Homesick for Yorkshire of Past - North-South Divide After Losses

[rubyankleshoes]

(Re-posting in case I put it in the wrong section. Fairly new user.)

I would appreciate anyone's insights on this please, particularly as my family and friends aren't capable of giving input that isn't in one way or another biased towards what THEY want.

Firstly, I have felt homesick all my adult life. Grew up in Yorkshire with a large, extended family who all lived nearby and shared so much - in and out of each other's homes, at school with siblings and cousins, grandparents who picked us up when parents couldn't etc.. Left to go to Uni and never returned.

A few caveats that folk from other regions will surely be able to relate to: Yorkshire’s had its heart stripped out in terms of loss of vast chunks of its native industry. This blasted my family to all ends of the Earth. Add into the mix the fact that London has been allowed to become like a separate Nation State of its own that gives little pretence to actually levelling up other than hot airing about it.

Have now lived in several places including abroad and the SE- have never settled. Have not married yet or had kiddos (really want to before it's too late) .

Since Covid have lost x 3 grandparents in close succession. Heartbroken on levels I was expecting but worse than could even have dreamt. Always thought I would end up living near them and my darling grandparents would meet my offspring etc.

Am now compulsively collecting stuff that reminds me of them or invokes what our family used to be like/ utterly preoccupied with working out where on earth I can rebuild some semblance of what was smashed apart all those years ago in the name of (I would say simply 'survival' as it’s obviously part of it but also - a lot of Boomer over-ambition and Greed Is Good stuff from the 80s which drove some of our parents / aunts / uncles’ generations).

Just cannot figure out if there could even conceivably be enough opportunities left in Yorkshire to even survive happily there (just a simple job search on Indeed.com revealed 9 suitable job posts last month in the entire 3 Yorkshire counties against - and I am NOT joking 600+ posts commutable to London in my sector).

Yet, I can't help wonder if I could possibly reconnect on the level I am dreaming of / whilst also knowing full well it wouldn’t be the same. Would involve almost entirely new cast of characters so would involve starting again.

Mostly just the culture and stone houses etc and the 'look' of what my grandparents aspired to for us would be there - that's what would feel familiar. Plus, dialect and cultural comfort, laughing in pubs, (some though not all) people being somewhat less materialistic that the SE and more commonsensical / practical (apologies in advance to Southerners but Yorkshire had vaccinated its entire population before most other counties had bumbled through their clinically vulnerable and elders ;-) there’s a legacy there of mass-organisation that goes to levels of practically I have yet to witness down South).

And yet - I also love the South - the sun, the gentility, the opportunities, the progress for women and other groups. But it’s extortionate and can’t afford much better than Assisted Buy or a Shoe Box down there.

Is anyone else feeling this way AND how did any of you resolve it? Did anyone return to a 'homeland' and acually rebuild what they needed? Is a sheltered, safe(ish), dignified, kinder, homey, slower culture still possible? I see such a mix of experiences here including those who regret never leaving depressed areas and those who left the SE for better quality of life and now regret it. How to resolve this (and soon as don’t want to leave it too late for DC / marriage etc). Thanks in advance.

What are the 3 counties then @JayAlfredPrufrock?

I hear you OP.

I grew up in the midlands/Black Country.
I was an only child to 'forrin' parents but grew up being able to call round friends' houses as did our mums.
There was a huge community spirit and we all congregated at the local parade of shops... greengrocer, butcher, haberdasher, chemist, groves and newsagent/post office.
Most men worked in the local foundries and the pub was a focal point.
Everyone knew each other and everyone looked out for each other.
Such a comfy life really.

The trouble is, life, now , isn't like that.

I , fairly recently, looked up that place.
It's run down and consists of takeaways.

I now live in the SE. It's nowhere near as friendly and I've never gotten over having to book a cup of tea in with a friend. But MN tells me that it's unreasonable to pop in for a quick cuppa when you're passing.
Still can't get over not chatting to the person next to you at a bus stop or on the tube.

I must be very old.

@Tulipblank

North Riding
East Riding
West Riding

Hth

This is so strange. It’s Yorkshire, not Timbuktu! Admittedly there are some industries that aren’t particularly well-connected here but jump on a train and you’re in London in less than 2 hours. I know plenty of people who live in Yorkshire (for the better quality of life) and commute to London a couple of days a week. They even have running water and electricity so I hear now.

I live in Yorkshire and really don't recognise what you describe. Im from here and massively wanted to move back to my home town to reproduce but lived in London 10 years inbetween.

Obviously it depends what you do but there's heaps of jobs around. Leeds feels like a real growth economy at the moment and with hybrid working you can base yourself further out than pre covid. I know people locally who work in London and do a day a week or similar so is that an option?

I understand that you want what you had during childhood and its crap that doesnt exist anymore. My family are tiny so I never had that but after i had children I made genuine deep friendships and local connections so it feels like my kids have heaps of aunties and uncles and cousins. I do find people much friendlier here and more likely to help out.

Ultimately Yorkshire is massive so there's everything here depending how rural/urban or wealthy/gritty you want your area to be.

If you make the move and you're unemployed and surrounded by misogyny can always move back to that London.

Manchester is thriving. Easy commute from the West Riding.

(ha ha who am I kidding)

I spent half my life in the south-east and half my life in Yorkshire and commute between the two and honestly there’s very little difference. Slightly slower pace of life and less competitive/ more relaxed in Yorkshire. Find the south-east a bit more money orientated/showy. London is an amazing world-class city and nowhere in the U.K. is going to match it (though I really love Edinburgh too) Political attitudes, cultural diversity, tolerance etc vary from area to area within both regions. What I suspect you’re really (and understandably) feeling OP is nostalgia for the past.

I've rtft and you do sound lovely op but I don't see the economic doom and gloom you describe. Obviously there's a decline in traditional industry and all that goes with it but equally there are areas of growth and prosperity. London has some right shit holes too and I was always much more on edge walking home when I lived there than I ever was up North. If you want genteel love pop to Betty's!

I also think that the nostalgia for your youth and desire to recreate that is probably stemming from a realisation that you"re getting older and life becomes a lot more complicated than when we were kids. This isn't location specific but I did find moving home made me a lot more settled and less sad that times had changed.

Not really @JayAlfredPrufrock, unless you think I'm living in 1973.

Yorkshire is massive, so it depends on what you want. If you want near (or commutable to) a decent job in a nice area, then youll pay for it in housing costs

if you want an area with back to backs with ‘community’ you’ll still find it in spades but it’ll likely be rough as, especially if you’ve lived away, and you’re unlikely to ‘break in’ to the community

I think you’re kidding yourself with rose tinted glasses tbh on what’s here and the way of life, when it’s more likely family nostalgia you’re pining for

In that case @Tulipblank there’s just the one county of Yorkshire 🙄

Not with you @JayAlfredPrufrock . No idea what you're on about. Obviously got very different understandings of what a county is.

The actual county is Yorkshire I believe (I’m from there and that’s what my dad would say) but I believe there have been historically lots of ways of dividing such a large county into smaller administrative areas (ridings, councils, police forces etc)

Go on then @Tulipblank enlighten us.

As someone who grew up in the north but has spent over half my life in the south and foolishly dragged the family up here last year, and has lived to regret it (we must be just about the only family ever to have LOST money by moving north), I would say think very, very carefully about the life and opportunities your kids might have in the future.

I guarantee the north is not as you left it. I guarantee you are not the same person that left either. And that Yorkshire you recall? Doesn't exist either.

And, sadly, as we currently live (well, reside) on the west of the Pennines, I've been astonished at just how much more slowly attitudes change here compared to the east and as for the south, it's a different world. Politically, socially, financially - everything is going to take generations here to catch up, if it ever does. And while I have sympathy and sadness about that, I don't have that many years left before I retire now and I don't want to spend them here. I absolutely don't want to retire here. There's a reason housing is so cheap. (Yes, I know that doesn't apply to Hebden and Harrogate, both of which are hardly representative of their wider location.)

Okay, granted, I grew up in a big city, but we currently live on the outskirts of a big city and unless you actually live in one of those big cities, life is generally tough day to day. Doesn't help that we have, on record, the worst rail operator in the country. I can fly to Bristol, check in time and all, in less time than it takes to cross to the east on a Transpennine train. No wonder they're always pretty much empty - you never know if and when they're going to turn up. And Northern isn't much better. The traffic congestion here is therefore at least as bad as the south a lot of the time and the drivers take risks I often cannot believe.

Family visiting us has not happened as they suggested despite us being hours closer, and now I know it won't happen. I threw away a lovely, easy, gentle life in the south for a dream of what was once and never will be again. Don't be me!

@JayAlfredPrufrock schedule 1 of the Local Government Act 1972, but I know you're desperate to tell me I'm wrong.

That's how I've always described the "counties" of Yorkshire. The only "riding" being the east, which is post Humberside.

But definitions aside, Yorkshire is ace. Best county going

As I live in the West Riding I beg to differ.

@JayAlfredPrufrock ok

Yorkshire's a very big place. The comfortable, well-set towns of North Yorkshire have little in common with the rust belt, post-industrial South and West Yorkshire where I grew up. I moved to London as soon as I finished Uni and never went back. Every time I visit, my home town has got worse. It now genuinely brings to mind some of the utterly grim post-Soviet areas of Eastern Europe that I visited in the mid 90s.

In my 35 years in London, I encountered a lot of misty-eyed nostalgia about Yorkshire from fellow Tykes. However, not many have returned.

When we'd had enough of the capital, we sold up and almost moved to York but eventually settled on a small town in the Lake District because we got a lot more for our money. My partner and I are both employed in media, and we can work from home. In that respect, there are as many career opportunities as there are in the South East. We've met a lot of people who've made the same move from London. It's not exactly an unusual thing to do.

And as for this tosh:

'And yet - I also love the South - the sun, the gentility, the opportunities, the progress for women and other groups.'

Jesus wept.

Agree. Is a bit of a weird thread. Don’t forget OP that loads of the desirable places in Yorkshire now have many many southerners living there. It will feel like being back down south !

So odd.

Come and join the masses living in York and commuting to London. (Or, shockingly, working from home.) We’ve got spades of nostalgia and history, AND great wifi speeds. We’ll call you love when you order a pint and everything.

“The past is a foreign country; they do things differently there.”

You really can never go back, OP. What you are longing for doesn’t exist any more; I think you need to build something new for yourself.