Property costs 1989-90! Weird questions

[Pluvia]

I have POA for an elderly relative who has recently gone into a care home. I'm trying to sort out her finances.

To fund her immediate care I'm just about to sell her holiday/ second home, which she and her late husband purchased in 1989. We complete next week. CGT needs to be paid on the sale proceeds and I need to provide details of how much was paid for the property in 1989 and how much it would have cost in conveyancing and EA fees etc. There's absolutely no paperwork that I can find. My aunt is adamant that they paid £85,000, but there are no existing Land Registry records before 1995. What does one do in these circumstances?

Apparently we're allowed to claim for the Estate Agent's fees, too –but again, no paperwork. Has anyone else been through this?

Could you find out who the mortgage was with and contact them to see if they have records?

If you tell us what area the house is and what type/size of house, there may be someone here who bought something similar and could advise.

£85,000 in 1989 sounds a lot. Most houses, even in London, were less than that back then.

Are the paper deeds anywhere - such as a safe deposit box?

Do you have the paper version of the deeds if it is not on the LR? Was it mortgage-free? What paperwork on the property do you have, there must be something that proves ownership to sell it with, is there anything there you can use to trace the solicitor who dealt with the purchase?

I agree that sounds too high unless it is large. For reference my first house in 1993 was £85000, Home Counties, 3 bed new build. Flats next to the station direct to London were around £60 in 1990

Two bed quaint cottage in sought after village in Kent 1985, £42,500
Sold in 1996 for 75,000
I'd imagine it would sell for around 300,000 now

Average house price was about £60k in 1989, does that sound right compared to your house value, size, location, making it that much above average.

Our home, an average sized 3 bed detached in the East Midlands, cost us £72k in 1988, so £85k in 1989 does not sound unreasonable.

(There was a property crash in the early 90s.)

@LadyJaneHall

If you tell us what area the house is and what type/size of house, there may be someone here who bought something similar and could advise.

£85,000 in 1989 sounds a lot. Most houses, even in London, were less than that back then.

I sold my 4 bed 2 bath corner plot semi in a nice road in a desirable village in Yorkshire in 1990 for £89k if that helps.

You could search local newspaper archives to try and find the original property listing

If it helps, a relative bought a 3 bed 1930s semi in a nice suburban area of Bristol in 1989. Paid £112,000

2.5 bed Victorian terrace house completely modernised and refurbished in Lymington Hampshire bought in October 1990 for £90k so her pricing memory sounds about right to my mind?

4 bed new build detached house in Hampshire in 1986 £72,000.

What council tax band is it? These were based on property values in 1st April 1991. Not very exact but a bit of a guide. For example Band C is £52001-£68001 and band D is £68001-£88000.

And whilst the estate agents' fees for the current sale you are handling might be deductable, your aunt wouldn't have paid agents' fees on her purchase in 1989. They would have been a cost for the seller.

Capital gain allowances are quite high and roll over. 1989 is 43 years ago.

Does she remember which solicitor they used?

@Whingasaurus you might need to revisit your maths there.....I was just coming on to say I bought a 2-bed flat in Weybridge, Surrey, in late 1989, for £77,000......and I'm pretty sure I wasn't 12 years old at the time.

I'm fairly sure they'll have to accept estimates so est cost 85k. I paid £800 solicitors fees in 1993 so that's a fair estimate and any significant house improvements such as double glazing, new roof can also be added.

Our 3 bed West London terrace cost £125,000 in 1986 so the estimate doesn’t sound unreasonable to me.

It's in the Bath area: period house, three bedrooms and a box room since converted to a second bathroom, garage, gardens. It was bought in spring1989 just at the peak of the boom. I bought at that time myself in London (£66k for a 1-bed flat in a 'meh' part of north London) and I know there was a serious property crash shortly afterwards and a massive rise in interest rates in the early 90s. My property in London was valued in early 1991 year at around £52k and I spent quite a long time in negative equity. My aunt and uncle bought their second home with the proceeds of an inheritance so no mortgage. I can remember my own mother (now deceased) being envious of them coming into enough money to buy a second home outright.

I've tried going back to 1995 records but the village they bought in had relatively few transactions and nothing comparable was sold until 12 years later, and then for around double the price.

I have no paperwork apart from a solicitor's letter regarding the transaction. Have tried tracing but solicitor/ company and even address long gone. Suspect that my aunt must have had a major clear-out after her husband died, or he hid stuff away and didn't tell her where. We have been through both houses, sheds, lofts, garages, contacted solicitors and banks in case there's a safe deposit somewhere but no joy. They have no children.

It's all a bit ridiculous, really. The property has appreciated massively in value and knocking £10k off the original purchase price, or worrying about the EA and solicitor's fees is unlikely to make much of a dent in the CGT.

I'm wondering if you could get any help from the local council? Council tax bands are based on the property value as at 1/4/91 so that might give you some sort of guide - I wonder if there are any records of how the band is assessed initially??

You might get some joy talking with local estate agents. Some of them might have long memories.

I remember I bought a 3 bed semi in south London in 1991 for £80k so to me it sounds quite feasible but I don't know what the difference between London and Bath would have been back then.

Solicitor's costs won't be a percentage of the value. They will be a fixed price or calculated by time spent if an unusually complex purchase. And then cost of various searches added on top. In 1994 I paid £350 including searches for a straightforward purchase.

Probably is about right with your description of the house and location, as bigger than average and Bath is desirable area and it was the peak then.

Our £15k terrace house which we bought in 1984 peaked at around a massive £50k sometime around then iirc

You'll have to take the line that no records exist and give your aunt's estimate. Obviously the buyer doesn't pay the EA fees, simply the conveyancing. The average conveyancing is about £1000-1500k now in London/SE.

It must be worth a million or so now so splitting hairs over the odd 1000 is neither here nor there.

IF the mortgage provider can't help then try to track down the success of the EA or solicitor. There will still be records held somewhere by the firm that took on their clients.