Has anyone ever cut out a parent? Need some practical advice please...

[bintofbohemia]

...as unfortunately I live about two miles from my father and stepmother which makes it slightly more tricky. We've been trying to move for nearly two years now but DH is really struggling to find another job somewhere else so we're having to face the fact that we may be here for much longer...

I had counselling last year and was advised to take control and just see them when I want to, but it's not that easy when they're on the doorstep, and also I feel a bit guilty about stopping them from seeing my children. (Not that they see them anyway, they haven't spent any time with them this whole year. They've been in teh same room as them for half an hour here and there but not actually had any quality time with them, IYSWIM.)

So obviously I can't just disappear, so do I have to have some sort of formal conversation along the lines of "you do my head in, please don't contact me"?

Has anyone done this? Was there any bad fall out?

What happens when you don't contact them, don't answer the phone? Would they doorstep you or can you keep contact to a minimum?

(This is where I am with my mother right now, but she lives 3 hrs away so it's easier. We speak about once every 2 months.)

I'm not sure you need to have the conversation unless they are not aware of the breakdown in the relationship.

Can you avoid them, not call etc?

I do not speak to my mother. We have had a very bad relationship and she is extremely toxic. We cut contact after one of her episodes and I have not returned any calls, messages, cards etc or reacted to anything she has done since. I refuse to give her any more of my time and she will either explode or try to talk me round.

It's such as sad situation because your parents aren't supposed to be like this but I cannot change her, I can only control my reaction to her...

If I don't contact them my SM will usually contact me eventually. She might even turn up. My father does nothing, because he doesn't give a crap. Well, to be fair, he will occasionally call me if my SM tells him to, which is very awkward as we have nothing really to say to each other.

The really difficult thing is that sometimes my SM can appear to do things that are nice, which temporarily fools me (because I am stupid and never learn.) And I think the only way to get my head straight about it is to not interact with them, at least for a while.

But I suppose I am going to have to have some sort of cringey conversation with them to get to that point. And that's the bit I'm really not keen on.

I haven't had any contact with my father for 9 years. I made the decision when DS1 was 1. My (alcoholic) father had always been a destructive influence in my life and I decided that I didn't want to expose my son to that influence. I firmly believe that I made the right decision.

As to how you'd go about it... I simply stopped contacting my father, who lived in the same city. He stopped trying to contact me and I never saw him again. I've since moved multiple times and I don't know if he even knows where I am (nor do I care). The fall out was that I had to discontinue contact with my father's side of the family entirely, which is a shame as I did like my cousins. However, I feel that it was worth the sacrifice.

I'm really sorry that you're in a situation where you feel you need to do something similar.

I'm doing no contact beyond the odd conversation until I get my head straight about what I want to do.
Can you bear to do the same until you can move? It sounds like you aren't having very much contact as it is.

Screen her calls and don't answer the door?

If you are caught by her do not allow yourself to get into a proper conversation - say you are busy on your way out etc and you'll call her back. If your father calls do the same?

Would a letter be easier? Will they know what you are going on about? What reaction are you expecting?

I agree with Poorly - you may have to cut contact with other people that are connected to them as well.

I think avoiding contact and only responding to any attempts at contact as much as politeness demands is probably the way to go here too.

OP - I feel for you, after a long spate of horrible arguments and no agreement or truce in sight, we 'cut off' DH's parents, and they do live close to us. Having said that they never used to make any effort to visit us, which speaks volumes really.

I think the 'conversation' you are planning won't really help much TBH, you'll probably get fallout whether you tell them you're cutting them off or if you just do it! By telling them, you're setting yourself for a big fight, so I would avoid them from now on and try to at least delay the inevitable...

Good luck

PS - we did tell them they weren't welcome anymore and we needed some space. They went nuts and tried to create all kinds of trouble for us.

In hindsight we wish we'd just started avoiding them and using excuses until they'd got the message.

In a similar position and just wanted to say that I empathise.

I had wanted to cut my mother out for 5 years - I say wanted, it wasn't ideal, just the 'best' outcome really. I stopped actively seeing her or sending cards but had awkward conversations if saw her in the supermarket. She then ignored my sister (who had still been making efforts with her) one day so the next time I saw her, I ignored her. There was no formal conversation. We live near each other and walk past each other every now and again and I have to walk past her house on my way to work. I see her once in a while, but we don't talk. Obviously it's weird, but it's the way it is. I just hold my head up high and walk past, much of the time I'm okay, but even if I'm faking it, I pretend. If I need a meltdown about it, I have one. I haven't spoken to her in 9 years - except for when she accosted me in town, quite aggressively and said 'you still aren't talking to me then?'. I responded calmly and firmly, explaining, 'I have nothing to say to you' (I have no interest in giving her a character assassination in public). I haven't had a birthday or Christmas card for her in 9 years either. I accept that we have to exist in the same world, and if we can go about our business separately, lets leave things at that. She knows where I live and how to contact me, but I've never heard from her.

I did move away when I was a bit younger, and it was great never seeing her, but I moved back home - turns out, I missed the rest of my family and friends much more than I disliked her. However, if I'd won the Euromillions this weekend, I'd have taken the three minute walk to her house and cheque for a million quid and said, 'mother, you gave me the gift of life and all that jazz, but take this money and kindly piss off to another corner of the globe and never darken this postcode/county/country/continent again. Ever'.

Good luck with your decision, it is so difficult, but sometimes you have to make the best of a bad situation to save yourself. Sorry for the self-indulgent ramble!

bint

I remember you well from previous postings and I don't think you need to actually speak to them at all. Any conversation with them will not go well and you'll just end up feeling worse.

These two have treated you appallingly in the past; please do not feel guilty about the children here with regards to them. These two acted ghastly with regards to your wedding were they not?.

They would start on any children as they have you given the chance or opportunity; toxic family stuff like this can easily become a generational problem. Toxic individuals like these do not change; they see kindness and gentleness as weakness and exploit that for their own selfish ends.

Agree entirely Attila - I observed that everything to with my mother was a repeat of how she'd been parented, and decided that she was like a cancerous growth that required removal.

Yes I have and like Poorly it's meant cutting out contact with other family members too but as some of them were equally as upsetting that's been fine. I feel terribly guilty about it sometimes but it's best for me, my DH and my DCs.

I have finally (and not before time, as Attila will probably testify!) decided this after sending an email to Radio 4?s ?You and Yours? last week, which was actually read out on the programme. It was about children being used as weapons in divorce and the damage it can do, and I emailed in about the fact that it?s still happening to me even though I?m now 33. My father decided to virtually ignore me at my own wedding, made a speech about how parenting is such a huge sacrifice, but at least he stuck around to do it (it was quite subtle but the subtext was clear to anyone who knew a bit about my situation) and he rounded it off by turning his back on me and leaving without saying goodbye to me. All this because I invited my mother to my wedding.

In the last week since I emailed the programme I?ve just been getting angrier and angrier ? I had to interact with them slightly as it was my father?s birthday but I?ve just been getting crosser and crosser that he has behaved so utterly shitely and gets away with it every single time. I can?t believe I even spoke to him after that, and especially after hearing his speech at my half- sister?s wedding about 9 months later, where he was gushing about how fucking marvellous she is ? the contrast was stark.

I think whilst I have to see/speak/deal with them there will always be weeks where I am fuming like this and I don?t think there?s any way I can really start to heal until I get them out of my life.

I think I could deal with losing touch with any other family members ? I hardly see any of them anyway, and if they come down on the side of my parents rather than mine then I don?t see it as a huge loss, to be honest. Since my gran died it?s freed me up to back off, which sounds strange but I would have hated to upset her ? and frankly, she would have taken my father?s side and cut me out.

Attila - I'm always amazed by your memory! I always really appreciate your advice, amd I think you're right again!

I just really struggle with the pracicalities of it, but I think this last week I've been angry enough to finally accept what needs to be done and follow through. It's just hard to stop living in hope but I have to do it for everyone's sake - I'm sure I've been hell to live with this last week.

Risotto thanks for your post - have you managed to stop caring? That's the part I struggle with. Must have taken a lot of guts to blank her out that first time?

Thanks everyone for posting, I'm sorry you've all had to deal with this kind of crap too!

Bint, I also remember you, and I had a toxic grandmother (dad's mum) and my mother LONGED to cut the evil bag out of her life but my dad wouldn't let her, as he never wants anyone "upset".

My gran used us grandchildren as weapons and it was grim. In the end my mum managed to cut her out by stealth in that my mum organised all the family visits and holidays and so kept "forgetting" to arrange trips to see gran, and when gran visited, mum would arrange for me to be round my friends and then pretend that me visiting my friend was a long standing thing she just couldn't change.

I wish other members of the family had stood up to gran, but then, she would never have accepted for one minute that she was in the wrong, she thought slagging her kids off was a mother's job, and in return, they should all adore her. I'm getting angry just typing this and she's been dead 15 years!!!!!!!

"I think whilst I have to see/speak/deal with them there will always be weeks where I am fuming like this and I don?t think there?s any way I can really start to heal until I get them out of my life." Yes yes yes, this is how I feel too.
It was my MIL who said 'over the past 7 years or so I have seen you get stressed before you see your mother, hate seeing her, then worry, stress and cry after seeing her, enough is enough' (7 years because that's when she started paying attention, I think).
I find when I have any interaction with her now (a phone call for example) I am just a wreck for a couple of days - I mean, I carry on as normal but inside I am just seething.

Obviously the only way to get rid of this is therapy but I'm not quite ready for that yet for some reason.

Unprune - sounds like you have a lovely MIL, which helps a lot I imagine? I bit the bullet and went for counselling last year, which was helpful at the time but am starting to feel like I need to go back. Basically it boiled down to the fact that I need to change my responses, not look to them to change. Which is great in theory but quite hard to put into action.

Hi Miggsie. That's the thing, isn't it, the anger is so hard to get rid of. My mother's been telling me to imagine good things happening to them and to wish them the best, and whilst I don't wish them any ill (as such) I find it so hard to forgive them for how they treated us. Especially now I have kids, I understand that it's hard and people get stressed but they were and are so incredibly self centred and I just can't get my head around how our welfare was secondary to their pointscoring. I really don't know how to diffuse all the anger, I wish I did.

just wanted to say, i totally understand where you are all coming from. i get really anxious when have to interact with either of my parents who divorced when i was younger. i get constant rejection from both of them, but every now and again they may say something a little more positive and i fall for it, then it goes back again. they are both very similar despite being apart for around 20 yrs. my H left me around 15 months ago and i realise i went for a similar relationship with him as that is what i was used to. i spoke to my mother tonight, she called from abroad this was around 1.5 hours ago and i am soo angry with what she said and the messages she gives out without probably realising. she will be none the wiser and i hope to god one day i will be free from the 3 of them. :-(

single - "every now and again they may say something a little more positive and i fall for it, then it goes back again." Yup. That's exactly it. And honestly, short of just not speaking to them anymore, I don't know what you do. Is it something you've thought about, just ending all contact?

What bugs me, is that if I don't formally discuss it with them, SM will keep phoning. If she tries my mobile and I don't pick up she leaves arsey messages on the answerphone or on DH's phone saying "I don't know where Bint is, I can't seem to get hold of her" and gets her knickers in a knot if I'm not instantly accessible (and having two young children I'm often not). I don't know if that's a control thing as well, but anyway.

Then if I do have a conversation with them it will turn into a fight. They will claim to have no idea what's wrong with me and make out like I'm just mental/depressed/victim of my mother's sinister brainwashing. At no point will they take stock and bear any responsibility. I have tried nearly two years ago to resolve this by writing a letter but they just twisted it all and said they were devastated and had no idea what they had done to deserve it and I must be depressed. I just can't be arsed with any of it.

The worst is that I start doubting myself - they tell me it's all my "perception" and no one can make me feel crap except me, and then I start wondering if it really is all in my head.

Don't let anyone tell them it's you - they are just deferring blame and responsibility.

With regards to my experiences ignoring her, I found that I was so angry with her for ignoring my sister that it made it a bit easier to do, she was only getting a taste of her own medicine. Obviously it is weird to think she was my mum and now we blank each other, but its better than the emotional abuse I was getting, which still isn't motherly.

As for caring...I feel numb to it. I don't hate her, I'm not angry, I'm not anything (for the most part - I do of course have a bad day every now and again, but it passes). It is sad and it seems so silly that things have turned out as they have, but there seems to be no better way. I suppose if something happened to her, that would be difficult and I know she needs some looking after as it is, but, and I say this in the least bitter of ways, she moved on to a new family, and as far as I'm concerned, they can look after her (I suppose knowing she has a new family eases my conscience a bit, maybe it would be harder if I knew she was alone). I probably sound really hard nosed, and I assure you I'm not, like I said, I'm not angry or bitter, but at the end of the day, she wasn't bothered when we needed her to love us and be there for us (when we were still children). I also suspect she has narcissitic tendencies and posts on this board tell me that if you have a narc in your life, they need to go.

Bint I know exactly where you are coming through with some of this stuff although my parents didn't divorce - my mum died when I was 18 and my brother was 13 and my dad was dating within 2 months, engaged after 4 months and married 7 months after her death.

My SM has two children and the difference in the way we were treated was incredible. I was sheltered from some of the worst of it as was at uni but my brother got the brunt. We were treated like second class citizens in the home - had to ask to watch TV, eat anything, have a bath etc. Even our cat was less favoured than their cats.

The worst things were being dragged into their arguments. I remember me and DB being dragged out of bed by her in the middle of the night (her DCs left alone) and made to come downstairs to watch her scream at dad and hit him and tell him what a bastard he was.

On top of that there was the way she would deliberately cause arguments with us and make him choose between her and us. E.g. one summer I was staying there and I had arranged with dad that I would pay for my calls to my boyf. She caused a massive row about this and I was asked to leave.

I was constantly made to feel not good enough - like I was doing the wrong thing all the time. Despite this I did my best to be 'friends' with them both and to keep them in my life.

Anyway, the final straw for me came when I got angry about being dragged into more of their crises when I was pregnant with DD two years ago. The anger made me realise I just couldn't do it anymore. They are now divorced. Dad is in a home with alcohol induced alzheimers and brain damage (drinking related) and I don't speak to either of them.

I'm sorry this is a long post and I hope it helps. I posted a lot on here a couple of years ago when the last big traumas were happening and it was so helpful.

Dastardly - that's all really sad. Bad enough to lose your mum but to have her replaced within 7 months with someone like that must have been horrendous. Good on you for doing what you needed to do to keep you and your daughter out of it.

Stories like that make me feel slightly like I'm being over the top about things, because they never argued in front of us and always created a united front. My SM would put me down all the time but it was more low level than what you describe, just sort of constant belittling and criticising me. My dad just stood back and let her get on with it. She also used to get really offended by harmless stuff I used to say and make out to my dad (and her parents) that she was really upset and offended by me. One time when I was 8 her dad came flying down the street to the field we were playing in shouting at me that if I ever upset his daughter like that again he's give me "a bloody good hiding." I was 8 and my dad just sat back and let this kind of thing go on, but it all seemed so low level that no one noticed and even I used to think that it was just how life was and it was what I deserved.

makingrisotto (you've put the idea in my head and that's what we're having for tea tonight!) You don't sound at all hard nosed. To be honest that's the sort of state I'm aspiring to. I think I'm getting closer, I'm just a bit frustrated with myself that I'm still here posting about this shit about 3 years on from when I started and I'm not massively further on. THis is what makes me think that it's all or nothing with them.

Bint but that's exactly it you are not being over the top. My SM did the same to me - I'd get told off for saying the most innocuous thing where they decided it was offensive.

I was once staying at my friend's house and we were picking up my step-sis to take her out with us. We realised we were going to be late so I rang her to tell her we'd be about half an hour later than we'd originally said.

We picked her up as agreed. All well - went out having fun. About half way through the night my dad rang me and started having a massive go at me about how I'd caused a huge argument between him and SM. Apparently SM was annoyed with me because I wasn;t sufficiently apologetic to step-sis for being late and she was really upset. She was out with us and didn't look upset so I asked her and she'd said no she wasn't upset, she just went back upstairs to her room when we said we were going to be late.

I might not be making sense but it's similar - that constant sense of being in the wrong while the person that's supposed to be on your side lets it happen to you.