First time ever I let my mum know that I am not happy with her

[Ormirian]

And I think it's down to MN.

She's always been bit fragile and I have spent my life trying to protect her. And a misery guts too. I posted about her last week, about how she is always negative and brings the world down. So whenever she has critisised me I've just listened, and tried to justify myself.

Today she had a go at me over the phone at how spoilt my kids are, and how much better DB is at managing his DC. So I just said nothing. And she thought the line had gone dead. And when she started up again, I did the same. Then she said 'sorry for preaching' and started again! In the end I hung up, quite politely. She will now be bitching about it at my poor dad.

I am not having it any more. I've got 3 DC (and a friend of hers told DH that they were 'beautiful children in every way' this week so I must be doing OK) I have a full-time job. I want her to say 'well done' just once. But I guess she never is

You were very restrained, Orm. I'm sorry your mother can't show her approval. I hope things work better for you and her in your relationship now that you've made yourself clear.

You may not be able to change her but you can change the way you react to her - and I agree with you that openness is the way forward

How did MN help?

Agree you will never get what you want or need from your mum and this is hard.

I would tell her that you know that you are bringing your children up well and that how you bring them up is up to you and dh. She is free to hold the opinion that your DB is a better parent. You are able to ask her not to crtitcise your parenting if you don't want to hear it and to stop listening to her if she carries on once you have asked her to stop.

Congratulations in starting to take more control of this relationship - I think you need to build on this success!

Oh, its crapola isn't it. So hard not to carry on in parent-and-child mode too, accepting what they hand out.

I know what it's like just to want them to display some glimmer of parental love and appreciation, and never get it.

Well done for standing up to her. Go hug your dcs!

Thankyou.

quattro - because of all the threads I have read about mothers and daughters which have enabled me to see that we don't have a totally healthy relationship. Too many unrealised expectations, too many pressures. I am the one who stuck around when DB buggered off and I tried to look after her. My main feeling towards her is one of guilt because I perceive her as being unhappy. And I have no reason to feel guilty. None at all.

Oh she shows glimmers of appreciation but it is always instantly counteracted by a criticism. eg 'DD is such a caring little girl. Pity the boys can't be nicer' or 'I do love DS1. He's such a lovely boy. But I wish DS2 wasn't so selfish' IYSWIM.

good for you. my mother said something horrid about mykids once, we didn't speak for two years. other things were involved, but it made me come to a realisation...that no-one has the right to treat me appallingly. no-one.

Thanks custy.

Thing is she doesn't behave appallingly. Just lots of little nasty comments and sulks. I should know better than to get upset - I've had this for 45 years FFS. I need to be less concerned about her.

OK Orm. Slightly different but 'H' has been known to rant at me, or have a go on the phone and before I used to try to argue, to defend myself.

Now I just hang up. He rings back and says what happened? I say the line must have dropped.

Next step for you is to say nothing AND hang up.

Treat her like the child she is being. Ignore bad behaviour, literally, don't take it, and praise good. ie. If she has a good conversation with you, the conversation continues, the minute she starts to criticise you, hang up. Every. time.

Don't allow it to get to you, don't allow her to do it. Thwart her little nasty comments every single time.

i think constant criticism of your kids is appalling - don't you? should you? have you normalised 45 years of shit behaviour?

If you don't want to confront her about her behaviour (yet), when she starts on one of her criticising speeches, why not say 'thank you for your opinion. Now, let's talk about something more constructive/positive'. Refuse to engage, refuse to show any reaction. If she goes back to criticising, say 'I thought we'd agreed we weren't going to talk negatively for the rest of this conversation'. If that fails, ask her, in a friendly, almost laughing way, 'Have you rung up for a chat or to tell me off?'. A very straightforward 'Mum, I realise you worry about me, but I am an adult woman now. It's not your place to tell me off and tell me how to do things any more. It'd be much nicer to be able to chat like adults, wouldn't it? We'd be even closer if we did' wouldn't hurt either.

If you want a different tack, try 'You seem to be upset - whenever something's worrying you, you always criticise me. Would you like to talk about what's really getting to you?'. If she denies there's anything wrong, tell her gently that she always gets critical when there's something on her mind (even if this isn't true, it will make her feel like you care about her feelings). You don't need to be sucked into a row about what she's saying, but let her know that you are aware that what she's doing is criticising you and not just normal conversation. If she says she never criticises you, tell her gently and with love that she criticises you every/nearly every chat you have. If she gets upset and accuses you of hating her or being mean, stay gentle and say of course you don't hate her and that you'd never be mean, it's just that it's very sad for you to be criticised all the time instead of just having a nice chat with her. Focus on the lovely mother-daughter natters you could have if she reigned it in.

I'm lucky that I don't have to use these with my Mum - she is the one who taught me how to talk to difficult people without engaging with them or getting involved in their drama and still being perfectly pleasant. Your mother may be fragile but she will not crumble if you are gently assertive. Like a naughty child who doesn't know how to get out of a pattern of bad behaviour, she might feel great relief at you setting her loving boundaries or respect you more for standing up to her. Good luck!

I feel your pain. My mum is prone to this kind of nasty behaviour, and when I try to defend myself against her unreasonable attacks on me, she tells me to "stop being so defensive". I can't win.

I've realised that the only way for me to deal with it, is to distance myself from her when I know she's going through one of her 'moody phases'. I also think it unfortunately could be the early stages of Alzheimer's.

But back to you; I think you should keep telling yourself you have NO reason to feel guilty (you're obviously doing a great job in bringing up your DC - as demonstrated by your numerous posts on other sections on MN) and as Custy says, no-one has the right to treat you appallingly.

As my DearSis always says; you can choose your friends, but you can't choose your family.

Great advice from Scorpette, I'll definitely try it myself next time.

Thankyou everyone.

Problem is I have a niggling feeling that I'm not doing a good job with my DC. Logic tells me that they are OK (thanks for your comment doc ) but I always have this feeling that it's inspite of me, not because of me. Thanks for that mum I have learned to be proud of myself in most other areas of my life but she can still get to me when it comes to bringing up my DC.

You know she even brought up that old chestnut 'we made our own entertainment' And she had the nerve to say that isnpite of not having all the things my DC have she was happy as a child - which is in direct contrast to all the other things she has said about her childhood to me in the past.

scorpette - fantastic advice. Many thanks.I will try to bear it in mind.

Orm she sounds like my mum too. She always has to criticise everything I do with the kids. An example is last night when I asked her to hold on while I said to DS _ don't speak so loudly. She then said I must not use the word don't when speaking with my children. I told her I would use the word if I felt like it. She criticises everything and is always preaching - nowadays I just completely ignore her. She then says oh did you hear what I just said and I just answer yes and carry on with what I was doing.

OP I totally understand when you say its down to MN. I used to feel guilty about her being lonely too but now she just keeps annoying me with her snide remarks. I know that if she continues this way I am going to tell her that if she doesn't stop then she is at risk of ruining our relationship. Well done for standing up to her, its like they always want to control everything.

Sorry to hijack OP but I was going to start a thread on my own mum who sounds exactly like yours. Its draining.

Whenever she visits I just know she will criticise everything from the food I cook to the state of the stairs. It is bloody annoying. She keeps on going on about how she cannot eat the food in my house because she has high cholesterol, a dig at the food in my house which is not full of cholesterol. She told my DS that once you are fat at ten you will be fat for life, well my DS is not fat but thanks to that remark he now worries all the time about his weight. She seems to be repeating the same things she did to me when I was small eg you are too fat, thick, should smile more, should be more clever.

These comments ruined me and this is why even if my son was fat I would never belittle him like that but find a better way of handling it. I just don't know what's wrong with her, but what I do know is that one of these days I shall certainly explode.

Sorry to hijack OP but I was going to start a thread on my own mum who sounds exactly like yours. Its draining.

Whenever she visits I just know she will criticise everything from the food I cook to the state of the stairs. It is bloody annoying. She keeps on going on about how she cannot eat the food in my house because she has high cholesterol, a dig at the food in my house which is not full of cholesterol. She told my DS that once you are fat at ten you will be fat for life, well my DS is not fat but thanks to that remark he now worries all the time about his weight. She seems to be repeating the same things she did to me when I was small eg you are too fat, thick, should smile more, should be more clever.

These comments ruined me and this is why even if my son was fat I would never belittle him like that but find a better way of handling it. I just don't know what's wrong with her, but what I do know is that one of these days I shall certainly explode.

Good for you. I had years of this, that oddly enough I just took and took and took. (would never do this in any other area)

Once I said to her (after a LOT of therapy): You would never talk to db like this. No, she said. (rare moment of clarity) Why not - and she replied: He would hang up.

So I did.

Felt AMAZING. I didn't talk to her for an age, and then I sort of realigned the relationship bit by bit. Thinking what would db/ do say, really helped. And if that didn't work, I did a lot of mmm... that's interesting... ah... and so on. And not engaging generally. Stopping trying to be approved of. I never will. And it's taken a lot of the power away from her.

Scorpette great advice btw

I have to agree with Custardo - I think constantly criticising you is most definititely apalling behaviour. Don't you think so too?

I know what you mean about MN helping you...it's helpd me too...standing up to my Mum and my DH.

My Mum questions everything I do....undermines my choices and makes me start worrying about things which haven't even happened! Negativity is to blame...keep at it...I thnk it's part of growing up lol! I'm 38!

I have just had my Mum to stay for a few days. We usually go to my parents but this time they came here. Have had some cracking comments from my Mum. But am learning to let it go and sometimes give as good as I get!

One example: Mum and Dad looked after the DCs one day when I went to work. Mum and I have VERY different standards of housekeeping. Her house is like a showroom. Fine - but that is HER choice, not mine. She is quite obsessive about it - to the point that her dislike of mess/disorder was one of the reasons that I am an only child.

So, I come home from work, after dinner DD is eating a cake and gets crumbs all over the floor and DD says to me, 'am really sorry Mummy that I have made all this mess'. I was a bit surprised to be honest as it doesn't usually matter! Mum says dryly, looking around the rest of the room: 'I wouldn't worry about it, DD'. Then I say, 'what has happened to DD after one day with you?', Mum's response: 'I doubt one day would make a difference - I have tried 34 years with you to no effect...'

The reason I have always thought it wasn't appalling behaviour is that I thought of it as a form of self-deprecation at one remove. If someone said your child was so wonderful, you might say 'oh well he can be a little horror too you know' in a jokey way. I thought that she was doing that sort of thing with regard to her GCs and me. But it isn't. She is too earnest about it as if she really thinks I need to change the way I do things.

The thing is Orm, you could change and change and do everything she says and she still wouldn't be happy. I think for some mums the only way they have of engaging with their children is through criticism. They can never see their children as independent adults and never make the step towards a properly adult relationship with them. Next time she says something critical you could say "would you say that your friends?" If she says no then ask her why she thinks it's ok to say it to you. Might make her think.

My MIL used to baby my DH a lot (not through his choice) but thankfully she's a reasonable enough woman and when he told her he'd take care of his own business she eventually backed off. Thing is she still hasn't quite got her head around how to engage with him and so their relationship has gone a bit cold now. Hopefully it'll improve.

Yes, I am an adult. Funny I've never thought of that in relation to her. I am an adult and she has no right to have a go. It's so fucking obvious now you all point it out.

Also remember Omirian that you are not responsible for her happiness. Yes, you should look out for her and help her if possible, but you do not have to jump through hoops to make her happy. She is responsible for sorting her own life out and you are entitled to your own space and peace of mind.