Property costs 1989-90! Weird questions

[Pluvia]

I have POA for an elderly relative who has recently gone into a care home. I'm trying to sort out her finances.

To fund her immediate care I'm just about to sell her holiday/ second home, which she and her late husband purchased in 1989. We complete next week. CGT needs to be paid on the sale proceeds and I need to provide details of how much was paid for the property in 1989 and how much it would have cost in conveyancing and EA fees etc. There's absolutely no paperwork that I can find. My aunt is adamant that they paid £85,000, but there are no existing Land Registry records before 1995. What does one do in these circumstances?

Apparently we're allowed to claim for the Estate Agent's fees, too –but again, no paperwork. Has anyone else been through this?

Would it show up on Mouseprice or rightmove selling history if you put the address in

You can take the average % price increase in the Bath area 1989-2021 and see if the current ask fits with 85k.

Can you look on the actual Land Registry site?

I'm sure I did this about 10 years ago when I was looking to buy a property that hadn't been sold since 1995. Register with them and pay a small fee for the information

I'm sure estate agents can give an estimate of a 1989 price, we ask for things like this fairly regularly through my work

I was working in conveyancing then, and I think estate agents fees were around 1-2.5 percent (plusVAT) at 17.5 ?per cent? One percent was a really good deal, 2 percent more usual.
Conveyancing would be around 500 & VAT and disbursements, more if unregistered land. Land registry fees would have been around £300 I think,.
If you can find the deeds with the searches, they have the price on them.

They might very well have bought at the tail end of the property boom before a big crash. I can't remember exact dates but we bought our first property in 1991 and prices had already fallen a lot and went down a bit further for the next few years too.

I've just Googled and between 1989 and 1993 UK house prices fell 20%, so it's likely that they bought at the highest possible price just before they crashed.

As for the price, your Aunts estimate sounds feasible- I paid 85k in 1990 for a London suburb 3 bed house in very tired condition- no Heating or kitchen.

@comfortablyfrumpy Good idea, at least that would give the OP an idea of whether £85k is in the right ball park.

If Bath is the correct council, a property worth £68-88k in 1991 would be in Band D.
beta.bathnes.gov.uk/council-tax-bands-and-charges

I've just found this:-

For data prior to 1995 you could try the Valuation Office. The Valuation Office is an Executive Agency of the Inland Revenue, with a network of local offices throughout Britain. Its main responsibilities are establishing rateable vales for the purpose of fixing council tax bandings. They also have a website at www.voa.gov.uk

You could also try www.halifax.co.uk/house-price-index for information from January 1983.

Not a million: it's a few miles outside Bath and it needs a fair bit spending on it to bring it up to contemporary standards. I have no idea how much the CGT will come to but the sale should yield enough to pay care fees sufficient to see her out.

Next job is to clear out and sell the property she's just moved from and get that money invested too.

I can't see what relevance the EA fees are. The seller's fees don't come into the issue of the aunt's tax.

The key issues are the sale price paid by aunt, conveyancing fees and stamp duty, which was, I think, 1% for properties over 60k until the late 90s.

We had this last year with DM. In fact, we did best guess, and also deducted a "reasonable" amount for work she had done on the property like replacement windows. We didn't have any receipts or paperwork either. I think HMRC are aware of difficulties like this, and if you are reasonable in your assumptions won't follow up. We had to pay £65k CGT so they got a good sum off her.

I bought a small two bedroom house in a London in 1998 in a fairly crummy if up and coming area for £95k so I think that sounds right. Estate agents fees were 1.5%, conveyancing about £500.

I think that was about the time that MIRAS ended and prices started to fall ?

1988 I mean.

Ah ok - well a few miles from Bath - 600-800k?

Try your local archives & library

Rats I checked my message but not well enough - my purchase was 1988 not 1998 and yes it was in the rush before MIRAS was stopped.

Would you be able to get hold of an old bank or building society statement showing the transaction?

1989 is 33 years ago, not 43.
It all depends on the location, for example in 1988 in North Yorkshire for £34.000, 3 bed detached.
Someone up thread mentioned looking through old newspaper archives for the sales listings…good idea, our local library holds the microfiche files for the local newspapers. Worth a try?

Details could be held in s deed box/safe deposit box held with her bank.
I worked for Midland Bank/HSBC during that era and it was quite a common occurrence. If there was no mortgage with them they were held in the account holders branch, but if there was a mortgage there were larger branches which were like mortgage hubs and deeds were stored there. (Mine were stored in Keynsham near Bath).

There would also been a receipt from the bank and an annual fee for storage (is anything on her current account that could be this?)

Oops my bad and I have a dc born in 1988 so really shouldn't have got that wrong 😂

Zoopla shows previous house prices, it should be on there

Off the wall suggestion here but if there is a fairly stable local population, why not ask the neighbours? I'm sure a few friendly Mumsnetters next door could tell you a fair few prices with reasonable accuracy