Page 2 | Declaring household members?

Fivemoreminutespeaceplease · 2023-02-10T17:01:08+00:00

PIL's sold their house last year with the intention to travel the world. They moved around a little but have since realised that they don't have a fraction of the money that travelling requires and are now homeless and in a word, skint. They've moved in with us (that's a whole thread in itself) however are not contributing to any bills. What do I need to update to reflect they live here from a legal point of view? MIL keeps rambling about being added to 'poll tax' but online it says she only needs to appear on there if she's a joint owner or partner. Can anyone give me a starting point please before I go and travel the world to avoid them!

Original poster

Fivemoreminutespeaceplease · 10/02/2023 19:48

And for the record, the daily mail are a total bag of shit and can fuck to the far side of off if they even think of trying to hijack my thread - wankers.

OP posts:

CrotchetyQuaver · 10/02/2023 19:48

I'd be very careful
Being on the electoral and having a utility bill in your name are first steps to obtaining credit. Given the evidence already of financial recklessness... last thing you need is harassment from debt collectors further down the line...

JennyDarlingRIP · 10/02/2023 19:53

OP have they considered over 55 type developments, might just be where I live (seaside) but property here is expensive, except for these developments and lots are lovely, seaviews etc. Do they have any money left at all? If they can afford to buy a static maybe they can afford something like that, is also means as they get older there is support on site if needed, otherwise I assume that will fall to you and your DH too!

2bazookas · 10/02/2023 19:55

UggyPow · 10/02/2023 17:47

I wouldn't put their names on any bills, that would imply they are paying them - which could lead to them trying to claim they are entitled to a proportion of the house (very small admittedly) in the same way as a couple when one moves into the others house.
Ideally I would give them a contract under the rent a room scheme (the rent can be as low as you like, but they would not have any rights to your property) & add them to the council tax, so they can vote.

To vote, they only need to be on the electoral roll; which has nothing to do with who pays the council tax.

On no account give them any kind of rent contract, even as lodgers or rent a room . If OP does that; she needs the consent of her mortgage lender and property insurer for commercial letting; the insurers will probably require the domestic policy upgraded to business premises. Even a lodger LL must meet all sort of commercial-let legal standards (fireproof furnishings, gas and electrical checks)

Seymour5 · 10/02/2023 19:56

@bloodymary100 If they had earned the same but ‘pissed away’ their wages when younger instead of buying a house, or saving for a pension, they’d be eligible. What’s the difference?

Adarajames · 10/02/2023 20:11

if your DH would back you up, you could always make them homeless, send them to the local council offices so they can apply for housing, may be some for over 60s or whatever that they can rent.

bloodymary100 · 10/02/2023 20:18

Seymour5 · 10/02/2023 19:56

@bloodymary100 If they had earned the same but ‘pissed away’ their wages when younger instead of buying a house, or saving for a pension, they’d be eligible. What’s the difference?

Presumably their wages, being enough to buy a home, wouldn't have seen them eligible for social housing even if they chose not to save the income.

Having the security of a home, selling it and using the proceeds for fun then wanting to rely on social housing is fundamentally wrong.

AfraidToRun · 10/02/2023 20:22

You don't need to do anything as they are clearly just guests, right? 😉

SilentHedges · 10/02/2023 23:31

Seymour5 · 10/02/2023 17:49

If they are in their 60s, have a look at housing associations in the area, they may be able to offer them secure and affordable housing, especially if they can no longer afford to buy a home.

Why? They are working age. They have no dependents. OP mentions they have various ailments, but so do a heck of a lot of people who get on with working, regrettable though it is.

OP do not add them to the electoral roll at your house, it could cause you all manner of issues and credit rating problems. I'm so sorry this pair of Grifters have landed on you. I had similar with my Dad and I basically told him he had X days to get a job and find somewhere to live. He sort of managed it by living with another relative for free instead, but at least he left.

EmmaEmerald · 10/02/2023 23:34

BasilParsley · 10/02/2023 19:39

DO NOT ADD THEM TO THE ELECTORAL ROLL AT YOUR ADDRESS ... I REPEAT, DO NOT ADD THEM AT YOUR ADDRESS!!!!! If you do, they then have established residency and can really screw up your credit rating by applying for this, that and the other without you knowing... I feel for you but you need to be hard here... xxx

This. In fact, shouldn’t they go to the council and present as homeless? Do they have literally no money?

Babyroobs · 10/02/2023 23:38

Fivemoreminutespeaceplease · 10/02/2023 18:57

They had supposedly planned to travel until they dropped, they are both under 60 but have various ailments so this seemed ridiculous to me but despite me and DH challenging their ideas, they were adamant this was what they were doing and that it would work in their favour.

MIL had a number of credit accounts to pay off so with that and then them living like millionaires for a year, they now have next to bloody nothing to work from, which is annoying as their house was lovely and sold for a fair amount.

DH and I aren't entitled to any benefits so it won't affect anything like that.

I'm just so bloody angry that we're in this position. It's hard enough when they visit for Christmas, they take over the house and try and take over with DC but not in a positive way. I'm dreading every minute until they leave.

I can't thank everyone enough for advice ❤️

What are they living off at the moment? If savings/ equity have dwindled to less than 16k then they can look at claiming Universal credit although I don't know if pissing away all the money would count as deprivation of assets and prevent them claiming. I guess they will need to claim Universal credit to help pay rent when they find somewhere to rent. Are either of them capable of working as if claiming UC they will be expected to do so unless health conditions prevent this.

SilentHedges · 10/02/2023 23:55

Looking at the information presented, and re their "various ailments". I'd have to assume that if 2 people are perfectly able to travel the world, where health care may not always be readily available, then they can manage jobs.

Nat6999 · 11/02/2023 01:11

Don't put their name on anything, just tell them their staying at your home is strictly temporary & you expect weekly updates on their efforts to find another home & give them a date you expect them to leave. Couldn't they get an Airbnb until they find somewhere?

LadyJ2023 · 11/02/2023 02:25

Erm think before you do anything the more you put there names down on certain bills etc they could then use against you should you try to get them to leave making it look like they are your tenants etc etc. Tbh harsh but true I wouldn't have anyone family or not taking the mick like these are doing to you already. We once had my sister for a month we agreed a date she would leave and while with us she paid a small portion towards food also agreed upon. Not so long ago my aunt/uncle stayed for 6 weeks in-between houses again made agreement first time limit and a portion towards food tho they also paid towards bills voluntarily which was appreciated

CellophaneFlower · 11/02/2023 07:51

BasilParsley · 10/02/2023 19:39

DO NOT ADD THEM TO THE ELECTORAL ROLL AT YOUR ADDRESS ... I REPEAT, DO NOT ADD THEM AT YOUR ADDRESS!!!!! If you do, they then have established residency and can really screw up your credit rating by applying for this, that and the other without you knowing... I feel for you but you need to be hard here... xxx

This isn't true.

Credit/debt is linked by name, NOT address.

WhoNeedsSleepNotISaidMyBody · 11/02/2023 09:05

@Fivemoreminutespeaceplease

morning ☕️

oh a static caravan now is it? 🙇🏻‍♀️🙇🏻‍♀️

having read your subsequent posts I'd definitely be getting to the bottom of what's left in the pot and hopefully getting them into a residential care village if at all possible. Sell it to them as safer & 'lick & go' if they want to travel anymore.

I wouldn't be putting them as 'resident' on anything official.

it's bloody annoying when you've pointed out the bloody obvious (permanently travelling until you drop is not going to work), they completely ignore you & then the fall out impacts you!!

what does DH think??

Motnight · 11/02/2023 09:14

They aren't even 60 yet! They have made some terrible decisions!

ChicCroissant · 11/02/2023 09:18

Fivemoreminutespeaceplease · 10/02/2023 19:46

My house is mortgages to my DH and I so I can't blame the council or landlord for not being able to house them unfortunately.

I've looked into credit ratings extensively and it's to the person and not the person, so even if she gets herself into a black hole, it won't affect me or my house to my knowledge?

In the last hour, I've got to the bottom of the obsession with being on bills. They want to move onto a static caravan park but they need to have a residential address and proof of this in way of utility bills.

This is like a nightmare.

Doesn't mean they have to be on YOUR bills though - what about their old bills from their previous property, or they can rent somewhere else for a bit and pay the bills there.

Their bad choices are not yours to fix. It's down to them.

123ZYX · 11/02/2023 09:18

The reason a static caravan needs a residential address is because they can't be lived in year round. They normally have a month a year where the occupier needs to move out (often January).

I'd be finding out where they intend to go for that month - I suspect they may plan to move back in with you for a month each year.

BitOutOfPractice · 11/02/2023 09:19

Seymour5 · 10/02/2023 17:49

If they are in their 60s, have a look at housing associations in the area, they may be able to offer them secure and affordable housing, especially if they can no longer afford to buy a home.

Oh bless you! You know there’s not even close to being enough social housing for people who have no home currently and have been waiting years. They stand a snowball in hell’s chance of getting anything.

OP is your MiL wanting to have a utility bill as proof of address I wonder?

ChicCroissant · 11/02/2023 09:23

123ZYX · 11/02/2023 09:18

The reason a static caravan needs a residential address is because they can't be lived in year round. They normally have a month a year where the occupier needs to move out (often January).

I'd be finding out where they intend to go for that month - I suspect they may plan to move back in with you for a month each year.

This is a really good point, one of my friends had a static and it was closed in Jan (and poss Feb too). So it would be worth pointing out that if it's not open all year round it's not a good option for them.

Honestly, it sounds as if they need to go back to work even if it's at least part-time. It might also be worth sitting down and having the difficult conversation that clearly states you can't house them in the foreseeable future.

Anotheanon · 11/02/2023 09:27

123ZYX · 11/02/2023 09:18

The reason a static caravan needs a residential address is because they can't be lived in year round. They normally have a month a year where the occupier needs to move out (often January).

I'd be finding out where they intend to go for that month - I suspect they may plan to move back in with you for a month each year.

This needs repeating just to make sure you see it.
There are park home sites that can be lived in all year round. My in laws are on one. They bought their park home many years ago. But a static caravan site will not be like this.

Anotheanon · 11/02/2023 09:28

I really do feel for you. This sounds like a nightmare.

Businessflake · 11/02/2023 09:28

In the last hour, I've got to the bottom of the obsession with being on bills. They want to move onto a static caravan park but they need to have a residential address and proof of this in way of utility bills.

This is what I was just about to say. It’s pretty much impossible to open new accounts, rent a new property, anything like that without some proof of address. So if you want then you’ll probably need to help facilitate!

APlaceOfGreaterSafety · 11/02/2023 09:30

You might want to check whether you need to tell your house insurance they’re living there.

Our house insurance has a bit about number of residents, so they know we have x adults and y children living here. Not sure how it would affect any insurance claims if they had the wrong number of residents listed.

As for this static caravan park idea - can’t they take a short term tenancy somewhere, so they’ve got their names on tenancy agreements, utility bills etc, and then apply to the caravan park from there? If they’ve enough money for a static caravan then surely they’ve got enough money to rent somewhere?

I’d not be wanting to update council tax, utility bills etc for adults at my address who aren’t contributing anything financially.

And would there be anything to prevent them from getting themselves added to the electoral roll at OP’s address themselves if they wanted to? I don’t think I’d suggest it in OP’s position as I’d not want to encourage them to think it’s a permanent arrangement, but do they need an official written agreement about being lodgers or whatever to get themselves on the electoral roll?