Archers thread #143: In the Bleak Midwinter, Ambridge Folk Make Moan. Best Christmas ever? Probably not! Discuss The Archers here.

[Gasp0deTheW0nderD0g]

Thank you, @PseudoBadger, for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points, although we do mostly try to be civil about it. Most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd love to be in Jolene's choir , or other unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please! We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/talk/radio_addicts/4636789-the-archers-spoilers-thread-7-cant-wait-for-702pm-join-us-here, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

For newer listeners, lurkers or those who just have no idea what we're talking about, @DadDadDad has created this useful thread: www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3557323-For-Archers-fans-a-guide-to-acronyms-on-the-long-running-discussion-threads-and-any-other-meta-thread-questions-you-may-have - BOOP point for him! (See thread for explanation.)

Well, we made it through Stir Up Sunday without bloodshed, but poor Ben is now in the grip of psychotic depression. Not going to be a happy Christmas at Brookfield, sadly. When will Jill swallow her pride and go and give him the abject apology he deserves? Would it be a good idea anyway for Ben to see his gran at the moment?

Will Jazzer say yes? I hope so. We could do with a Horrobin wedding to look forward to.

Will Emma and Ed end up in court if they go ahead with this idiotic scheme to nick the logs from Peggy's Folly?

Will the two choirs put on a joint concert at Christmas? I assume so, and also that the BBC will continue to fool nobody by using recordings of what is clearly a really good well-rehearsed established choir, not a scratch choir of half a dozen novices.

Over to you!

I have no idea where the Lottie storyline's going, but it's nowhere good.....

Is it nice though? I agree with @JanglyBeads .

Me too. It's probably going to be an EE-style SL.

Given the vag/vulva stuff, maybe Rosie is going to come back from her sleepover with a full knowledge of exactly how babies are made. It'll be a replay of that thread on AIBU when someone was outraged about her neighbour's child enlightening iher 9 year old.

Rosie should know. She lives on a farm. The AI man turns up, and a few weeks later, you do a PD.

Not only did Vince appear to have been left in the dark about Ben's mental health crisis, there was also no mention of him withdrawing his loan, necessitating the selling off of part of Brookfield - that was all a bit too neatly parcelled off in the line about the sale having gone through before Ruth and David even left for the dinner (yet still no mention of who the buyer is). The apology felt more like a conversation about how Vince had overreacted to Ben's infidelity (which wasn't even an infidelity since Ben and Beth weren't together at the time) and the cancelled holiday to NZ. Very odd - and more crucially, not it any way believable. Why didn't Elizabeth properly explain to Vince the effects of his actions? Also she was the one who persuaded David to accept the loan in the first place so why isn't she more angry about this?

Elizabeth was ridiculous. How can she not care more about her nephew?

I’m shocked they’ve written it this way. All of the characters are behaving in stupid ways again.

the context of the meal was ridiculous, especially in not telling Vince about Ben’s breakdown, but the one thing that is right is the return of the selfish, self centred Elizabeth from years gone by.

i remember when Nigel died, one of my thoughts was “who is going to talk down Lizzie now” as he was so good in bringing her round. I can’t remember a full throated Lizzie tantrum/stop since the whole business of blaming David for Nigel’s death. We’re really over due.

Why on earth would Elizabeth let Vince organise a full reconciliation session without giving him the full story on Ben?

Elizabeth likes having a rich boyfriend. She is basically a gold-digger. Hoodwinked Nigel for the stately home - that hasn’t quite gone to plan given he died early so now she wants some cash and to go to fancy restaurants. David shouldn’t have gone in the first place but I am glad he marched out. I don’t particularly like David but I dislike his money-grabbing sister even less…

I also think there is something untoward about Lottie. No sane adult would take the word of her daughter’s 5 year old friend and just turn up to sleep at someone’s house without getting confirmation from an appropriate adult beforehand.

She then ensured a sleepover occurred anyway by insisting on taking Rosie. I’m surprised Pip agreed so readily to such a last minute arrangement. My 10 year old will be going to her first sleepover soon. It’s been arranged weeks in advance and I know the parents very well. I would not have let her toddle off at the drop of a hat to the home of an old school friend I hadn’t seen for decades when she was 5.

I would not have let her toddle off at the drop of a hat to the home of an old school friend I hadn’t seen for decades when she was 5.

And, if you did and it all went horribly wrong, you wouldn't blame in on someone else. Tut - you'll never make an Archer, Eastie!

Rosie is characterized more like an 8 year old: devastated not to get a particular part in the nativity, arranging a sleepover, making scrambled eggs, happy to change plans and scamper off for sleepover with a pretty unknown adult. She must be precociously confident / ignorantly written.

I would not have sent my DD, at 5, to sleep over at someone's house I had not visited.

Good point @FlosCampi

And now Russ is on Broadcasting House. I gather he’s appearing in some other ‘thing’ - so hope the publicity doesn’t presage a return to Ambridge!

Lovely to hear "Russ" again - thanks for the heads up, Totters

So ... in a surprising turn of events, Vince dumps Elizabeth. Her depression returns and Russ comes to her rescue, they fall in love and Lily strops off air.

The husband is Reuben apparently - he picked up Rosie and Madison the day Pip and Lottie's Noo-noo exchange happened.

Ignore that - I completely misheard 🤦‍♀️
Yep, Ben picked Rosie up apparently (listening to the repeat)

😂

Pip will have learned her parenting skills from David & Ruth. You have to fear for Rosie’s future.

Sorry, my comment was in response to Gonners reply.

I think Lottie and Pip could be interesting - this sort of slipping back into an old childhood friendship when they haven't seen each other for 20 years or more - literally anything could have happened to Lottie (or Pip!) but they inherently trust each other because of their history. I too wonder where it's going. Or maybe it's genuinely just so that we can hear Pip talking to someone other than her parents and siblings. I can't remember the last time she had an actual friend (apart from Stella, but she's friends with Ruth too so a bit of an odd one).

Ah, you may well be right, @Prestissimo - Lottie could just be filling a structural role (replacing Toby) rather than anything sinister! Like Leonard replacing Carol - who gave Jill a dialogue partner after Phil died.

David doesn’t seem to have any friend at all. Siblings and Brian, (to whom he’s related by marriage) are the only people he regularly converses with beyond Brookfield. Is that sad or realistic or simply an oversight on the part of the SWs?

@TottersBlankly , I'd say that was realistic. He has his business partner and wife to talk to about work and family. He has his siblings and Brine to talk to about stuff that might need an outside perspective.

Who would want to be friends with David. He is humourless, grumpy and constantly sounds world weary. I feel tired just listening to him. If you are not interested in farming, any conversation would be very limited. For all his annoying traits, Kenton (for example) is much more interesting.

Oh God - I have turned into Jim! That is exactly how I would respond and react if asked to be a … what - Matron (🤮) of Honour at a Wedding. Exactly like that. Basically terrified of all the ways I now believe younger people choose to have fun. Out of my depth. Miserable. I was even like that over online jollification at the start of the first lockdown.

Kill Me Now.

I guess Alistair will be Best Man?

True about David, though. Friendlessness is a sad reflection on his personality.