Thread 98 - Discuss The Archers here! If you don’t give a ha’porthfor Pip come and add your two penn’orth - we do enjoy a bit of change counting (especially if it’s in old money)

[Bittermints]

Many thanks to @LilianGish for the title (again - she has real gift for this!). Further thanks due to @PseudoBadger for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads and to @DadDadDad for being our resident statistician and keeping the ball rolling when Pseudo stepped back a bit.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to be Susan's best friend or other odd unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3439443-keep-it-to-yourself-the-archers-spoilers-thread-4, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

(Change counting references arose specifically out of a nostalgic discussion on the previous thread, if anyone is intrigued.)

The house that Roy has and the one JD and Brine are in must have been massive originally (it was once one, I think?). Roy has three bedrooms and the Aldridges have two. Who had it back in the day?

It belonged to Roy's parents, Mike and Betty Tucker. It was divided when Roy and Hayley were struggling to find a house they could afford.

It was the Tuckers' house. Not sure if the bedroom fairy was involved when it was divided up.

Enjoyed the whining and dining, and JD being assertive. She's never been a pushover, but in sacrificing her home (lovely kitchen and all) for her family, she's gained massive moral high ground which I hope she continues to use.

Here's some info on Mike Tucker, Roy's dad But there isn't much BBC info on Willow Farm other than on the unsatisfactory 'Ambridge Locations' page.

(Still can't preview, this could all be gobbledygook.)

Boop for Jenny telling her 40-something daughter to grow up and take responsibility for herself!

Loving "whining and dining", Errol!

I enjoyed the reference to 2nd helpings of "bean stew".

Carnivores think that's the only thing veggies eat!

Interesting that Kate's loving siblings aren't desperate to socialise with her on her return. Maybe a silent protest at the fact that her actions forced the sale of the house?

Maybe a silent protest at the fact that her actions forced the sale of the house?

I don't think they are in any position to criticise. I don't remember any of them volunteering to give up anything either to save the house. Lots of criticism and trivialising of Kate's business by all and sundry (possible exception of Debbie).

I'm no fan of Kate but the others were stupid to expect one sibiling to sacrifice their business and income stream whilst the others all went on unaffected.

It was the Tuckers' house. Not sure if the bedroom fairy was involved when it was divided up

The house was split roughly in half with Roy being given one half as "his" inheritance and Brenda due to get the other half when Mike'n'Betty died. Presumably Brenda has given up any thoughts of any kind of inheritance now.

Roy/Hayley then took out a mortgage to get a significant extension leaving them with a three bedroom house and M&B with a two bedroom cottage.

Just realised that was badly phrased. Yes, of course Toby is providing child care for himself and his child, but Pip did bang on so much about being able to go it alone that it feels like it's for her.

Yes I feel the same. Normally I'd say he is looking after his own child but its all entirely on Pip's terms and to suit Pip. So now he can't start a new business idea because people wants him handy for childcare but at other times he is surplus to requirements.

The pair of them are pretty loathsome and I notice the LSWs have made Rex a GF where Rosie is concerned as well by constantly stirring and niggling about how shit Toby is compared to St Pip of Parenthood.

Lots of criticism and trivialising of Kate's business by all and sundry (possible exception of Debbie).

I do appreciate the way the family handled negotiations were awful, from them nominating that bit of land to reacting after she backlashed to try (successfully) to force the sale of the house. I don't know if I'd manage to do much better in their shoes for that second bit either. They went about it insensitively but it IS the business that is the smallest income generator by far, is propped up by the others and is effectively a vanity project to keep Kate occupied. It was the best choice of package of land, even though they handled it badly, so did she. She didn't have to force the sale of the house, and she could have hung around to help move, and support the family instead of flouncing off for months. I If I was Jennifer I'm not sure I'd even be talking to her by now.

I'm sure she's going to be an obnoxious brat the minute she arrives back too. I go against the grain here and I like Pip, Tobey annoys me, Susan in gossip mode I hate but Kate just always permanently winds me up!

I'm no fan of Kate but the others were stupid to expect one sibiling to sacrifice their business and income stream whilst the others all went on unaffected.

Sorry, it won't let me preview, ignore the last paragraph in bold! 😳

I should imagine that Toby is rubbing his hands with glee at the way things have turned out. By accident, Pip has forced him into a corner where he has had to self-sacrificially forgo his plans in order to further her trajectory. His joy will be short-lived when he realises that being a SAHP isn't all about sitting on your backside watching daytime TV.
As ever with TA, you wonder how the finances of this will play out.

If Kate's business was properly successful, she could have done a business plan and got a mortgage to buy the land it is sitting on.

But being a SAHP could be all sitting on your bum watching daytime TV if you were a very bad SAHP, which it's clear Toby would be. And if he did have to splash out and do anything, it would be at Pip's expense.

I remember back in the day Roy and Kate had a good business selling food from a van at festivals - they worked hard and had fun. Can anyone remember its name?

If Willow cottage has 2 bedrooms, one of which is tiny then the downstairs footprint must be pretty small - surely not enough room to seat 7 (for that delicious sounding bean casserole) around a table? The houses in Ambridge are pretty magical in the way they expand and contract.

'Tiny' might be relative to Home Farm which I imagine is pretty spacious. Upstairs would have two beds and a bathroom. Downstairs might have a bigger ground floor, e.g kitchen extention.

Who is living in Blossom Hill cottage now Anisha has left?

It had a magical third bedroom.

The bean casserole was because Kate is a vegan and everyone has to eat what Kate says. I expect that her siblings didn't want to come for a meal because they knew that as well as having Kate at it, it wouldn't be the usual sort of delicious food Jennifer provides when she has a choice.

Kate no longer owns a cottage; part of the deal discussed when the partnership which overturned the partnership with Debbie and Adam was ignored (I sill don't know why neither of them mentioned going down from a one-third share of the farm's profits to a one-fifth share, or why they both agreed to it without even mentioning it) was that her cottage went back into the Home Farm estate. She worried about this "in case Adam and Debbie turned against her" but didn't seem to notice that it meant she would no longer have the income that was keeping Spiritual Home afloat.

But what I really don't understand was Toby producing the idea of a still as if it were new. The whole unlikely enterprise started because Toby got his hands on a still and started running it in Rickyard Cottage: I can still remember David's perfectly reasonable outrage when he discovered that there was an illegal still on his premises. So when did Toby stop using a still to make his gin?

I have never understood the cottages issue as Alice lives in one of them with Christopher.

And the other one must still be available for someone to live in?

AskingQuestions I can answer the gin question. Most “artisan gin” uses spirit (alcohol) made elsewhere. They buy in what is effectively vodka and re-distill it with their chosen botanicals. It’s a very simple process, anyone who can boil a kettle could do it. I helped out a micro distillery who were using their lovely shiny still clean completely wrong and still producing quite nice gin. That’s what Toby currently does. It’s a safe process because there is no chance of producing unwanted alcohols, like methanol, which is poisonous.

Making the spirit base is much more difficult. You need to ferment your base carbohydrate, grain, potatoes or as Toby said whey, then distill the resulting liquid. Getting rid of methanol and any heavier alcohols so that you only have ethanol is essential. I don’t think Toby has much idea of what he’s talking about, certainty not on a commercial scale. Part of the reason people buy alcohol is because it would be time consuming to make in bulk.

Good examples of home alcohol production are in MASH, where Pierce and Honeycutt make vodka and the Great Escape where Steve McQueen (whose character is a chemical engineer) makes a few bottles of vodka. Small stills can only produce a small amount of base spirit.

Thanks Chemenger. I imagine there are licence implications for this?

I'm no fan of Kate but the others were stupid to expect one sibiling to sacrifice their business and income stream whilst the others all went on unaffected

But the others weren't getting free board and lodging; and it wasn't necessarily a case of her sacrificing the business, simply of moving it elsewhere. Does anyone know what the financial arrangement is with Spiritual Home? If Kate pays rent I'll bet it's at favourable rates and on the basis that she doesn't expect to be evicted if she doesn't pay up.