Not sure where I'm going with this...

[shoormal]

I guess the title says a bit about how I'm feeling just now. It's taken me ages to think about typing this but I have to get some of it out somewhere I guess. I'm pretty new to MN so this all feels a bit new.

A couple of months ago my H told me that he doesn't want our relationship to carry on. We've been together for 22 years and married for 18. I asked on MN for, and gratefully received, some practical advice about the house but I'm finding myself struggling emotionally just now.

Only a couple of real life friends know that there is anything wrong just now as I don't want everyone knowing before I talk to my daughter who is almost 14.

I get very confused about our situation as for some reason I seem to forget what our conversations about our situation consist of and I don't think I ever get any straight answers to any questions. For example when I mentioned we'd probably have to sell the house, his reponse was 'Well what do you think you are entitled to?' which immediately made me think I'm probably entitled to nothing as we didn't have a joint mortgage (I've since found out that's not the case).

I'm not entirely shocked at our situation as I have often wondered why my H is married at all let alone to me. He spends virtually all of his time on the computer (doing god knows what) and very little time with me and our DD. He is a teacher so I cut him a lot of slack as I know he's busy but it's a bit ridiculous really.

The original conversation about us splitting up started because he told me he was no longer going to try and have sex with me as he didn't like the way he felt when I said no. We've always had differing sex drives and he would like a lot more whereas I can take it or leave it. I then found myself thinking 'well if he doesn't want sex from me there's very little evidence to suggest he wants anything else so what's the point?'.

I'm not entirely sure if I'm making sense here or even what I want from writing this down but I need to sort something out in my head.

He has said that we don't need to change anything till our DD leaves school but I don't think I can live like this for 4 or 5 years.

Thanks for listening.

I know it may seem like an obvious answer - but would he go to counselling with you?

Even if he wont attend counselling with you , you should go by yourself.

Do you think he means it , or is possibly saying this to make a point about sex , seems ridiculous hes saying nothing needs to change for the next few years.

Thanks for the response comtessa. I think we're too far down the road for that. We did discuss it a couple of years ago but if I'm honest I think I agree that we should split up.

For whatever reason I'm finding it a lot harder than I thought and feel constantly confused and pretty down about it all.

Irony is that I'm a qualified counsellor and know all sorts of techniques to change the way I think and not get caught in depression but it seems to be very hard to apply to myself just now.

I think you're probably right and I should go to a counsellor though. I feel like a total mess (physically and mentally).

Im not surprised.
Do you think he means it , and if so , why hasnt he taken steps to seperate ? Has he mentioned it again since or raised the sex issue ?

Do you sleep in seperate rooms ?

Thanks dignified.

I do think he means it which logically is really okay.

He's not a 'man of action' so I get the feeling it's better the devil you know for now. The sex issue has not been raised since but we'd talked about it quite a lot before and I'm fed up of telling him not to take it personally that I just don't feel like it.

For now we're still in the same bed (it's a big bed so we can actually avoid each other!).

There just seems to be very little communication between us now and I feel he's being cold towards me in case I think he's changed his mind (I know he won't and don't want him to).

He was married before I met him (I had nothing to do with the break-up) and went through a pretty nasty divorce so I think he's wary of it happening again.

Its sad if he pereceives your value to be sex , although i may have misread that. If you think things are over you really need to think about what to do next .

Some people suggest doing nothing for a year , they consider all options and plan things carefully , others just want out right now . What do you want to happen now ?

"he was no longer going to try and have sex with me as he didn't like the way he felt when I said no."

Have you discussed divorce?

When he says you don't need to change anything until DD leaves school, what he means is that he doesn't feel the need to change anything. He isn't thinking of DD's best interests (because this isn't), just his own. Therefore, don't rely on him to tell you accurately what you are entitled to, because of course he won't if it means your actions force him to take some of his own.

You can change the way you think but unfortunately there are only so many ways you can think about how other people hurt you. Given time and space, however, may be a differnt story.

It saddens me tremendously really. I don't know if it's true of if it's just a product of my low self esteem which seems to have taken a particular battering just now.

I think what I want is for us to rub along till after new year and then sort things out during next year.

I really need to find a job (been unemployed since redundancy last year) so that I can have as much financial independence as possible. I get very very scared of debt and being reliant on the state - I've not claimed anything all the time I've not been working with the result my redundancy money is almost gone.

My H has always hated the idea of me being financially dependent on him and it's one of the few things we'd actually row about.

does he do his bit around the house at all ?

because if all he wants is a house-share situation for the next 4 years, I would hope that you are not the one doing all the housework, shopping, laundry etc etc etc

Hmm - good question re housework.

No he doesn't do much around the house. One thing that completely pisses me off about myself is that I seem to have a totally stupid idea that because I only used to work part time (latterly this actually meant working 90% of full time) that I should do the house stuff. And I have always been without doubt the primary carer for our daughter (which has a positive outcome in that we are very close).

I think that what I am trying to sort out in my head is where I've gone a bit wrong in all of this. By that I mean where I seem to have managed to lose the independent quite feisty person I can be outside of my marriage.

so, do you just want to be his housekeeper then ?

I am not being horrid, I just think this bloke needs a kick up the arse, tbh

in house share situations (like he is proposing) all the participants usually do their fair share of the drudgery, regardless of working hours/income etc

you are not a domestic appliance

What is he proposing then? That you live a lie for years (children don't always leave home at 18/19)? Can you do that?

Or is he proposing that you tell everyone that you're separated but living under the same roof, in which case that normally means having separate sleeping arrangmenents?

And does that mean you're both free to have other partners?

A wonderful poster recently commented on how much you can read from in the language chosen and I agree with her. Therefore I picked up on this line in your OP:

"He spends virtually all of his time on the computer (doing god knows what)"

What do you think is going on here and has really provided the catalyst?

Is he Autistic? That sounds like the nicest explaination for him.

How do you think this is affecting your daughter? I wouldn't think it is good for her mental health.

OP, I sympathise. You must feel very lonely in that marriage. I suspect you will only recover that independent feistiness when you are able to move on i.e. when DH moves out.

Is he a good hands on parent? If not particularly, then perhaps things would be better for all of you if he were to leave now and not in 4 years time.

The good thing about being married is it doesn't make any difference whose name the house or mortgage is in when you split assets on divorce: for a long term relationship, you should get a half share, including a half share in his pension which may make you feel a little more comfortable financially.

Take some legal advice and, in the meantime, find yourself training/ a job and tell DH he is doing half the housework. Write a list of chores and divide them fairly.

Sigh, you can't languish as you are doing without sinking to a low place indeed . Once DH is gone, you will be able to find the woman you once were .

You're right - I certainly don't want to be his housekeeper. Perhaps that's part of where the problem is - I feel like that's all I am sometimes.

I think he is proposing that we live a lie and I'm not prepared to do that which is why I need to be the one to take action and move things on. That seems to be how we do things actually - he says something then it seems to be left to me to get on with it.

I know a lot of his time on the computer is doing preparation work for school. He also plays a lot of games and chats to people. I have no idea if these are men or women and have never felt the need to enquire. Neither of us are jealous or possessive which I've always seen as a big plus in our relationship. For years we have led largely separate lives and perhaps this is just a natural end to it.

I'm surprised how hard it feels though - I didn't expect it to hurt somehow.

I do wonder if the catalyst is someone else in his life. When I asked him if he was seeing someone else I got some obfuscated reply about 'why I would need to know'.

Apologies - I keep cross posting.

mummytime - He's definitely not Autistic although I agree it would be a nice explanation.

Notsocrates - Thanks for the financial reassurance - that side of it really panics me.

Also, financially speaking. Claim the benefits that you are entitled to. There is really no shame in it. You are trying to find work and it's called Jobseeker's Allowance for a reason. Give yourself a chance, please.

of course it hurts

perhaps it's more for what might have/should have been ? Your dd is growing up now and you should be looking forward together to more freedom to do things as a loving couple

you would have to be made of stone to not feel like that

he doesn't seem too bothered though...I would hang on to that if I were you, when you feel upset

you can still have that loving future...when you have both moved..with someone else who will appreciate the fantastic woman you undoubtedly are

Thanks AF

I'm glad I posted, it does help to hear what other people think and see in what I wrote.

yeah, nothing like getting it down in good ol' black and white

I hope you are OK, love

you will be ok

If you were to divorce now, whilst you are unemployed and he is earning, it is possible that you would get a better financial settlement than if you are earning. (Husband may know that). You could seek maintenance for yourself and later seek to capitalise it. You will be entitled to maintenance for your child if she lives with you. It is important that you prepare yourself for a financial settlement by photocopying or retaining the original if they are yours, all the documents you can: all bank statements his and yours, building society, savings, any pension documents etc. Men hide their assets when they start to consider separation or divorce. He may well find a new partner before you know it, and he/she may well encourage him to hide his assets. You will expect to receive (as a starting point only) about one half of the matrimonial assets, (more if you are unemployed or sick). However, you will need sufficient funds to house your daughter, if she lives with you whilst she is a minor. However, you will not be able to claim one half of assets you don't know exist unless he tells you about them. He may not disclose everything. He may well start heavy spending. If he does, make sure you know the cost of the items bought. Divorcing men often buys babe-magnet cars. Look for expenditure that could be meals for two. Get some good help from an experienced matrimonial lawyer as only by having all the facts, can you get accurate advice. Good Luck

Autistic? Doesn't sound like a nice explanation to people who actually have autism.

"When I asked him if he was seeing someone else I got some obfuscated reply about 'why I would need to know'."
At best it sounds as if he's just enjoying keeping you at arm's length on it but it does sound like a yes :(
My concern is that you seem very resigned to accepting his explanations - or rather, lack of. Is this because, if he told you he had a change of heart, would you go along with that too?

Please do arrange to see another counsellor ASAP - you sound very ground down and saddened by this and you need someone to help you get your energies back so you can start securing yourself financially.

shoormal I have seen a few original posts like yours in the past 2 years on Mumsnet. Women who believe that their marriages have hit the buffers through "natural causes". By the time their Hs get around to delivering hackneyed messages such as "I love you, but I'm not in love with you" or "I think we should split up, but let's carry on living in the same house", the reaction of their spouse seeems to be fatalistic and resigned, acknowledging that the marriage has run out of steam.

You'd be amazed though how often women convince themselves that it was mostly their fault, for not wanting sex enough, not being affectionate enough etc. Unfortunately, very few of them remember when this first started, but automatically blame themselves.

Until that is, they come on here and post "between the lines" and suggest what they had thought previously unthinkable; that their H has been having an affair and that is why their marriage has hit the buffers. That their H has done a very effective number on them for a long time, causing them to feel terrible, lonely and full of self-blame.

I wondered when I saw your post, whether that's what was happening to you - and you were a "between the lines" poster.

Might be worth doing a bit of digging here to see whether the situation is as your H has described.

Apologies for the use of the word 'nice'. When I look at it I realise it was a tactless thing to say. I think I meant 'neat' as in it would explain the way he is - not in any way that it is a nice condition.

You're so right about the energy thing you know - I have felt for a long time that I have virtually no energy. I used to run and go to the gym but I can't seem to find any oomph at all and feel very guilty about it.

WWIFN - the 'between the lines' stuff is interesting. I think I'm not just entirely sure what you mean but you may well be right.

To be honest I'm not sure I really care whether or not there is someone else in his life. In fact if there was we might be able to reach a conclusion a bit faster.

Thanks again for all the replys. I'm not around much today as I'm on a course so please forgive me if I don't respond very quickly.