DS's (12) Father says he can't help DS properly with emotional problems.

[MittzyBittzyTeenyWeeny]

Because he feels as if he has been excluded from the family home and doesn't know all the 'subtleties and nuances' of the situation.

DS has self confidence, minor bullying at school and is going through a court case in which he was victim to two counts of common assault.

His Dad left after what I believe was emotional abuse and controlling. It was hard and painful and we are 16 months down from him leaving.

I have worked hard to try help heal the rift between them mostly for DS's sake, as he loves his Dad but is confused for his own feelings for him.

Some of the bullying occurred on MSN and his Dad was at our house, I asked him for advice and tried to explain what was going on, it was quite simple, but he keeps saying he can't help properly because he isn't here. I am starting to feel really crap.
DS doesn't confide in him and he himself gets defensive and shuts his Dad out, his Dad sort of shrugs and asks what he is supposed to do as he feels he can't work on their relationship because he sees so little of them.

He sees them on Tuesday nights, Thursday nights and for a 24 hr period over the weekend.

I pointed out it wasn't an issue when he was separated from his older son's Mum but he said that was different, 'that was then and this is now'.

There is quite a lot of angst between them but has been for years, not just since Ex left us.

The whole things catapulted me into quite deep depression which I am now working on but he also says he is being punished for my mental health problems. .

I have made steps forward but finding it hard to rationalise whether he is right and I am jeopardising my Son's relationship with him.

are you seeing a cousnellor?
is your ds seeing a counsellor?

could you sit and discuss these issues with a family therapist?

there are big issues there to dela with - court case, bullying - i would seek outside help to talk it thru.

but the reltionship is between DS and his dad - you cant push that relaotinship one way or another.

We've had family therapy and I am not surprisingly in counselling.

This might sound stupidly naive but what do I do?

DS tells me stuff that makes him unhappy about his Dad, but asks me not to say anything. And something comes up that needs dealing with like school bullying and involving teachers so I automatically think his Dad needs and has a right to know and then I get how difficult it is for him to give informed advice.
It sometimes feels like another stick to beat me with because if one of his Older sons came to him for advice he surely wouldn't say that he couldn't help because he wasn't 'there'.

Do you think that XH is using the fact that he no longer lives within the family home/dynamic as an excuse not to try and help DS with his emotional issues?

Do you think that if he was there, living back with you, that he could truly help DS?

I'm inclined to say not.

Look at MN, I know it's not the same because XH and DS 'know' each other, but if there was a post on here that you felt you could help with, you would.

So why does he have to be back in the family home to help him?

Surely the advice/help would be the same whether he is sleeping under the same roof as DS or not?

Do you mean that XH is bringing up your mental health issues? And saying that he is being punished because of that?

What has that got to do with you asking him to help his own son?

completely agree with Mouse. he's using this as another tool to control you. after all when he was living with you, from what you've said he was hardly a supportive father and partner

i think you have informed his dad of the issues and that is as far as your responsibility towards his dad goes.

what his dad choses to do about it is down to him - however frustrating that is for you and for DS. you need to try not to listen to his dad's excuses/rants - cut him off.

is there someone your DS is talking to about the bullying and possibly the dad issues?

a good counsellor may be able able to help you develop strategies to deal with this and to develop ways/phrases for you to say to his dad - so that you give the information but dont get involved in the rants back at you....

so you could use your counselling to work on strategies for this so what his dad says doesnt get to you?

so you get our mesage across - that this issue is happening with DS - but that tehn you are able to let it go - leave it in his court...

your message across

parenting doesn't come with a manual, IMO you are doing too much in a way to facilitate the relationship between DS and Ex, Ex is an adult, and as capable as you of stepping up to the plate, as it were, if he so chooses.I just wonder if you are taking too much responsibility on yourself for their relationship.

cestlavie, he has talked a little to a counsellor at school, but generally only talks to me.

The relationship with his Dad is like a yo yo. He will often text me when he is with his Dad because they have fallen out.

Mouse,
He says the 'right things' but quickly places the blame on DS if DS doesn't open up to him. Ex has a 'tone' that makes DS highly defensive. I think he thinks everything should be hunky dory now and doesn't deem to get the level of damage that was done to their relationship.

I don't think it would improve if they lived together, I think it would escalate to the living hell that life became.

Ex has, I think, some sort of personality problem. He admits this but won't get help and says only being with me will make him better. But it didn't make him 'better' before . To be honest, it was shite.

I think it another tool to make me feel bad about his situation. He is very unhappy.

I'm not so good at cutting the rants off. I am not very certain of myself and it is very easy to make me feel bad and guilty. Which is how I feel.

Thank you though.

short answer - he's being a twat and trying to control you, i can just imagine a whiney little voice 'but if only i was here' yeah yeah. You'd be fucking useless just as you are not here.

Honestly poppet he's trying to make you feel bad and is using emotional blackmail against you. Don't buy into his head games.

YOur DS might get better with less contact with his tosspot father TBH. Is it really unlikely that a man who has psychologically abused you isn't doing the same to his son? This is a man who likes power and control and making other people feel bad: he's the last person to be able to help DS.

Wry

OK... it feels like I am letting my son down because at the moment he wants a relationship with his Dad.

I am in the process of trying to get a back bone, but I truly don't always trust my own judgement.

Fuckingbuggerywankingbollockscrap.

It's all so bloody insidious.

Agree with Brian and SGB here.

He is, yet again, putting this back to you Mittz.

It's not on. Not at all. And the whole 'woe is me act' that XH wheels out is wearing thin on you, surely?

XH is chosing not to help DS. I'm not sure what you can do.

See?

DS wants to have a relationship with his dad.

XH is making that difficult by the way he is behaving, by not supporting his son emotionally and yet YOU are the one who feels you are failing DS.

Not on Mittz.

It's understandable you find it tough - from what you've posted, you've gone from a childhood with an emotionally abusive controlling father to a marriage to an emotionally abusive controlling partner. which is understandably going to affect your sense of self and judgment, if you end up pussyfooting round controlling men and secondguessing them etc. I guess as well you can almost feel more in control by thinking =- if I was just that bit better, then they would behave OK to me - rather than accepting that it's a flaw in these men that they behave nastily to their nearest and dearest to prop up their self-esteem.

Although my gut reaction re:contact is similar to SGB, I don't have the life experience of exs or even of fathers (I never had a thing to do with mine) to properly advise on that at all.

its a hard lesson to learn and one im still not there yet, but i think you have to stop thinking you can or even should make it better for your ds and your exh's relationship.

You can be there to pick up the pieces with your ds, of course, but you can't make exh behave the way he should. You just can't. The same way I can't force exh to visit more than once every 5 weeks. I try and try but actually, its up to him. I can only be there to try to help dd through it.

So, my top tip - stop taking responsibility for things that aren't your fault and that you have no control over

'Stop taking responsibility for things that aren't your fault and that you have no control over'

Spot on.

And the really awful thing here Mittz, is that XH knows how to play you and just what will cause you to doubt your own parenting with DS.

He is showing you that by behaving the way he is. You are 'piggy in the middle' as per.

No more Mittz, don't let him keep doing this to you.

Thank you... the advice is massively helpful, but I feel sick and sad.

He is far far less like this with DD, because I suspect being the only daughter with 3 brothers makes her 'special', but that just compounds it even more for DS

I am taking all the advice on board and will take the next step to deal with things esp for DS.

Thank you again.

may also be because she's young and less of a whole person to deal with iyswim. easier for some people to love little ones than older ones because they don't confront them so much and they don't reflect back your behaviour so much. not explaining that at all well. sorry.

That pretty well sums up my Dad to be honest Santa,
He said he liked being 'God' in our worlds and found it hard when we hit the outside world and questioned him.

I think you need to cut exP out of your life. Sounds like he is still trying to emotionally abuse and control you and is just using DS as another excuse to do this.

Also sounds like he might be treating DS the same way. Does DS want to see his father? I don't think you should sugar coat the truth about exP too much otherwise it might confuse him even more.