Aftermath of an affair

[ChippedChinaTeacup]

Some of you might remember that my partner had an affair at the beginning of this year and we decided to stay together and make things work. I had a thread back then but can't get the name to work now for some reason.

After a few hiccups our relationship is pretty good but I just feel really crap. I doubt him all the time despite having no reason to, I question his motives about everything, I look for evidence of everything he says and does - not directly - I never tell him I do this, I just quietly conduct my detective work... if he says he feels ill or something I don't believe him and just assume it's an excuse to skive or get some extra attention.

I feel very low most of the time, at night I dream about killing myself or how much better things would be if I were dead, those thoughts pop into my head during the day too.

I feel like I'm not good enough, that I can't have a bad hair day or be under the weather or anything less than perfect.

I have to say he's very good, does lots of things to make me feel special, is very open with his phone, email etc - he's doing all the right things, probably more so than I am if I'm honest.

We have a lot of fun and do lots of things together, he never goes out in the evenings anymore, just visits his parents about once a month and stays overnight there and when he does that he sends photos of where he is and who he's with.

The only glitch is that we still don't communicate very well.. we don't talk about the affair anymore and if I bring up anything that even might relate to it we end up arguing, so it's been swept under the carpet and is largely ignored now. I don't obsess over it anymore, I don't think about the affair but I do now feel very insecure and unsure about him and whether I really want to continue with this relationship.

We never got round to counselling, I couldn't find one I liked and he's had to be working hard rebuilding his career because he left the job he was in at the time because OW worked there.. so he's not really had the time, but even if he did, he thinks he doesn't need it and would only be doing it to please me.

sorry you are going throught this. it sounds exactly where I am too. I know that is no help to you, but just wanted to let you know you are not alone. take care.

Oh God, how completely horrible for you.

I can relate to the inability to trust, not having been directly in your position but with someone who kept going to see their ex girlfriend...that's way below your situation on the painful scale though.

The thing that struck me right through your post was that you hadn't mentioned counselling - the reasons why he had the affair need to be gone into, or of course you will be afraid he might do it again! You've no reason to believe anything has changed in his outlook - and despite his very real efforts to change his physical situation, place of work, going out habits etc you are perhaps afraid that in his mind he still wants someone else, and even resents you for making him do all these things.

The last sentence made me really sad...the fact he won't agree to counselling because 'he doesn't need it and it would only be to please you'.

Surely that's the point - it's you who have been hurt in this marriage, he owes you everything you need in order to make it work, because you're the one struggling here.

If he isn't prepared to put in the effort 'to please you', hes got NO right to expect you to give it another go in the first place.

Find a counsellor you like, and make it a condition of your marriage that he comes with you...at the very least you need some explanations and he needs to be properly sorry and different, or there's no chance this can work.

I'm very sorry you are going through this x

what I mean is - well, it's like when my bloke finally stopped going to see her and told her it was over, for me, having been through the previous few months when he clearly still was attached to her, and then the bit where he left her for me but was distraught at having to do this - I didn't feel like anything had changed. It was like he was going through the motions, but inside he still wanted to be with her.

You can't know these things of course, unless they tell you - mine insisted he was over her - but I didn't feel very special any more.

I hope you can find the strength to get through this. He might be genuinely repentant but you need evidence.

I wish I had the opportunity you have to try and make your relationship work, but my DH chose the OW.

You really do both need to go to counselling, he may not feel the need but I can assure you it really will help, it will help you to get some of those missing pieces of the zigsaw even though you no longer obsess, it might also help with your over zealous detective work. I would ask him again about counselling and let him do it to please you, it believe it really will help both of you.

I never saw your thread before so dont know the story but did you get to the bottom of why your DP had the affair, counselling will help with all this. Also you both need to talk, communication is the only answer. Good luck I hope your sort out your problems.

Sorry to hear Chipped and Keneckie and romney.

Chipped- please get some counselling so that this doesn't turn into depression.

Sorry that should read jigsaw.

FA - did you get past the not feeling special stage and did the relationship last.

Thanks all of you, I appreciate the responses.

this was the original thread

We did do a lot of talking in the first few months afterwards.. he said that part of the reason he allowed himself to do it was because he'd never had female attention and he allowed it to turn his head.. he convinced himself that she was his destiny because they were from the same area, had previously worked in the same company at the same time, even tho they hadn't known each other and of course she tailored her interests and values to match his. She even managed to convince him that his confusion and the stress he was having because of the affair was bipolar disorder and she'd give up work to look after him!
It took months but he did see her for what she was in the end.. he was the I think 4th attached man she'd relationships with, I know that one of the previous men had two small children and was a director of the most well known children's charity in this country. One of the wives sold the story to a magazine, and OW was actually proud of the article

I wrote that post yesterday afternoon and forgot to press send and some things have happened since then. He tends to let things fester and then blow up, which did happen last night and so again I said we at least need to see someone about helping us to communicate better.. sometimes we'll both be saying the same thing but in different ways so it all comes out wrong and turns into arguments and he's finally giving that serious consideration. He said that he thinks our foundation is very strong, our love is solid and we have a good base for a great relationship but it does need work, and he's thinking about how a counsellor might be able to help us with that now.

I really don't think he would do this again, we did manage to make quite a lot of progress on our own, even though he wouldn't read the books, I was able to explain how and why certain things were inappropriate and could lead further and you could see the realisation on his face.. innocent things like going for a cigarette break with a certain person on a regular basis, conversations gradually becoming more personal.. then it escalating to coffee.. stuff like that. Once we actually watched a couple doing this outside his office, and it hit both of us like a punch in the gut that this was exactly what had happened with him and her.. he sort of kept an eye on that couple over a period of time and sure enough it was slowly escalating. Bloke in that case was married and the woman was not. We don't know how it panned out because he had to leave that job as well.. OW started to harass him there.

I just feel so blah about everything. My mother has become very ill so now I'm caring for her. I'm an only child and there's no one else to fall back on or help me. My health isn't 100% yet either and I just feel like I'm a drain on his resources. If there's a day where I feel off-colour I feel as tho he might be thinking ohh gawd here we go again.. I do have my own income now and could manage quite well by myself if necessary.

I'm not obsessively detecting, but if he tells me something, I will quietly and discreetly look for evidence to back up what he's saying, if that makes sense and so far he's always been telling the truth. I don't know why I'm having these doubts, it's like we had a beautiful piece of silver and now it's tarnished, or like my name, a chipped cup.. still useful, still lovely - but not quite the same anymore.

I'm not sure what I'm posting really.. maybe I am depressed and need to see my gp.. I just don't know anymore.

Romney, I'm sorry for your situation, I did see some of your thread but it's so hard to read when it's so close to the bone so haven't followed it but you've got a gem in Karmann.. she's been a fabulous friend to me this year and I'd have been lost without her on many occasions.

Frrright.. I've seen your threads and you're such a lovely person, you really deserve someone who'll make you feel wonderful and special - hopefully soon.

Oh Chipped that's lovely of you to say. Romney, no, I didn't get past it I'm afraid...something just broke. I couldn't ever seem to fix it though we did try again.

I think it gave me an insight into his character - basically that he could even do that, really - but then I had only been with him for a few months, nothing like a marriage, just a long term friend turned into a boyfriend. I'm not furious with him now but I never go to see him any more.

I think when you have had a marriage or a long term partnership, there is more there in the first place so it isn't so easy to lose or to walk away from.

Chipped, I do remember your other thread about the woman and man in the car park. I'm really sorry about your Mum, as well - that must feel like a big priority and be taking up a lot of your emotional energy as well as physical.

Perhaps this is having an impact..I think from what you say, he has gone into detail already about why it happened and you feel somewhat reassured by this, but still - like you say, it doesn't feel 'perfect' any more, something's missing and he's the one who is responsible for this.

Maybe it will go back to how it was over time...the affair might have eben explained but this man has still lied to you, and that's the crucial bit. How did he justify lying to you...obviously something will have had to go, in order to do that - maybe his respect for you, or maybe he was angry - stuff like that does take a lot to repair it.

Hello Chipped. I've been wondering when you were going to start a thread about this. Happy to help if you think I can? Will be back later.

Ok lady - just read this and realised it's you! You know where I am. xx

Chipped - I will have a look at your thread later. I still think that you should both get some counselling. Your DP sounds like he is really trying and I think you have to try and draw a line in the sand and move forward. (Easier said than done I know but he is trying, but obviously was very silly to have got himself in this situation in the first place).

My DH fell the same way with a work colleague, much younger who was having problems, he tried to help and got well and truly sucked in. Obvioulsy a weak man but I still love him and would still like him back.

If you have read my thread you will know I have not been coping well, I do think a trip to the GP for a mild AD would help, I have never been the type of person who would want to take any medication, I have been through a lot in my life and never had to take any help from the GP before, but this time I have had to, as I did feel suicidal at times, and after nearly 4 weeks on citalopram I am feeling so much better.

Your right Karmann has been an absolute gem and helped me so much.

Alternative to ADs is intense exercise programme for endorphin rush.

Yes I agree TDa, I did try the exercise route but as I was so low, it was all I could do to get up each day, which was only to walk the dogs and go and feed my horse.

romney- good to hear that you are better now.

Thanks Karmann.. speaking to you the other day did help me get some things articulate in my mind - hence the post. It was just a jumble til then.

WWIFN, I'd especially appreciate your input but I'd like lots of input from lots of people to help me make sense of things.

I agree Romney, we do need counselling.. together and separately. He's trying very hard, the company he works for now is very sociable, lots of after work parties and trips and he doesn't go to any of them, despite me saying I've no objection - and those aren't empty words, I really don't mind if he goes. He told me straightaway when a woman in his office got a bit too friendly and engineered things so that she would see us together, in addition to him telling her that he had a partner. If he has to go out of town to a different office he invites me to go too. The only time he goes out in the evenings is the one weekend a month when he goes to his hometown to visit his parents and he goes out with his mates then, but spends most of the night sending me messages or ringing me, lol. He takes a photo of himself in his room when he gets back to the house and sends it to me so I know he's at home. He's being really good isn't he?

TaDa.. exercise... not something I've ever been good at and to be honest I'm not sure I have the time or the motivation to do it I do walk a lot, and spend a fair amount of time rushing around because at the moment I'm running two households, mine and my mother's.

I just don't know what I want anymore. Our sex life isn't great because I'm also having some gynae issues, been bleeding pretty constantly since May so we manage to get a bit of nookie on the odd day that it stops, but those are few and far between, but when we do, it's amazing now. Very intense and emotional. We kiss and cuddle and hug all the time, he's always been a very affectionate person and I do sometimes find that a bit claustrophobic which hurts him.

On paper I've got it all.. but I just feel empty somehow, distant even.

Chipped I have seen your messages dotted about on other threads and it looked like you were having a hard time.

I wonder whether a few things might be happening here?

Do you think you have lost respect for him?

You may have seen me write that once the crisis phase is over, which is usually very energising, most of us hit a "wall" and I think you started hitting yours earlier this year. I remember seeing a post of yours when you first provided the wonderful metaphor of the beautiful broken cup - you seemed so sad then and IIRC, this was around June/July time.

You also seem to have some of your health problems back that beset you before the affair started. Physiological issues, such as anaemia might be in play here, plus the emotional response to the very draining symptoms you are currently enduring. I wonder whether some of these symptoms are giving you flashbacks too - in a "this was what it was like before the affair" kind of way? Have you talked to your GP about any of this?

You know from your original thread that I had doubts about your DP's character, given some of the things you revealed about him. Given that he has refused all this time to go to counselling and "won't read any of the books" then it sounds as though he has passed the responsibility for unravelling why this has happened over to you, to a great extent.

You did read the books and while they helped you to get him to see what makes a friendship unsafe, really it should have been him reading the books to help him to understand why it was possible for him to go against his values. The responsibility for learning and educating was passed to you, in effect.

I think there's a high chance you have situational depression and I think I went through that myself for a while, but was in denial because I'd never been depressed in my life.

I do think you might benefit from some solo therapy to process your feelings, but you've made a brave start by posting this thread. You know that you need help and that things need to change.

Reading between the lines, it seems you are having a battle with yourself because lots of boxes have been ticked, so you can't understand why you're still feeling so dreadful and without hope. It's not as simple as deciding that you will put all this behind you, because I think there are still some issues that need confronting.

Hello WWIFN.

Thank you soo much for this.

I don't know if I've lost respect exactly, but I no longer feel that I can rely on him to be loyal to me, to protect me or look after me. Several months ago, someone made up some rather nasty stories about me and told them to dp, also told him that he's a king and far too good for me, that he should be out in the world experiencing other women and stuff like that. DP came home and went nuts at me, that I'd lied to him and had this horrible history and not told him and that our whole life together had been based on a lie.. none of what this man told him was true, and it turns out this man has a bit of a thing for me and was trying to break us up but dp's reaction really hurt me and gave me pause to think. That he would believe a distant acquaintance over me, even for only a few moments.. you know?

My health is going to be a battle for the rest of my life, I only have about 1.5m of intestine and so don't absorb enough nutrients from food to keep me healthy. I take huge amounts of vitamins and minerals, some of which at levels that would be toxic to a normal person, and it's something which has to be closely monitored - blood tests every three months, bone scans, sometimes infusions and transfusions, constantly being tweaked and adjusted. It's intrusive and annoying, even for me. I know it's hard to live with at times.

The depression could be a result of some kind of imbalance nutritionally, but also situational. As I said earlier, I'm an only child and we don't have any family in this country other than my children, so the responsibility of caring for my mother naturally falls to me. She's 81 years old and mentally in great shape, she just has poor physical health now, and I'm dreading anything happening to her because then I'll have no one.

I did read and he didn't, he never reads anything really, other than work related stuff whereas I'm quite academic, but we did discuss a lot of what I'd read and you could see the realisation dawning on his face. I think he's quite immature in a lot of ways, his mother pampers and spoils him, and I suppose to some extent I did the same. The house was mine, he's never had to worry about the roof over our heads or whether we'd starve, I always managed all of that, just because I was used to it, having been married before and living on my own before we got together. One of the issues at the time of the affair was that that he felt he's not growing as a person, and he blamed me for that but in fact he holds himself back. Not sure if that's insecurity or lack of confidence on his part, he is deeply insecure and needs to be reassured a lot, he's always been like that though.

Reading that back doesn't make him sound too brilliant does it? But he is the sweetest, kindest person you could meet. We laugh together all the time and at the same things, and he shows me all the time that he loves me but like you said.. I just seem to have hit a wall.

I'm going to see my gp this week.. maybe we can find an AD that will actually work on me, most of them pass thru my gut before they get a chance to be absorbed and also he can refer me to a counsellor I think. I've spent an awful lot of money on seeing different counsellors and not liking them so maybe it's time to try the NHS route. Trouble is that everything is jumbled in my head and it's hard to put things into words to another person, I even tried keeping a journal but that didn't seem to help either.

When DP gets home this evening, we'll talk again about him seeing someone (he did find someone he really liked - someone like the chap that Karmann sees, who does life coaching as well as counselling - but because he had to change job again it sort of fell by the wayside) and also us seeing someone together, we do need that and we'll never be able to progress further if we don't. He wants us to get married and maybe have a child but there's no way we could even contemplate those things at the moment.

blimey that was an epic! sorry!

What's this "horrible history" that he thought you might have had? Can you elaborate further?

I don't want to go into too much detail but the allegations were along the lines that I had been very promiscuous, had previously had a boyfriend who was a paedophile and who I allowed to mess with my children, that I used to beat my children and they were taken into care. That sort of thing, all of which is completely preposterous and if you knew me irl, you'd know just how ridiculous those things were.

It just really annoyed me that dp could believe those things of me, even for a few minutes.

I've made an appointment with my gp for this afternoon, going to ask about a referral for counselling and maybe some ADs, I really can't go on like this, feeling so low and crap.

I'm not surprised his belief in those allegations hurt you. That is astonishing disloyalty, but that little vignette speaks volumes, Chipped. This was at a time when he was meant to be showing you that he was worthy of a second chance after a previous disloyalty.

I return I'm afraid, to what I said on your original thread. This man's got too many problems that need fixing. You sure as hell can't and I hope you don't feel it's your role.

I wonder whether your body is telling you what your cognitive self cannot? That he is never going to be worth it?

ccp i tried to do what you did 7 yrs ago when dh had an affair with avery young girl.
It was the moment i realised i was applying make up after a gruelling night shift so i could go home pretty that made me realise i couldnt do it anymore.It was painfull to end an 18 yr relationship and 10 yr marriage with 4 kids on under one,but it was as painfull to stay.
I am happy now and re married but i am shocked as to the profound effect it has had on my ability to trust and i am so sad about that. I am pregnant at the mo so over sensitive but will seek some help if it carries on afterwards. Goos luck but dont underestimate the damage and the fact it will need work to repair...by both of you.

Ledkr, I'm so sorry you've had the same experience but very glad you're happier now. I can relate to the pretty thing, I almost feel as though I have to look good all the time, be in a good mood all the time etc etc. It's very draining isn't it?

I saw my gp today.. I could have kissed him! I'm sure he must have read Shirley Glass because his attitude very much matched what the book says. Very unusual in real life. He's prescribed Mirtazepine, referred me for CBT and given me the number of a counsellor he thought I might get on with because the wait for the NHS psychotherapist might be a bit long. I could have kissed him!

WWIFN, what you say gives me pause for thought.. the loyalty thing is an issue, but at the time he apologised and said he'd have reacted in the same way if someone had told him something bad about his best friend too.. he is a bit of a hot head, react first, think later type of person and up til now I've not given it much thought - just accepted it as part of his personality, much like I'm a very calm, non-confrontational type person to the extent that I've been told I need a backbone a few times by friends and colleagues. It could be that this is a real character flaw tho, I'm going to do some serious thinking about incidents from the past and see if they're real issues and whether they form part of the dealbreaker list I'm sort of compiling.

Something else I haven't mentioned before is that he does smoke cannabis sometimes in the evenings and on weekends. It never used to affect him but now I can see that it changes his mood and sometimes distorts his thinking. Just recently I've noticed that we can have a conversation in the evening and all be fine but somehow by the following morning he's skewed it in his mind that I've attacked him and he will argue about it the following day. This has happened twice in the last couple of months, most recently on Friday. Over the weekend one of his friends pointed out the effect the cannabis has on him now and since it more or less mirrored what I've said about it, he's giving it up. I've told him that our relationship has no hope whatsoever if he doesn't and that part is up to him now.

I've done a lot of thinking today, read some of your posts on other threads wwifn and they help me to question myself, so thank you for that. I'm really not entirely sure that I want to continue this relationship at all now, but I will give it some more time and see what efforts DP makes.

90% of the time we're great together, we have fun, lots of affection and companionship, he reassures me lots of how much he loves me and how beautiful he thinks I am and how lucky he is to have me, but there's just something that stops me relaxing completely and feeling at ease. My self esteem is through the floor and I've never been less confident. I even struggle to make eye contact with people.

I'm also a bit relieved when he wants to do something on his computer rather than sit with me in the evenings.. that's bad isn't it?

Chipped GPs like that are worth their weight in gold. I'm so pleased you've got some RL help lined up.

I also find it interesting that it took a third party to comment on his drug use before he agreed to stop it.

I think you might be in a process of detaching from your DP and that explains your relief when you are doing separate things when you're together.

I suspect you have spent so much time working on him and your relationship, that you have now drawn breath and realised that you need to work on you. Perhaps you are going through a process too where you can see links with your own character and what people say about you ("grow a backbone" etc.) and what you have been bargaining away in your DP's character.

I always remember that bit on your original thread where your reaction to your male friend overstepping the boundaries was completely out of step with the way that others, including me, interpreted that exchange.

One of the unforeseen effects of infidelity and a trauma like this, is how the betrayed partner grows as a person and stops bargaining away unacceptable behaviour. That's a good thing what ever the outcome of the relationship. Because you are going through this process now, I have a lot of hope for you personally. I worry more for people who are still thinking this was all their fault, because they lose themselves even more and the crash will be enormous when it happens.

Keep posting, always happy to help.

Ironically this gp is one DP saw back in January because he was having mood swings and suffering from stress. He asked me to go with him and help him explain what was going on to the gp.. little did I know that he was embarking on the affair at that point, told the gp yesterday and he was like ohhhhh that explains a lot and nodded sagely.

That happens a lot wwifn.. I can talk about something with some knowledge and it be pretty much disregarded, but if someone else says the same thing then it's a great idea. I have pulled him up over this before - it can be any topic, even quite trivial things and he doesn't seem to realise he's doing it.

The cannabis thing hasn't really been a big deal til recently, and he himself has noticed that he wants it more often and that it seems to 'play games with his mind' I don't smoke it and never have, so I don't really know what the effects are like. He has talked often of giving it up, but seems to lack the will power to follow through. I'm hoping the pep talk with his friend might have helped this time.

I don't know if I'm detaching myself but I am noticing things more, and considering whether I'm willing to tolerate them or not. I'm pretty laid back generally, very much live and let live so this is new to me. What I have realised is that I'm too laid back.. I agree to things because I don't like to disappoint, not just with dp but with everyone. I'm too much of a people pleaser and not assertive enough. I need to learn to say no and set firmer boundaries. I even went on two assertiveness courses back in August and they made no impact whatsoever :/

I don't know why I'm like that.. I always have been, even as a child. The thought of someone being displeased with me makes me want to cry. I'm afraid they won't like me anymore or something, I don't know really. This is something else I really need to explore further isn't it?

Cripes the can of worms is growing bigger and bigger for me to look at... I think I'm going to have a long path of self examination ahead of me and it's a scary thought.