Moral dilemma: abusive grandfather now very frail and ill

[WeirdFamily]

My grandfather is 90 and is now very frail and ill. He has lung cancer, and this will almost certainly be his last Christmas.

I'm one of the only grandchildren to live near hime, and have generally kept visits to an absolutel minimum as he was (is??) a particularly nasty abuser. I'll keep the details to a minimum, as I worry about being outed in RL, but basically he sexually, physically and mentally abused my mother as a child, and continued to abuse my aunt (who has cerebral palsy and special needs and lived with him and my grandmother until about five years ago). He also behaved inappropriately with me and my sister when we were kids...nothing too major though.

I only became aware of the extent / history of the abuse a few years ago. I should add that no one (incl my mother) knew about the abuse of my aunt until a few years ago, at which point my Mum and social services moved my aunt into her own house.

My Mum has had counselling for many years and is "over" it all. She has basically forgiven him, and sees him often. I think she loves him I guess it's fairly hardwired into our brains to love our parents? My aunty lives near him, and also loves/depends on him.

So you get the picture - he was a controlling, evil man, and when my daughter was born (six years ago) I decided never to see him, unless under duress / family pressure. I've literally seen him about three times since then, mostly at unavoidable family gatherings.

However, he really is ill and frail. I offered to go and see him at the weekend mainly to make my Mum happy. I couldn't help but feel a pang of pity for him. He is bedridden and he seemed so genuinely pleased to see me, and sort of humble and affectionate (these are NOT adjectives that could been applied to him previously!).

I feel like I;m in a quandary now. I feel like he deserves to be punished for the years of misery he inflicted on people, but on the other hand I'm not really the person who should be inflicting that punishment. It's my aunt and mother who suffered...they've moved on and (I suppose) forgiven him. I would be making THEM happy by seeing him. He's is harmless now...almost blind and immobile. Should I give him the pleasure of spending more time with me and my DCs in his final days??

I've been ruminating over this for ages, and have decided to pass it over to the MN jury.

Sorry, just to clarify: I wouldn't have taken money off my grandad when he was alive (not that it was offered, miser that he was) but felt no compunction about it passing down in the natural order of things.

Your life, your choice - I certainly wouldn't blame you.

Took me a while to type that and cross-posted with a few of you. BelleDame - jeez...that's so awful

WRT me "normalising", I'm not sure I agree. He did stuff like "accidentally" walking in on us (me and sis) getting dressed, and it culminated in one occasion wih him running his hand over my chest and feeling my sister's bottom. We told my Mum about it, and she pretty much put a stop to seeing him.

And yes, since having DD it all became a lot more starkly awful in my eyes, hence me hardly ever seeing him.

There was one incident when he was at a family gethering and I was persuaded to let him hold my baby DD for a few minutes. I was soo pissed off with myself for being so spineless.

Never, no, not in a million years. He should ie alone and scared and preferably in great pain.

Oh, and take the money.

P.s I don't sgree with feeling sorry for abusers just because they were abused themselves but I must say... just because this is mumsnet... that just because your family is rich doesnt mean they cant abuse you...

I'm in similar situation except had no contact at all through my choice. I wouldnt see him at all. I dont get why abusers are suddendly acceptable because they are old and frail?

Your last post has sickened me, I'm so sorry for you, your mum, your aunt...

I know how much of a hold families can have on you, how political and emotional it can be and how much fear and guilt you can feel. The most toxic members, the most abusive ones, are usually the ones that we are most manipulated by.

This man wrecked lives. He deserves nothing, no respect, no kindness. Imagine him not as a frail 90 year old with cancer (and we all get old, we all die) but the horrible, abusive monster he was and still is.

Do what feels right for YOU.

You do not own him anything.

Do not allow others to bully you, stand firm.

Fwiw my dh and I are not speaking to fil (long story) dh has said he will feel nothi
ng but relief when fil dies. He has longed for his death since childhood, due to abuse and mil not having the spine to remove dh from his vice.

Basically, if your grandad dies alone it will be because he is a nasty man who doesn't evoke sympathy.

Good luck.

PS do not take your dd to see him, she will gain nothing and who knows what evil thoughts will run through his mind when he sees her.

Apologies for the normalising comment - I had assumed the inappropriate behaviour was worse than you've described.

Not sure what I'd do about the money... If I needed it, I think I'd take it.

He deserves nothing from you. I don't know if you have any religious beliefs, but those of us who do know he will shortly be getting what he deserves. If you go, go for your mum. but if you choose not to go, feel no guilt. Guilt is just another hold he would then have over you.

He deserves nothing. Being old, ill and frail doesnt take away 'evil'. It just limits their capability of continuing to be a vile abusive bastard.

Im afraid I got as far as reading about your poor aunt and felt too repulsed to read any further. Some people deserve a painful, slow miserable end to life. Your grandfather sounds like one of them.

Pity he never passed away years ago, instead of living to such an old age and still inflicting misery and abuse on people.
I had two lovely, wonderful aunts who both passed away in their 40's from cancer- they deserved to live to 90- to see their grandchildren grow etc. Life is so unfair

Im sorry you have this dilemma.

Hello, WF. I am sorry for your grandfather's illness but a lot more sorry for the way his abuse is still reverbaerating on you.

I've only read your own posts as I'm liable to be triggered by reading the whole thread, so apologies for missing the dialogue.

Please query your own feelings, as that's all that matters. If, when he dies, you will feel bad about not having seen him again, then visit him FOR YOUR OWN SAKE. If not, then fuck him. He doesn't deserve kindness.

Don't rule out the possiblity that his affectionate gratitude was an act. Unless he is specifically, honestly & openly apologising for his abuses of several lifetimes, he hasn't changed. Tbh, that very rarely happens.

Take the money. Money is just numbers. people try to give it emotional meaning, but it has none.

Hth.

If it were me, I'd make sure I said something to him that reverberated around his brain for the days/weeks/months he's got left. When no one else was around I'd say to him "I hate you for what you did to people I care about, and I'd like you to die a miserable, lonely old man. But because I love my mother, I will be here for her. However, you will never see your GCs, and every time you look at my face wearing a fake smile, you will know exactly how disgusted I am by what I am looking at." And then I would make sure that I'm there every damn day giving him that fake smile.

My GF did some stuff to my uncles that was excused as being perfectly acceptable of a Victorian father, but I still see the damage to them and to my mother. I wish he hadn't died when I was 6. I wish he'd lived until I was old enough to punish him.

Perhaps I'm not a good person to advise on this one!