If you use a wood burning stove - what would change your mind?

[letmeeatinpeace]

I live in a densely populated area in London, and the smoke from wood burners seems to be getting worse each year (it's coming into our home).

I'm intrigued to hear from people who use wood burners whether there's anything that would possibly change your mind to stop using them?

I would really love to persuade our smoke-producing neighbours to be more considerate and switch them off, or at least switch to something smokeless, so any tips on how to go about it in a positive way would be much appreciated.

I don't actually know which property it's coming from - it's probably several.

Would dropping leaflets with useful info about smokeless fuel, and proper stove usage be appreciated..? I'm pretty desperate..! (I'm borderline asthmatic, and really worry about my dc's exposure)

Also, is smokeless fuel genuinely smokeless?

(I will also go down the route of contacting my council, if needed, but I just don't imagine they'd do much specially as we don't know where it's coming from)

For me it was realising how bad the health impact of using a wood burner is INSIDE the home.

I knew I could smell the wood smoke so could guess it wasn't completely funnelling outside, but then I saw the stats (it's like running a lorry in your sitting room) and realised exactly what I was doing to my kid's asthma.

We have one because we simply can’t afford to heat the entire house. So we heat one room with a fire. Energy prices would have to drop significantly for us to stop using it.

Would dropping leaflets with useful info about smokeless fuel, and proper stove usage be appreciated..?

Honestly, no it wouldn’t. We all have to live alongside people who make different choices to us and do things that we don’t agree with. I think you ought to mind your own business.

Threads about wood burners are always started by people living in London and then the replies are mostly people who say they live in the middle of nowhere and have a wood burner because they have free wood/no mains gas etc. If that's what you live it's obviously not a problem but it's also not what OP is complaining about!

I think it's mostly ignorance. I have a friend who recently bought a very nice property in London with a wood burner installed and was telling me how nice it is. She has zero problem with the cost of heating her home via gas boiler and modern radiators. I asked whether she didn't worry about the effect on air quality and she just looked at my blankly - she had no idea and only considered how nice it looks - she posts a lot about interiors on Instagram. I think it's just selfishness and/or ignorance in cities. I don't think people should be allowed to use them at all in built up areas.

you can order leaflets from Mums for Lungs, definitely do that. And write to your MP and local councillor. They should be banned unless someone can evidence they have an alternative or live a considerable distance from another property

@IfYouDontAsk we do usually as a society restrict choices which negatively impact on the health of others e.g. passive smoking.

send these Christmas cards!! https://www.mumsforlungs.org/news/christmas-cards-2023

See the thing is, I don’t actually think households on an income of £31,000 or not much above would be able to spend ££££s on insulating their house. Particularly not as they are the cohort of people that are being squeezed for everything else right now as well.

Also, I don’t particularly think it is fair either. Why should households on under £31,000 get a grant to improve their homes, which will make them more comfortable and also add value, when those over do not? There are after all sorts of reasons a family earn less than £31,000, including one person working part time, which is a choice. Sorry to rant but I’m getting a bit sick of always missing out because me and my husband get up and go to work every day in jobs we spent years qualifying for. Most people in this country had a better chance than I did at getting a decently paying job, and if I managed it I don’t see why they can’t.

Well I’m afraid mine will be on all day today. It’s snowed overnight here. It’s cold. We don’t live close to neighbours. We have very well seasoned wood so you can’t smell it anyway. My other option is oil which is environmentally awful and heats the entire house rather than just the room I need to be in.

tbh if you live in London you’ve got bigger particulate concerns. The traffic pollution is horrendous.

@IfYouDontAsk Thanks for being honest.

Do you have neighbours nearby? How do you feel about spreading smoke to your them, some of which may be children or have breathing issues?

I’m genuinely interested to hear your thought process as I can’t wrap my head around it. It’s one thing respecting other people’s choices, but when those choices directly impact others it becomes harder to understand.

@Sandpitnotmoshpit Wow I didn’t realise how people can be so oblivious.

They are poisoning their own lungs too. I can't understand why anyone is still using them, especially people with kids.

We only have one neighbour presently with one and they have a young child. I find it strange to do it these days (we are on the gas network).

OP, please go after people with old stoves or who are burning wet wood, and stop lumping everyone in the same category.

We don’t have one. But we have two neighbours who do. One burns I don’t know what and it stinks. The other neighbour burns seasoned wood and describes himself as a ‘wood nerd’. I wouldn’t know the second had a wood burner but my god the stench when the one who burns anything puts his on. I’m tempted to reach out to the council for advice … don’t live in London but a 60s house / road so close together.

But it is shortening your life? I understand you like the smell. But it is physically harmful.

OP, I have learned a few things in this thread about the impact on lung health. This is very much on my mind at the moment, as I have had a very scary few weeks where a nodule was found on my lung and I had to have a CT scan to investigate for lung cancer and other possibilities. Thankfully I am fine, but I don’t take it lightly.

We honestly can’t afford to completely retire our log burner right now - the house we moved into is a doer upper anyway and at the moment we are at the stage of bare floorboards and no skirting, so it’s about as drafty as can be. However, I am going to speak to my husband about only using the log burner at the weekends and cranking the heating up during the week, even though we can hardly afford it.

Ultimately most people with central heating who have wood burners use the burners because they're a) cheaper and b)cosy.

The cosy factor you'll never replace. I think it's natural for us to be drawn to real fire, and flickering orange tissue paper on a fan heater won't r place that.

If you can smell it that bad though, my guess would be that your neighbours are burning CRAP. Some people (including my mother) use coal in theirs, which stinks and fucks up the flu. lots of people also chuck all their rubbish on there too like crisp packets, etc.

But I don't think you'll persuade those people with a leaflet.

Op you live in London with a child with asthma. Can I ask why?

Presumably it’s a trade off, for you personally the value in living in London with the higher income and access to lots of “stuff” is worth the exposure to extremely high levels of particulates from traffic. It’s a decision you’ve taken to take that over cleaner air for you and your child.

Others make the same choice only their choice is to have the heat in their homes - trade off being that if they have an older stove that isn’t defra rated there might be some particulate release into their home for the few seconds when they open the door to throw on a log.

I personally live in woodland with clean fresh air. I don’t burn gas in the house. I don’t smoke or vape. So my particulate exposure is low and I use my wood burner. I’m willing to bet the damage to my children’s lungs from the stove is lower than the damage from inner city traffic and gas use.

We live rurally with no gas mains, and a free supply of logs. We plant at least 5x the trees we take down, so it’s pretty carbon neutral.

I am also really environmentally conscious so it isn’t just Luddites sitting around in front of their fires. For us the wood is a much more environmentally conscious option.

I wonder whether wood burners would be UKEZ compliant...?

genuine curiosity - Google is contradictory

We love in a Victorian house with large ceilings. We honestly couldn't be without ours. Cheap to run and more heat .

I don't think wood burners should be legal in London. it's not so feasible for everyone with asthma to leave major cities, either!

Of course the government has dragged its feet on improving things like insulation despite the absolute crisis in British housing.

Threads about wood burners are always started by people living in London and then the replies are mostly people who say they live in the middle of nowhere and have a wood burner because they have free wood/no mains gas etc. If that's what you live it's obviously not a problem but it's also not what OP is complaining about!

This.

Same with threads about massive 4x4s which can’t pass each other in congested narrow streets bought by people who never go outside the M25…. But oh, the defensive shrieks about farm tracks and towing horse trailers and needing to ford rivers on the way home from the yonder sheep market..in the snowy uplands.

£100 a day, where on earth do you live?!