175k am I bonkers? Pricing a potential renovation....how??!

[Greenlife1]

Might be being a right wally but how do people figure out how much money they need for a house that needs a shit tonne of work doing?!

Been looking for AGES. A house has come up in the (very small search) area we are looking at. It is 3 bed and we need 4. It is a 1960s dream. Nothings been done to it in the last 60 years apart from a newish conservatory and a little extension.

We would need to fit in a new bedroom so that could mean either a loft conversion or extension to the 2nd floor (not sure if planning would be given for the 2nd floor extension tho) would also need a little extension downstairs (possibly possible through PD).

Would like to move kitchen into the extension once we've built it. The kitchen would need to be redone. Would like to move and open up the staircase as it's really dark and awkward. Would like to make the integrated garage an office/ utility space.

I imagine it needs new boiler and rewiring.

The bathrooms need doing but they could wait or we could do them on the cheap.

Everything would need plastering once sorted and new flooring too!

I think we would have about 175k to spend if we got it for the price we would offer.

Any ideas how I can price this up for a very rough guide?!

Thanks x

I recently turned a 4 bed Georgian terrace (near London) which was an office into a house for a lot less than this.

The price depends on 2 things 1) If you are going to project manage and 2) The level of finish and if you can spot a bargain.

Use independent tradesman which have been recommended to you and then haggle. Use labourers where you can too.

£175k is plenty if you project manage and use independent tradesman.

I think it’s a good budget for that imo

To keep budget lower you do need to do more work at looking at options to refund costs.
For example we recently added oak flooring everywhere, 130m2 worth. It was €120 per sqm, but as it was end of the line and we bought all it it worked out €30 per sqm. That was with the company collecting the last 20m2 from one city, 40m2 from another etc. Saved a huge amount.

Our kitchen this year was around €17k. That was quartz worktops, oak cabinets, rewire, new plumbing etc. saved costs by demo ourselves, worktop direct from company, buying appliances direct in sales, tiles sourced direct from supplier. Our main quote was €32k had we got the one company to get everything through them.

New heating system €30k going in now. But various government grants as it’s renewable will return approx €15k in the next few months. So look into any available for heating

We been renovating our house in the SE since Dec 2020. We’ve will spend just around £320k by the time we’ve finished I estimate and most of our spend was in 2021 so before prices started to go too crazy but we certainly experienced timber prices going up and our steels should have cost £30k more than they did but the fabricators honoured the original quote (we didn’t know this, the builders told us afterwards). We’d budgeted around £200k.

It was a 3 bed 1930s semi detached house with an attached garage and utility. For that money we had a lot of architect fees as we had many changes to plans! loads of steelwork, we changed plans part way through which needed revised structural engineer drawings and extra steels (about £5k in total so not too significant) We replaced the garage with a double storey extension and knocked the whole back of the house out to make a very open plan wrap around u shaped room with a kitchen in one end of the u and a lounge in the other and the bottom of the U has 3 large sliding doors onto the garden. We put in a utility cloak room, a large new bedroom and en-suite upstairs, refit of old bathroom (back to brick and then put back again) removed a wall upstairs, new boiler, radiators, all new windows partial new driveway, landscaping at the top of the garden to raise the current patio, remodel two sets of garden steps and add a second large patio, rendered the back of the house and the new extension, changed the shape of the old bathroom window, plus redecorating hall way and existing rooms.

The kitchen was from Schmidt and cost £27k including fitting, we probably spent another £4k on appliances (kept old washing machine and tumble drier…everything else was new) the windows were £12k excluding fitting which the builders did for us so I’m not sure how much they cost in the end.

my husband did all the tiling, he did some of the flooring and painting and he laid 70% of the patios, we had flooring from B&Q which was 3 for 2 at the time. He did both the en-suite and bathroom refits himself and the redecorating of existing rooms so we covered a lot of the work ourselves.

It’s notable that a lot better f the high budgets on this thread and very high estimates are from architects or from people who have used architects to a lesser or greater extent. In my experience these is no professional quite as adept at spending clients money as architects! Looking at all the projects that I and friends have done, many of us in the industry in one way or another, those projects run by or with substantial input from architects seem to run at least 50% more costly. For some projects that is worth it where great architectural design leads to a really special outcome, but for a lot of bog standard renovations, small extensions, loft conversions etc it just seems to be a way of ensuring you are spending more than is necessary.

I can believe that about projects with and without an architect. It was helpful for us because we were genuinely struggling to identify the right thing to do and we have something that is different to a lot of the extensions / renovations that you see but not wildly off the wall but it was worth it. I wouldn’t use one again if we were doing a more straightforward extension

In defence of architects; I don’t think it’s the architects which necessarily blow the budget out. It’s that if you have an architect your also likely to have a project manager and tender as a package.

Like everything there’s the triangle of quality, time and money. You can achieve two if your careful, never 3.

We used an architect for our Reno. Luckily because DPs dad is an architect. But we project managed everything ourselves, searched for best prices and bought own materials, sourced independent individual trades and project managed them all.

We have achieved quality and money. It’s taken us a lot longer than a package build. One year in, probably another 3/4 to go until everything is 100% renoed’.

That is very true, as I said it is not my intention to denigrate architects but having seen friends spend 2 or 3 times what they could have on glazing for example, so as not to compromise the integrity of the design at the architects behest, it seems that there does seem to be a correlation. Fair enough that f you are building a new Frank Gehry concert hall, less so if it is an identikit side return in SW London.

i would always go for money and quality but I totally get that other people want the whole thing done for them as quickly as possible

I would agree that if what you are doing is very straightforward then I would question the value of an architect. Our extension was a straightforward box on the back with pitched roof. It was within our PD rights. I drew the plans myself (in excel though I made sure the ones going to building control were in pdf). Even the builder referred to them!

I guess that one of the problems/opportunities of using an architect is ending up with scope creep. We wanted a box, an architect might then have shown us a range of options which would then be difficult to row back from.

Variations are also another huge cost driver. Sometimes it's unavoidable but sometimes it is just a change of mind. Don't make decisions in haste. Live in the house before deciding to extend. What exactly is wanted may change once you have lived in the house for a while.

You are the one claiming to buy cheap vanities but now you are going all high brow and snotty about cheap products. Make up your mind. Your budget is more than the cost of many houses in the UK. We can all see that you just like to sound grande but haven't a scoobie

@pocketvenuss I didn’t say I don’t like those cabinets because they look cheap, I said they are flawed from a design perspective.

I’m amused that you seem to think I just signed a blank cheque for my build. Nothing could be further from the truth, and I have sourced many components from the likes of IKEA, Dunelm, eBay, Screwfix and Amazon. I’ve imported some lighting directly from China and I’m reusing and recycling anything, from windows to curtains etc. I got our timber flooring at a huge discount from a supplier that went out of business.

I’m painfully aware that houses cost much less pretty much anywhere in the country, but I’m in SW London and sadly, that’s how much building works cost here.

I'm not sure what experience you have but it is achievable. I'm in the process of doing the exact same thing.

Much depends on the value of the house before the renovations and the projected value afterwards. Budgets need to be set realistically accordingly. A £500k house wouldn't merit a kitchen costing more than £30-£40k tops. A £2.5m plus house merits £100k kitchen.

No house merits a £100k kitchen. Thats just ridiculous.

My £2.5m house has a brand new very large kitchen. £27 including fitting and parquet flooring

Ok well I have refurbished several houses. Biggest piece of advice is only do what is unsafe and not inhabitable first, just touch the rest up and live in it and try and make it home. Especially things like bathrooms- new sealant/grout/paint can go a long way. Really understand the house before you rush into it. Untouched original houses are like a dream and best to really understand them first rather than rip stuff up and put in cheap temporary solutions. If you do it that way you save a fortune and actually end up with the best possible outcome anyway.

I think the best way to establish a budget is to ask a local contractor to view the property with you as a precursor to them bidding for the work. They will give you a better handle on the expected cost. Don't forget to add VAT and the cost of furnishing the place to the cost! This is what we did when we bought our house. You must also allow a significant contingency, especially for older, untouched houses, since any deficiencies with respect to newer building regulations will need to be made good. We are in the strip out stage of our 4-month renovation (which doesn't involve any structural changes like building an extension) and have already eaten into 7% of our contingency budget due to issues with the roof and suspended wooden floors. It is a Victorian house, so is more likely to throw up problems due to its age, however it was fully renovated only 10 years ago. Good luck!

My £2.5m house has a brand new very large kitchen. £27 including fitting and parquet flooring

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£27 now that is cheap! Or maybe a toy kitchen! 😂

@user73 will done for fitting a kitchen for £27 :). What make is it? How big is it? I disagree as those who are prepared to pay a premium for a property expect very high quality

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Ooops! 😆

Handmade kitchens of Christchurch 7m x 7m painted in little greene with osmo oiled insides, mirrored splashback, hardwood parquet floors, quartz worktops, 4m Long Island, built in banquet seating, Jim Lawrence lighting

That’s the one!

Banquette

I want the Playmobile kitchen!

Does the £27k include appliances, fitting it and painting it?