To offer lower or no?

[MotherOfRatios]

Viewed a 1 bed first floor property £200k Woolwich I like the area, however there was no pictures of the bathroom.

I viewed and the bathroom needs some
work it's just gone on the market I want to offer lower but my gut says they'll say no.

There's a whole in the bath and bath panel (the inside one is blurred so haven't uploaded)

WYD?

I'm not sure they're necessarily lying about that, from my experience.

It sounds like the Landlord/Peabody/Company X own the freehold, and then the 70-year old woman owns the leasehold.

So you'd be buying the flat from that woman, as a leasehold purchase.

And as a leaseholder you would then pay Ground Rent every month/year to the freeholder. (Like all the other leaseholders in the building).

My solicitor said if this was the case, the woman who owns the fact would show up on the land registry and no woman just come up on any of the details. Everything is linked back to the company for the flat.

I have just received an email stating that
'The seller is a mother of the owner who is elderly and not very clear as she is not aware . As the owner has passed away which was her daughter this is why it is hard to get this information due to current owners knowledge.'

@SequinBear agreed.
@MotherOfRatios I did post much earlier upthread that a leasehold property will have two entries on the LR. One to register the existing leasehold interest (‘the old lady’) and the other the freeholder interest (‘Peabody/whoever’). You need to find both entries.

@MotherOfRatios you need to check that probate has been passed, otherwise this process could be very lengthy.

Just ringing land registry for some help.

It's up to you what you offer but I assume the price is based on the state of the bathroom. It's not a fault you have found on a survey after you have made an offer which is when you would negotiate.
So if you want to offer 195 you can but I wouldn't say it's because of the state of the bathroom. Whether they accept it or wil be willing to negotiate depends on whether they get any other offers.

@MotherOfRatios you need to check probate has been granted, else nothing can move forward until it has.

Okay, so the LR were really helpful and she's sending me over the correct thing to look at so I'll do that in two minutes I can't get hold of the estate agent to ask if probate has been passed.

@MotherOfRatios you can search the information from the probate office if you know the deceased’s name. If nothing comes up, it hasn’t been granted.

I don't know the seller's name I only just found out that someone had died.

Does this mean it's been granted?

@MotherOfRatios yes. They appear to have died intestate, hence the letters of administration

Further update I have been given two different prices this morning for service charge and ground rent which prompted me to ring Peabody who is the management people for the building. I spoke to them and their service charge £537.80 I saw that flat and he thinks the flat is a shared ownership property and he said this happens a lot where things go through probate people sell the flat and then not aware where that it's shared ownership and it's only when the solicitor realises that it comes people pulling out.

I did think the number on the property and the leasehold document was awfully low I think it's probably shared ownership and they're not aware of it.

I do find it quite shocking that the estate agent doesn't know about the probate situation it seems that they've just listed it on the market and not done any of the legwork before listing either though or state agent just needs to pass this to someone more senior.

You need to establish whether it is shared ownership property before anything else. Ask the estate agent whether your £205K offer covers 100% of the property or if not what proportion you are buying. Ask them to establish whether or not it is a shared ownership property as you have been advised that it may be. Looking at that grant of Admin, the gross value of the estate is about £83K and not the full value you are being asked to pay.

Then decide whether you want to continue or not. Don't spend any money until you know.
Estate Agents sounds really dire, really basic stuff has been overlooked, they should know about the ownership, probate situation, ground rent , service charge.

Luckily, I haven't spent more than £10 so far.

If it is shared ownership and the deceased has not managed to staircase to 100% they cannot sell it to me. It has to go to the housing association for them to list as a resale. Unless the property is outright owned 100% percent, I won't be touching it.

@MotherOfRatios At least you know what to ask for the next one. Absolutely walk away from shared ownership. I’d also be reporting the EA to their advertised governing body. You could have got as far as a survey/mortgage arrangement fee before finding this out!

I'm honestly quite shocked. I can't believe that they have really listed a property with no details about the backstory even when I looked at the land registry. I think they have also made a mistake with the lease. when the deceased bought the property she bought it with 125 years in 2004 they advertised it as 110 year lease but by my calculations, it actually has 105 year lease. I'm pretty certain it is a shared ownership property unless when she died, the mother paid the remaining amount off.
i'm just so shocked that the estate agent did not think to get all the details out of the seller before listing it.
I probably wouldn't have known this though if I didn't think to ring the housing Association and get that figure out of them to ask the question and why is it so high?

i'm glad to know that you can report them because this whole experience has truly been shocking. They were supposed to get it back to me by 6 pm and I've had no response.

Edit I'm Back!

The owner has permission to sell 100% (I've seen it in writing) they only wrote to the HA 8 days ago for the service charge details.

I've been sent all the emails and things also from the email exchanges it's 105 years on the lease not 110, I did plan to stay in for 5 years.

Viewed a shared ownership property today it was super small!

Starting to feel incredibly defeated about finding somewhere!

I'm an exLA owner is Woolwich. Ex LA & HA flats are extremely good value in this area. Shared ownership imo is a total scam.

The bathroom is a none issue for me. Internal plumbing is. Do another visit and check all drains are not slow (bath, bathroom sink and kitchen sink). Also check the exterior of the building for blocked drains and funny smells. Can be an indicator of building plumbing issues which if present will be ongoing, not a biggie just regular unblocking (once or twice a year) may be required and they may try to get you to do/pay for this when they should and actually you cant from inside.

If buying LA they need to disclose if there has been any notice of major works. As a leaseholder you will be liable for a percentage of any of these. And when the last was done. This is because it's capped at x amount every x years. I presume LA is the same. Be prepared to be a little ripped off but Greenwich is actually very fair compared to others like Southwark. I presume HA is similar.

I would also ask to ensure that they've disclosed if any complaints have been made from the property eg. Noise, antisocial behaviour etc. They have a legal requirement to tell you any made in x years.

Also visit the property at different time of day/night. There is also a map of reported crime across London to check it's not a hot spot. Woolwich is imo safe, never had a issue as a young woman, but has anti-social behaviour issues such a street drinking and young teen gangs that street sell who get moved from area to area. The safer neighbourhoods team are pretty on it but does rely on residents to report and if there is someone in you're building that wishes to facilitate it you're in for a nightmare.

These issues are not exclusive to Woolwich or ex LA/HA in general but they are what I would check for next time.

I actually have no sense of smell, which is probably the worst for viewing properties. I went when it was pitch black and yeah, there was the usual Boy in cars, but it doesn't bother me as that similar to where I live now.

I work in public affairs so I know the area quite well as I had to do some work on the area last year. I like the area and I think if I did the kitchen and bathroom I could probably bump up the price a bit when I come to sell.

It's HA not LA, getting the information out of the HA has been a nightmare.

Yes, I agree shared ownership is a scam, I earn £49k after mortgage and bills. I'll be left with about £1.3k I'll have to ditch some of my nice things, but I suppose that's better than being in the house share where you don't like it and hopefully mortgage rates will go down so my mortgage might go down eventually.

I know a girl in the block of flats a stone throw away from the flat so I've just sent her a message to ask her more about the area as she also bought her flat.

Little update

still no service charge and apparently the old woman is getting quite stressed because she can't continue to keep paying the rent on the property. I am working with the housing association to try and get the service charge however it seems the service charge if I'm buying outright should be paid direct to a management company and she's trying to work out who this is. It's actually quite worrying given that mortgage rates are increasing.

Yeah. I'd walk away. The vendor's financial situation is not your problem. Don't be guilted in to buying a pup.

How does the old lady not know how much service charge she pays or to whom?

Due to the circumstances they've waived the rent and service charges