated marriage. Obviously I can't recommend that.

I honestly don't know how I got through it. weeks and weeks of not being taken out, and not even leaving the flat. Was not even allowed to be seen on the balcony.

The longest stint was 10 weeks, and even then the exit was only because I had to be rushed to hospital with a very active MC. I have no idea how long I'd have been cooped up if it weren't for the MC. Probably another 2m, until we moved to the flat we bought in another more cosmopolitan part of town.

OK so this wouldn't happen to you, as you have a job and NEED to leave the house, but my 'H' had lived in London for 10 years before I met him, so he knew the score and still reverted to the demanding, dictatorial tyrant the minute I placed my life into his hands. It's this aspect that killed it for us, I lost the trust I had for him to look after me, he had the chance and he misused his power abominably.

"I know that he is a good person, it's just that his inner wanker has well and truly taken over."

That's what I said about my ex for a long while. He was Dr Jekyll and Mr Hyde, and if I could just love him enough and get him to see the light, he'd be the good version forever. Ha. That's why Lundy Bancroft is such a good read - he makes it clear that your ex is choosing to be like this because it is to his advantage. He showed his temper and got you to stop going out in the evenings, didn't he? It's a strategy.

He's using you as a whipping boy when he's not happy with his life. If he didn't have you, he'd have to get a dog to kick (okay, metaphorically, I know Muslims generally don't keep dogs as pets).

My ex is also from a different culture (Horn of Africa) and I spent a lot of time wondering if he would treat a woman from his culture the way he treated me. Now all I think is more fool her if she put up with it.

What LMHF said. Every word :o

LittleMissHissyFit:

I'm sorry to hear about the problems you've had - good for you for getting out of it though. This is exactly why I wouldn't even consider going out with an African or Middle Eastern man - you hear all to many stories of them being sweetness and light up until you've fully committed yourself to them and they turn into a completely different man.

QS: Whilst I would personally run at high speed from anyone that hailed from that neck of the woods, due to my traumatic experiences, and I do understand why you said what you said in some way, I am so not going to be able to endorse your comment. I got accused of generalisation and racism for less only a few weeks ago...

My best friend is married to a an Egyptian Christian he is challenging, as 99.9% of men are, and the nationality does add a certain mish arf ee (Egyptian for je ne sais quoi ) but he is broadly a fabulous dad, a great H and is fully supportive of her. He does pitch in, OK so he tells her how lucky she is that he does, but he does do it...

She has a car, a driver and can come and go as she pleases. (Her MIL has massive issues with this, but her H doesn't listen)

There are good men, as there are good egyptians. I would put her H in both these camps, but sadly I am stumped for other examples to be able to give you...

Also Queen, it's not just African/ME men that change after marriage, this forum is full of examples.

The issue here is societal acceptance of the womens lesser role, and the lack of power/equality she has in general. So Where as not all men out there are abusers, the actual familial set up is IMHO akin to societal abuse, life there is pretty much depression personified IME. Fun is not really encouraged, enjoyment is usually curtailed or just plain f*cked up as soon as someone realises that there is someone enjoying themselves.

Hope you have a hard hat about your person QueenStromba... that comment of yours might get you into a bit of a ruck... [meant with love]

I probably didn't express myself very well there. The way I see it is that British men are misogynistic enough even though we are a supposedly equal society so why take on the extra risk of being with a man from a culture where the idea that a woman is the property of her husband is ingrained? I am in no way saying that I think that every African or Middle Eastern man is going to change the second he gets married or that western men don't change after marriage.

where is "egyptianprincess" now, eh, LMHF ?

AF... to be honest I was scared she'd come out... hence my (vom) defence post....

I actually think she posts under another name as well, but I dunno why I think that.

(full of shit cold, ignore me)

GOOD RECOVERY QueenStromba.... [phew]

I did discuss this somewhere, possibly while I was still smoldering from the roasting I got.

The thing is, when we meet a bloke from down the road, or even op North or Dahn Saaf, we can tell an awful lot about the person by many subtle nuances, but with someone that comes from a culture we have not lived in, it's hard to work out accents, education, deepest thoughts and aspirations. You end up forgiving/overlooking many things that you wouldn't if you were dating someone from Basingstoke... (OK bad example..)

This is not racist, this is realist, you can't possibly know someone inside out if you don't understand each other's mother language (and actually pretty near fluently) And actually, even US/UK pairings can have cultural misunderstandings!

No matter what nationality an abuser is, he/she will be a skilled manipulator/liar and will present a 'face' that is not genuine. IMHO it is easier to read signs and not dismiss red flags when you know the ins and outs and subtle nuances of a person.

90% of the time, the other person's motives are strictly honorable and it would be wrong to say that mixed pairings don't work. They can and they do.

With different cultures there is another layer that can lead you to ignore and forgive things that you wouldn't do with someone from your own culture. We all want to see the best in people, we none of us want to think that the person in front of us is ever anything other than a friend. Sadly though, as we all know, this is not the case.

I completely get what you're saying. In all honesty I'd be a bit put off a guy if English wasn't his first language partly because I absolutely hate it when I'm in a room with people I know and they're speaking a different language, I'm always worried that they're talking about me. I'd almost convinced myself that I was just being paranoid and nobody would be that rude when in the heat of an argument someone told me that someone else I knew had told him something about me when I know for a fact that the only time the two of them talked was when I was in the same room - it really pissed me off but made me feel vindicated for being annoyed with them at the time for speaking a different language in front of me. The other reason I'd be wary is the reason you mentioned - sometimes you get as much information from the way something was phrased as you do from the information the sentence was meant to impart. I'm very good at spotting when someone has constructed a sentence in such a way to make it so they haven't actually told a lie and there's no way that would work if English wasn't their first language.

Oh yeah, I'm a natural linguist, speak fluent portuguese, mostly self taught, self taught spanish (not so good, but can communicate) and speak a bit of French and German.

I tried to learn Egyptian. 'H' told me off for spying.... so that was the end of me learning the lingo...

Actually, as it was, it was better not to speak the lingo, kept all the sob stories/begging and chancers/thieves at a distance. Didn't stop them trying...

That's awful QS! no wonder you were miffed about that!!

he told you off for spying for trying to learn his language, instead of patting you on the back and helping you learn it!!

Yep.. controlling arse.