Archers thread #173: The Fall of the House of Grundy? Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed, and of course we are always delighted to welcome back former or occasional listeners/posters. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you wish we were hearing more of Pip, or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from https://www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

I chose the thread title to echo one I used three years ago, which is here if anyone fancies a trip down Memory Lane: www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4320618--Archers-thread-130-The-Fall-of-the-House-of-Aldridge-Discuss-The-Archers-here. That was the thread where I caused all sorts of confusion at the start by not starting it before the old thread filled up, but others stepped in, fortunately.

At that point I see Ruairi was heading off to London to start his degree, which he has now finished, with none of us any the wiser about what he studied or where. Perhaps this will finally be mentioned now he's graduating.

And now, over to you!

What's happened to Mick these days? He and Joy have been strangely silent about George (or have I missed an episode or three?).

Is Mick still in his motorbike in the GH caroark. One assumes not, but then, where did he move it to?

@AskingQuestionsAllTheTime according to the sentencing guidelines the starting point is 4 years even with deduction for early guilty plea…

I don't want George to be put away for 4 years. He, Susan and Emma are all acting their socks off at the moment and without them we'd be left with Harrison mooing, Tony moaning and Ian boring on about the PTA.

I blame it on the Big Bang (no planet earth, no Ambridgegate).

Consider rape (another crime of taking without consent) is it the fault of the rapist (only doing her a favour), or the girl in skimpy dress who distracted him.

Both Alice and her car were taken without consent. She repeatedly said no and stop as he dragged her into the passenger seat and even as he drove away. She repeatedly told him she wanted to be sick. George had every opportunity to stop, but he ignored her, preferring to admire her car and saying how he should be rewarded by being allowed to borrow it. Even whilst she was then repeatedly ineffectively flipping the door opener, he still had time to apply the brakes. (She never actually opened the door or undid her seatbelt.) Surely coming up to a humpback bridge he should have been driving slowly anyway, although Mick’s description suggested otherwise.

Alice was in no fit state to drive or be driven, nor had any desire to do so. On the contrary she repeatedly told George no and stop. Therefore taken against her will and ability to prevent what George was doing to her. Ergo no responsibility for the accident.

George took car and Alice without consent, and against her express wishes, manhandled Alice, failed to properly secure an unpredictable load (Alice) and drove recklessly in said circs. All this could have been explained away as cack handed well meaning with little consequence, if he had not very deliberately perverted the course of justice by dragging Alice back into the drivers seat. Then let her go to court to take responsibility for his actions without admitting what he did. Later further falsifying his statement to continue to cover his tracks, after telling his mum, but still refusing to come clean. Only forced to admit his guilt after his mum was forced to shop him.

Of course the consequences of his actions on Alice were dire and the accident was pretty serious given 3 people were lucky not to have drowned and possibly responsible for the loss of Fallons pregnancy. George did contact the emergency services and render assistance, but that did not mitigate the deliberate physical act of fitting up Alice.

The fact he felt guilty, in some ways makes it worse, as he was inflicting all this on Alice and her child in full realisation of the dire consequences to them.

Well after suffering through the last ten mins of that dreadful comedy I was feeling very generous towards the archers!!

CA slip ‘The Arthur’s’ - could be interesting!!

Glad to hear Jim in the shop. Glad he’s reclaiming his space!! Not glad with the pie sl. Bonsai club 🙄. And a badly put up table 🙄

Glad Pat stepped up to help and shows that she views her employees as friends. Interesting which characters can’t look beyond revenge and which can. Glad Pat stood up to Tony, as expected.

Whilst I’m glad Emma has work at the dairy I thought she had given up terum to focus on tree surgery so why does she need any job.

No. 2 of the 3 people most affected after Alice and all we've heard was Joy mildly expressing bewilderment.

It doesn't affect sentencing. It's an opportunity for the victims to be heard.

Character references impact sentencing don’t they?

The Grundys think the character references affect sentencing.

The study linked above also states that "Victim Personal Statements" affect sentencing, which I think are the same thing as the Victim Impact Statement, as it mentions changing the name.

I disagree. I think the actress playing Emma can only do “earnest hand wringing voice”

Oh Pat, I take back everything bad I've said about you. Well done.

I wondered about that when Fallon said she was doing an impact statement. If he's not being prosecuted for the accident, why would that be necessary? She's not a victim in relation to the perversion of the course of justice offence.

I don't think that's correct. Think about, for instance, when they were planning the tree surgery business and she was positive about it. Think about that scene with Fallon and Tom when he was trying to persuade them to carry on working together: there were some fascinating nuances where Emma empathised with Fallon and understood the situation much better than Tom did, and she and Fallon were united in recognising that, much as they both regretted it, working together wasn't going to be sustainable.

Whilst I’m glad Emma has work at the dairy I thought she had given up terum to focus on tree surgery so why does she need any job.

IIRC, Emma took time off to do the tree surgery training. She then balanced the surgery work with her tea room shifts. She was hoping that eventually the tree surgery would take off enough to support her as a full-time job, but in the meantime she was still working in the tea room. She was heard to worry about losing the money once she resigned. That's my memory of it, anyway.

Yes your right @ Fink, Emma was only using tearum for inbetween money.
I like Lynda but this table piegate SL is a bit silly but at least we can hear Lynda and Jim so its not all bad.
I too think because of the collapse they should have cancelled the competition. The Bull advertising their winning pie is just rubbing noses in it.
Glad Pat didnt let Tony tell her what to do, but he is right about Brian and fag ash, Especially Brian going to be pissed about the reference.

Oh and the less we hear of Mucky Mick and Joy getting down and dirty, the better.🤮😵

Re the table collapse, I assumed it was Kenton wot dun it. Didn't we hear him faffing about tinkering with something in the Pie Room (hereinafter "PiRum"). The fact that a table was wrongly erected doesn't exonerate him. If he knew how the tables were erected, which I assume he would, it would have been the work of a moment to sabotage one. He's not exactly someone I'd offer a character reference for.

Glad Pat didnt let Tony tell her what to do, but he is right about Brian and fag ash, Especially Brian going to be pissed about the reference.

Pat is more than able to hold her own against Brian and Lilian and she is right to stick to her long held convictions about prison and rehabilitation. And I would hope that at least Tony (but not Lilian because she is thick as pig shit and Brian because it affects His Wonderful Perfect Daughter) will understand her POV when related to the waiting etc.

As for Kenton. he really is very very stupid and self-involved. OF COURSE everyone thinks he did it. He is all wide eyed and not understanding of that because he is so bloody stupid. And agree that the pie competition should have been cancelled - and nothing awarded.

In the past I’ve always appreciated the small light relief sl but they are so ridiculous now and theres often someone who is a ‘victim’ of it. Eg the stupid lounge decoration - marginalising Jim but hi hi he’s moved plato back
jazzer may have done the right thing in the end but he only did it under duress so we are to believe he is the type to steal candy from a baby
ditto robert
a whole load of victims in the pie sl!

So the things done wrong in setting up and running the show that we know about so far:

Not judging the sunflower competition using photos taken in situ with a standard measuring stick

Not having set parameters for the pie competition enabling fair judging

Not eliminating the pie competition after the table collapse

Not ensuring everyone involved in set-up knew how the tables (etc etc) worked

any more?

Who was the organiser? These things can be very competitive, the backlash against the shambles would be HUGE in a real village - and would distract everyone from George's little problem.

Good to see Pat getting her old personality back - it's been years !

And there's a certain accuracy in Tony becoming more cantankerous with the passing years 🤭

Lynda and usha?

I know the table was probably a bit weak but I do wonder if it needed a nudge to truly collapse

but would be good if this could be brushed under the carpet now and we can move on

And on Pat - note she said some pretty nice things about George and how she could see him developing. She clearly gets to know people. Whereas the rest of the family just see them as staff