Archers thread #181: Panto Week's behind you! Was that the nadir? Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd enjoy playing badminton with Derek Fletcher, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Will it be onwards and upwards for TA now, or do we fear even more of these special weeks (Martin and a Christmas Carol, Scam Week, Panto Week) and sudden reinventions of long-established characters (Neil)? I for one have had enough of all that. I want a quiet period of change counting in the village shop, farming talk with suitable sound effects and village gossip over coffee at Terum or a pint in The Bull. Slowly developing storylines featuring the full cast, not a subset for a few weeks with no mention of the others, and all behaving in character. Not holding my breath we'll get any of that, though!

Over to you.

I am obviously completely out of synch with popular opinion here, as I rather like both Zainab and Khalil. Which is not to say that I don't sympathise with their mother!

Not the best writing but great to highlight issue of prejudice and racism in the countryside all the same. And also great for Lynda to see Laurence's true colours. I wonder what her next move will be, I do hope she gives him the dressing down he deserves, that would be fun!

But no excuse for how rude Zainab was to Lynda. I was almost starting to be prepared to let her grow on me but she's so awful!

Confused by the frozen pastry, is ready made really cheaper then making from scratch? I suppose maybe if buying in bulk?
With the fish, I wondered if he has been buying cheap and then pocketing the difference. How did they not notice??

I can only eat a few types of fish as have had nasty reactions to some species so I definitely want to know exactly what I'm eating. Suppose whiting is similar to cod so unlikely to have a reaction if you can eat cod but allergic reactions can be very species specific sometimes. They would be in huge, huge trouble if someone had a bad reaction and the fish was not the type advertised on menu! So I think Jolene is right to kick him out. It's not his business to take risks with. But I still don't get how they hadn't noticed all the frozen pastry.

I don’t mind khalil

@Bruisername I'm surprised they didn’t go back and rewrite Susan’s story so she was part of the horizon scandal

made me properly laugh, thank you ☺️

So... Harrison left?

Sorry, no, I thought today was Friday!

He'll be off tomorrow.

Says a depressing amount about our society that a soap opera still feels it needs to highlight racism in the countryside 30 years after it originally tackled the subject with Usha.

The fish substitution is surely a matter for trading standards? Though I wouldn’t get too exercised about the bought-in pastry: puff pastry is definitely OK not to make from scratch unless you’re very high-end, and for a pub I wouldn’t be too upset about bought shortcrust, as long as the meal itself is assembled and cooked on site. 'Home-made' is just marketing jargon.

Menu liar, so that's it for silent Wayne. Why couldn't Fallon wait until he came back and had a word with him instead she blabbed to her mum. I think she wanted her dad's job. I hope he says his not coming back (like Johnny), before they can say anything to him and Fallon goes so Bistro pub that everyone goes else where to get a nice ploughman's.

I'm really glad TA is talking about this issue

I'm not because they'll likely make a mess of it. My DD isn't white and grew up in the countryside. I've encouraged her not to go looking to take offence and to shrug off other people's stupidity. Pick her battles. She would've laughed at Laurence. She loves where we live, has experienced little racism and has gone out into the world as a confident, contented young woman because she doesn't view herself as a potential victim.

Zainab would do well to do the sane.

My daughter isn’t white and neither am I. I would never teach her to shrug off or ignore racism.

So what have you taught her?

I am white but my daughter isn't and I wouldn't ask her to shrug it off either. Laurence was awful.

So what would you do?

I've just listened again. Khalil was crestfallen after a chance encounter with a blusterer. Zainab was needling him about it whilst having a go at him because she's a bully.

She had no idea what occurred but went straight to Lynda who is showing them kindness and hospitality. She was rude to her and started to dictate what her host should do because she thinks she's entitled to be as obnoxious as she likes.

The result is both K&Z are unhappy whereas if they had laughed/shrugged it off they could've settled down to a lovely meal with Lynda and Robert.

There is a time to take a stand against racism but you pick your battles or life will be tense and tiresome.

I haven’t listened to the episode and have no idea what happened. I was just responding to your post and stating that I’ve adopted a different approach to the one you’ve taken with your daughter.

I don’t take racism lightly and I’m not raising my daughter to think it should be laughed off. Neither of us live a tense or tiresome life though:).

I do have a black friend, raised in Norfolk by kind and loving white parents who also told her to pick her battles and ignore silly racist comments. They completely failed to understand how damaging the racism she encountered was.

Zainab needn't have been so rude to Lynda especially as she didn't actually know what had happened but shrugging it off wouldn't have been right either. Lynda needed to know what he'd actually said to Khalil although I appreciate that if Khalil was upset he might not have been able to express himself just then and wanted to keep it to himself (shrug it off maybe?). Zainab seems to adopt a bullying tone in any interaction.

do we have any baddy characters at the moment? If they wanted to address racism it would be far more interesting to be a long term SL and subtle

This seems a bit bull in a china shop. Are we going to find out he worked at Yorkshire cricket club next?

I do have a black friend, raised in Norfolk by kind and loving white parents who also told her to pick her battles and ignore silly racist comments. They completely failed to understand how damaging the racism she encountered was.

And you're implying that I've done the same.

You couldnt be more wrong. My daughter would testify to that.

If you do listen to the episode, I'd be interested in your thoughts.

Me too. I really can't see what's to hate, especially in relation to Khalil whose love of animals is rather endearing.

I'm wondering about who, if anyone, checks the invoices at The Bull. You would think someone might question why they're paying for whiting when it's not on the menu.

I thought it was good and Lawrence wasn’t even being “extreme” just your Boris Johnson level - remember him saying Muslim women look like letterboxes? With an entirely believable side order of anti woke boring on.

I don’t think ready made pastry is cheaper (and why would he care) I think it’s just easier for W.

I just thought the way he spoke to khalil was subtle but with Lynda he wasn’t. And I think it would be more interesting if he had been more subtle with her - so, saying something about making sure they don’t bring their family over to take advantage or something

perhaps she will go to the interview and bring it up and create a feud between his team and ambridge

zainab is not a nice person afaic and is replacing George as resident unpleasant teen

khalil is fine - I haven’t liked the way they’ve written him at times but I can see scope for his character

I think Zainab's rudeness to Lynda (and the fact that that she and Khalil weren't keen about having to move in there) stems from Lynda's perceived racism when she first encountered Khalil. There was a big debate on here about whether what Lynda had said could be perceived as racist - the answer is it could have been and it was perceived as such. Then we had Lynda recoiling in horror at the very thought when she realised what she had done - coupled with earnest assurances that she was very much not a racist. Now Khalil has had a similar encounter with a man coming out of Lynda's house, Zainab is understandably outraged. She thinks this is Lynda's great friend - a man Lynda has been so cosy with we have been suspecting there was more to it than mere friendship. I can fully picture Laurence after last night - all jolly bonhomie, but with completely unacceptable views that he somehow thinks he can get away with because of his age and because he believes everyone of a similar age and privilege will automatically agree with him. I am also beginning to see why the SW have introduced another random character from a newly invented village (that I can never quite catch the name of) - the cricket team is just a ruse, he is there for a racism in the countryside story. I am waiting for it all to be resolved when it turns out that Khalil (or possibly his father when he returns from Pakistan) is a demon cricketer. Because of course he would be if he is to fulfil all the clichés.

I agree. His love animals reminds me of the young Gerry in My Family and Other Animals. And I find him and Zainab believable siblings. They are a great addition to the cast and they feel like real people.

I wonder what the intention is with Zainab, she’s being portrayed as directionless so she could end up doing almost anything. What do we know about her other than speedy on a scooter and rude? Did they say she’d done a levels?