Thread 98 - Discuss The Archers here! If you don’t give a ha’porthfor Pip come and add your two penn’orth - we do enjoy a bit of change counting (especially if it’s in old money)

[Bittermints]

Many thanks to @LilianGish for the title (again - she has real gift for this!). Further thanks due to @PseudoBadger for kicking off this long, long series of Archers threads and to @DadDadDad for being our resident statistician and keeping the ball rolling when Pseudo stepped back a bit.

All views on The Archers welcome here! New blood welcomed. We don't all agree on all points and most of us are posting tongue in cheek a lot of the time, so don't worry about revealing that you'd like to be Susan's best friend or other odd unusual views.

Spoilers: not on this thread, please. We don't wait for the omnibus to discuss the weeknight episodes, but we do try our best to avoid cross-contamination from www.mumsnet.com/Talk/radio_addicts/3439443-keep-it-to-yourself-the-archers-spoilers-thread-4, where spoilers are positively welcomed!

(Change counting references arose specifically out of a nostalgic discussion on the previous thread, if anyone is intrigued.)

Isn't the point of the surrogacy storyline to explore the variety of different viewpoints on it without taking one particular angle?

Well it may be but by putting Emma into nasty gossip mode representing the side of the woman with everyone else being caring and reasonable as the voices of commercial surrogacy they are very much taking a position.

Tonight's episode was clearly saying that opponent are small minded "neanderthals". No actual discussion on the ethics of two affluent men renting the womb of a poor migrant worker who is only doing it for the money.

Pat Fletcher is Derek Fletcher's wife isn't she? Part of the large cast of unheard characters

A lot of what Emma was saying was directed at Lexi.

I hope I've not missed anyone else posting this, but Victoria Wood did write for The Archers (for Comic Relief) and here is the link. It's glorious. What a missed opportunity to make it more permanent.

www.bbc.co.uk/sounds/play/p03s9l4v

Oh, Phil. I do miss his voice.

Oh gosh, Sid as well.

Jack Woolley too.

Goodness me, four celebrity guests!

Full theme music as well. I've bookmarked this and will listen to it again.

[Never mind an overinfested/overinvested emoticon, I need a saddo one.]

www.bbc.co.uk/blogs/thearchers/entries/41fa43b5-6067-45f7-8b9f-63eb227c0553

Thank you C8!

I don't know who Derek Fletcher is either but I've just discovered a character list on the website so will go and consult! It briefly crossed my mind that Fletcher might have been Pat Archer's maiden name, and that she might be still known as that by some, but the gnomes didn't seem in character at all!

I've never listened to that before. Straight in with Jill referring to the Brookfield children as 'Pip and the others'

Oh thank you Bittermints, what a find! I've bookmarked and will listen later

Wonderful stuff

Very funny thanks Bitter I liked the refererence to Jill's babysitting technique; tying Ben up to the mangle for 3 hours

Jenny was horrible with all that "it's not her baby" stuff.

Legally it is Lexi's baby whoever's sperm created it Ian ? (assuming Lexi isn't married in which case it's hers and her husband') Ethically I think it is her baby.

Genetically it's the baby of the donor and whoever's sperm. Ian ?

This baby is neither legally, ethically nor genetically Adam's baby

MargueritaPink - it's the other way around with Adam and Ian, isn't it? Adam is providing the erm ... material.

(Some previous thread speculation that this will lead to more interesting Aldridge (aka Archer) inheritance knottiness in the future.)

but by putting Emma into nasty gossip mode

Is she ever not a nasty person? She's one of my all-time loathes on TA, she has a very short memory about the cause of the antagonism between Eddie and Will, horrible person, the other delusional one is her mother, the apple doesn't fall far from the tree.

I don't think Jenny was being horrible. She was trying to counter Emma's emotive stuff about mothers giving up their babies by injecting some facts into the discussion. If she hadn't, you can be sure that Emma would continue artistically ignoring the fact that the baby isn't genetically Lexie's. I don't think Emma's nasty - look at the way she rallied round after Nic's death, for instance - but she can be dreadfully self-righteous at times.

Yes I would say she's chippy rather than nasty. She did excel herself this time though didn't she?

Well I don't think the scriptwriters were presenting a particular view actually.

They gave us Emma's view, Jenny's view and Ian's view. Ian's comment about neanderthals is exactly what I'd expect him to say in his position. I don't think the listeners were necessarily supposed to agree with him, were we?

MargueritaPink That's a lovely optical illusion you've created - the row of ants seems to be higher on the R than the L.

Is she ever not a nasty person?

Emma is a funny one - she is one of the rounded characters which makes her unusual and I like and dislike her at different times. She works her backside off to make a better life for her children just like Susan did - both are grafters who have had nothing handed on a plate. Both can be very annoying - I dislike Susan more than I like her but Susan would be a real loss as a character.

Emma can certainly be chippy and can also descend into nasty gossip at times but she can also be extremely kind and supportive and puts herself out to do so.

I listened to that exchange twice and I'm not sure I would have reacted differently if I found a poor, migrant worker friend was being used as a commercial surrogate by two men I regarded as village friends/decent people. The difference probably is that I'd have held my tongue for a lot longer.

Ian and Adam were spectacularly stupid not to have a plan in place for when it got out (you don't hide a pregnancy for long in a village).

I don't think I'd ever find Emma a kindred spirit but she is head and shoulders above Pip and some of the other cardboard characters.

They gave us Emma's view, Jenny's view and Ian's view

Interestingly Emma's is the only outside view of that trio. Would have been nice to hear something more nuanced from, say, Kirsty.

My screen is alternating between a parade of cute ants - which are rather charming, and a phalanx of perfectly horrid beetles which give me the creeps ...

So is mine. I have no idea why. Here is a ladybird🐞