Weird building quote for extension/loft conversion (+weird builder!)

[molliert85]

So, DH and I have been saving for an extension and loft conversion for ages. Finally got to the point of quotes. A family friend, very highly recommended, came and took a look at the house and garden. Upon arrival the builder, who I've never met before, was very friendly and polite, but said odd things like "well, building regulations are for wussies" and didn't really seem to look properly at the house or loft. So far...so...weird.

After a lot of to-ing and fro-ing about how the architect had "got the drawings wrong" (builder's words, not mine), we got the estimate through from the builder. We've never had one for a large job like this, so we're not quite sure what to expect, but it is basically a few lines saying "Price is X." Surely this cannot be normal?

Does anyone have an estimate from a respectable builder, preferably one who has completed an extension/ loft conversion in London, that they wouldn't mind sharing (obviously with personal stuff redacted) with me?

DH is threatening to book the builder. I know I'm not crazy here to think something is wrong, but because I can't show him how an estimate should look, or what the price should be, he's saying we should "just go with it."

I keep telling DH it's so important we get this right, especially as it's not small money. Any advice would be appreciated.

Did you provide a document for him to quote against?

No way. Do not "just go with it". You need a quotation that clearly lists all the work that's included and a timeframe. Otherwise what's to stop him just buggering off halfway through because he claims X,Y,X was not included. How would you argue otherwise? Also all of the "nobody else knows what they're doing, I'm the big important expert" stuff would have me running for the hills. Never met anyone with that kind of attitude who turned out to be anything other than completely incompetent and very bad at listening.

I think you should get at least two more quotes so you have a comparison on price and what’s included.

This site might be useful to share with your husband.

Builder Quote

Sounds dodgy af, tbh

The comment about building regulations would be enough to put me off. Don't touch with a barge pole. It'll be a disaster.

A quote should at least breakdown the different stages of the build and cost. I would not go with this builder, if he puts as much effort into your home as he put into the quote. You'll 100% be in trouble. Just read through the archives a builder can be your best friend or worst enemy, in most cases worst enemy. I would steer clear.

I had just finished an extension. The quote should be itemised with a payment schedule. I have a document explaining the items in the quote and what are included. For example what type of toilets, bathroom tiling size and height. There is also prices for variations. For example if the need to dig deeper for foundation.

we currently have builders working on our home. It’s a big project for us. Walls coming down. A lot of money for us! We got 4 quotes. Some were very detailed - from a big firm with a proper admin office to produce such things, some less so. The builder we went with didn’t have the fanciest paperwork but did make us feel very comfortable in how he talked about the project - specifically building regs actually - he’s already had the building regs person out a couple of times to check things as naturally when digging up under a house you find things are set up in various ways, it’s an old house. He wants to make sure our project gets signed off, that it’s safe, he wants us to be impressed with his work! He spotted something in the plans that was slightly different to things now he’s started taking walls down but he says that happens sometimes and he just liaises with building regs and the architect and gets it all sorted in a professional way. Crucially we feel confident in him that we will do a good job, he makes us feel comfortable!

You need to feel you can trust someone who is working on/in your home imo, or it will be a horrible experience. And if your gut is flagging something to you then I wouldn’t ignore that!

We had extensive building work last summer, all quotes were very detailed with what exactly we were paying for. 1 line with a figure on it is not enough!

I think you’ll come to regret it … even the best of builders you’ll have some sort of misunderstanding and you need something to go off.

our architect ran a tender with a schedule so extremely detailed pricing for the works, payment schedule, timings (timings all went to pot due to covid). Works itemised and ticked off when done as were the inevitable extras we’d agreed. That was a 110k build.

Do NOT just go for it with this builder who sounds as dodgy AF. We had our loft done and got five quotes and four of them were itemised extensively with a payment schedule included, details of guarantee etc. The fifth was like yours, scribbled on the back of a fag packet pretty much, so we ignored it. NEVER trust a builder who disparages building regs - you need those if you ever want to sell.

You will regret letting this guy touch your house with comments such as the building regs one. Post on your local Facebook page to get recommendations and get more quotes.

We've put more consideration into our new back door, and had more detailed quotes!

I'm acutely conscious that someone if someone is going to make a hole in my house, I need to trust them.

Every single time you get someone to do any significant work on your house something goes wrong/is delayed/ there's a misunderstanding etc. You can virtually guarantee that. It's phenomenally stressful. You absolutely must get at least three quotes, not just for the final cost, but to see who convinces you that they are the ones you want to be dealing with when it gets stressful.

Malaphor time...

Run like the plague!!!

Things ALWAYS change and there will ALWAYS be unexpected findings with these sorts of things... even the most reputable companies will have sneaky clauses in contracts, but at least there will be a contract with specific time frames and expectations.

One to watch out for that we experienced with our conservatory was the cancellation policy. They had the nerve to claim costs had gone up literally one day after the initial cancellation deadline, and then again after our first deposit stating that we could no longer cancel because materials had already been bought and used.

Building regulations are crucial. If you sell and it wasn't done properly, that's a huge corrective bill!

Wouldn't touch a builder who spoke like that, and quoted like that on a large job with a barge pole.
I would expect during the build, the price may go up and him saying other 'weird' things like "cost of materials have gone up, it's normal" and "I'll need you to pay the final bill before I have finished". Steer clear.

I would be surprised if he’s licensed. If he’s refuting building refs and plans, you’d never get insurance.

You also want to be careful about whether you've had a quote or an estimate - a quote should be a fixed price which should only change if there are agreed on variations e.g. as a result of uncovering an unexpected issue or you changing the specification. That's why the detail is important- both sides should be clear about what is and isn't included. An estimate is more of a rough guess that they can't be held to with much more scope for uncontrolled variation.

Dodgy AF.

We had five quotes for a single storey extension. The shortest was a one page job along the lines of “building X as per building regs drawings to a plaster finish, to include second fix electrics and plumbing but excluding second fix joinery”. Had we gone with them, I would have asked for more detail.

The more detailed ones, including the one from our builder who we have gone on to use, ran to multiple pages line by line, eg cost of portaloo for builders, cost of skip, cost of groundworks, materials, etc.

“The price is X” is simply not acceptable.

Why would you not get two or three quotes?

What stepping out said
An estimate will change and cost you a shit tump.more.
A quote can only change if work not already included is needed.
Which is why the quote has to be be broken down into the smallest possible parts

@molliert85 when I had my loft done, the builder worked to the architect’s drawings and Building Control came in and made sure it was right at key stages. I also paid for the first materials up front then for the work in stages (all as builder had stipulated) so low risk. Don’t proceed without all this being ironed out. You’ll get burned. Ring the local council building control team - they are usually very helpful and will give you unbiased info about what needs to happen.

I had a builder once who came to do estimate, talked about prostitution and 'payment in kind' then sent my quote around midnight for something like £11!

Almost completely off topic but your post reminded me.

If you have misgivings in anyway please get rid now, once he's started and taken half your money you're up shit creek with a half finished job and a whole load of stress

Thank you so much Pumpkins. Sorry for my late reply but i didn't expect anyone to respond to my post! I knew I was right and I keep telling DH that we should have some sort of longer document. Would you be willing to share your extension quote with me (privately of course) so I can say to DH "this is how it should look?". He is pressurising me to make a decision this week. I have two more builders coming to quote but not they can't provide a quote for another 5 weeks minimum (one says he might be able to do it in 4) and DH is saying we should just email this one on Friday and say yes. Nightmare!