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Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?

83 replies

Smallgoon · 24/04/2020 21:15

Wanted your opinions on whether you believe I'm been done on my bathroom remodel. The work was essentially the old bathroom suite being ripped out and replaced with a walk-shower, counter top sink and repositioned toilet. I also had the room retiled, painted and had the same builder make me a vanity unit and a tall storage unit. My bathroom is fairly small, roughly 5smq floor space, and there were no structural changes needed.
The builder initially quoted £12k for which I told him my budget was in the £10k range and I didn't want to exceed this. He agreed to this and we agreed that I would take charge of sourcing materials but that he could purchase items such as grout/plywood etc since this was easy for him to get hold of. Mistake number one for me was that we never had a contract in place as such, and that I paid him weekly which I shouldn’t have done. I should have paid an amount upfront and then the rest on completion. Anyhoo, long story short, the bathroom ended up taking almost 4 weeks and it still remains incomplete (shaver socket missing, spot lights need replacing, no handles on storage unit etc). Initially, and for ease, I wanted to use the same builder (depending on progress) to also fit my kitchen, flooring and redecorating. I was happy to use the same builder until I noticed that he got somewhat comfortable and work had really slowed. Now given he was being paid weekly, which amounted to a day rate, obviously the longer he took the more I’d have to pay. I also grew concerned by the fact that I had gone over budget and when I started raising these concerns with him, telling him that I needed to reel the spending in, he’d almost become annoyed and make it sound as though I was being irrational and that I should up my budget because ‘you only get to do this once’. The issue was, there wasn’t a magic money tree that I could rely on if I went significantly over budget so I didn’t think I was being unreasonable. The next thing I knew, he’d moved onto other projects within the flat (such as decorating and pulling the kitchen apart) even though the bathroom was incomplete. When I’d try to sit down with him (realising I didn’t want to make the same mistake as before, and this time set a fixed price that we stayed within rather than this turning into a day rate) he seemed reluctant to have this conversation. Every time I asked him to give me a quote for the remaining works, he’d tell me he would, and then never would. Things started to sour when I told him that we MUST agree a fixed amount, and that I would pay him 25% in advance and the rest would follow upon completion. The whole mood changed, he seemed to really take this to heart and felt attacked, telling me that it felt as though I didn’t ‘trust’ him. The final straw for me came when I arrived to my flat, and found that one of the windows had been damaged. He told me that whilst trying to close it, it had gotten jammed and he then insisted that I should look into getting this fixed because my windows were clearly ‘flimsy’. On the same day, upon discussing carpet options for my bedroom (a space which covers 12sqm) he suggested a carpet costing almost £700, knowing full well I was keeping a tighter handle on budget. He also knew that I’d spent £1300 on engineered flooring for a space measuring 30sqm - therefore why would I spend half that amount on carpet for a single room! I realised at this stage that I just couldn’t trust him to ‘stick to the brief’ and that I was better off finding somebody else to finish the rest of the flat. Obviously, he wasn’t happy with this and then suggested he take his belongings and leave. I told him that was fine but that he’d need to fix the window he’d broken and complete my bathroom in full (the vanity was still missing drawers!).
Unfortunately, the drawers he fitted, ironically, are flimsy, not sure if this was deliberate or not, but as mentioned, the bathroom is still not 100% complete. All in all, he was paid £7600 in labour fees (he had help from two others, they looked like apprentices) and then £2210 for materials/expenses. On top of this, I spent £2500 on items such as the shower, toilet, sink, towel rack, tiles, paint etc. So, all in all we’re looking at £12,219 for a bathroom that is still incomplete. He also didn’t provide any invoices, receipts etc, and is still demanding I pay him for painting my bedroom and ripping out the bathroom, which I find a bloody cheek given the bathroom is still incomplete. I should state that this is for a 1 bed flat in SE London. I know that builder costs in London are extortionate, just wanted an idea if people think what I paid was fairly standard or whether I’ve paid over the odds.

OP posts:
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Smallgoon · 26/04/2020 17:33

@earsup ahh, that's good. Happy you've not ended up in the same position as me, and clearly you're both on very good terms. I have requested the receipts and will see if he provides them. I've also yet to receive a single invoice, I made payments direct into his account. He's saying he can't provide them until lockdown is lifted sigh

Is Peter available to fit my kitchen? Wink

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earsup · 26/04/2020 17:45

Peter has a waiting list unfortunately..!...your builder can easily print off his bank statements etc to show how much you paid and he can easily do invoices if he has a computer and printer...sounds like an exscuse not to provide any !

Hanamuslim · 26/04/2020 17:46

Unfortunately love, you have been taken on for a good ride

Hanamuslim · 26/04/2020 18:06

I would feel so angry and annoyed if a builder or any form of workman had done that to us. Maybe as someone had said earlier, the builder took you for a ride because you are a female.... that possibly is true. I feel that way with a lot of things in regards to that aspect ie even shopping in a market. Ten pounds for someone else but would be twenty for me if that makes sense.

I dont know if you're married but whenever we have works done in the apartment, my husband and/or my eldest son supervise the work and I am just in the lounge relaxing with the other children. My husband also makes sure we are getting the best prices and quotes. We recently had an issue with our washer dryer combo. I was calling and emailing everywhere and anywhere as I was really not enjoying handwashing a family of 6 clothes, basically daily. It was hard work. And we got a quote of 79 pounds, including parts and labour and the second call out free which wasn't too bad. Other places were over a hundred. Turns out when the guy came to look at it, it was a small black knob that probably cost about 50p needed to be replaced. I was literally like , seriously. But alas, it started working and I did laundry that same day. But I was upset to have had to fork out almost 80. I have 4 children and that could have gone on a food shop etc. But I just had ti pay as it would have been the standard quote even for a bigger issue.

This builder of yours seems very unreasonable and not just that, but a thief too. I am gutted he even lied about the vertical radiators...and got extra cash for his own pocket. And the sort of cowboy who seems happy chappy at first and then when he wants to dwindle more money out of you, and you're not prepared to, the attitude and atmosphere changes. Sounds like he also has a.bad work ethos. You weren't conned but you have been played. I'd even consider taking him to a small claims court. If he does come back to complete work, have a couple Male relatives with you. And be firm with what YOU want. Hes working for you. Not you for him. Best of luck :)

Smallgoon · 26/04/2020 19:28

@earsup oh of course it's a delay tactic on his part. I messaged him last week saying as much, telling him it took all of two minutes to produce an invoice. He's clearly trying to cover his tracks.

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Smallgoon · 26/04/2020 19:34

@Hanamuslim Thanks, and you're right, it definitely seems as though he took advantage of the fact that I was female, and a FTB. I should also point out that essentially his two apprentices did the bulf of the work, seeing as he himself would disappear to work on other projects. He even put a picture of my bathroom up on his facebook account, and commented on how proud he was of their workmanship, tagging them both in and thus practically admitting that THEY did the lion's share - unbelievable. I have no doubt that the bathroom would have been completed on time if he hadn't have been galavanting off on other projects.

I have considered whether it's worth taking him to a small claims court. I've actually written this off as a bad experience and don't believe I'll be able to retrieve any of that money i've lost, but the idea that he may con others really annoys me. I want to make an example of him, but I didn't have a contract in the first place so I'm not really sure I'd have the grounds. Would be good to hear what others think about this.

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windmill26 · 26/04/2020 22:00

We are in SW London and for a bathroom your size I wouldn't have paid a penny over £6000 ...you definitely have been fleeced!

Smallgoon · 26/04/2020 22:58

@windmill26 - thanks. Out of interest do you mean £6k labour, or all in? I must stress, that I am happy with how my bathroom has turned out. Upon closer inspection, it's not perfect for the money I paid. But my spec was pretty high-end. I can include some pics if it would help, as well as pics of the things that I'm not best pleased about.

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windmill26 · 26/04/2020 23:26

Hi Smallgoon,£6000 labour,material etc... included
It would be an high spec job ,obviously I am not talking fittings from somewhere like Agape(you would spend £6000 just for a bath!) but more along the line of Vitra ,Ideal Standard etc..

Smallgoon · 27/04/2020 00:01

here's some pics.

Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
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Smallgoon · 27/04/2020 00:03

and a few more... I designed it and i'm happy with how it turned out. Just believe it cost more than it should, and the finishing could have been better

Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
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Smallgoon · 27/04/2020 00:08

a couple before pics, sorry the're aren't many. The bathroom was the first thing on my list when I completed and I decided I wouldn't move in until that and the kitchen were sorted. Perhaps another flaw on my part.

Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
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Smallgoon · 27/04/2020 12:11

UPDATE: I messaged MyBuilder.co.uk at the weekend. I was so angry and my email simply read "I was fleeced by a builder I found on your site". Anyway, I just took a call from a pleasant lady who works there who wanted to understand what went wrong. I have to say, kudos to them for contacting me so soon.
Anyway, I explained the situation to her, and she has advised I reach out to him, via the MyBuilder site (as they can then monitor all comms) to state my complaint and see if we can come to a resolution. Obviously I can leave negative feedback, since this is what it's there for, but if he doesn't respond or is dismissive of my complaint, she said they'd look to remove him from the site, and I should (after trying to reason with him) look to go to a small claims court. I know this may be me fighting a losing battle, but I simply don't want him to get away it (lord knows how many times he's done this before), so if it means he'll sweat a little, this will be my approach.
I'll continue to update, am aiming to send the email today, requesting invoices and all receipts. Will be asking that he offer me a partial refund.

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NotNowPlzz · 27/04/2020 12:25

Bathroom looks beautiful!!

windmill26 · 27/04/2020 13:23

The bathroom looks good and obviously reflect your taste (love the shower) .The material and fittings are all good quality but I still think that you have been overcharged .I hope the builder will do the right thing and refund you part of the money.

Smallgoon · 27/04/2020 13:35

@windmill26 Thanks, I entirely agree. And as I said, when you scratch the surface, the finishing is not great. Have attached some pics. Not sure if I can upload videos but the drawers to my vanity are so flimsy, they will probably buckle under weight

Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
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MarieG10 · 27/04/2020 14:11

The finish is shockingly poor. We have rentals and would never accept that at all. I would be refusing to lay any more, get quotes to have it redone and issue a claim in the small claims court. He would struggle to say that is of satisfactory quality.

Appalling

Smallgoon · 27/04/2020 14:58

@MarieG10 Thank you, I agree. I'm also not happy with my tile trim (which I left him to order and sort since he's the expert). It just doesn't look right, is this because, he should have used a 'curved trim' - does anyone know? He also couldn't be bothered to clean the silicone from my tiles, and the paint splashes all over the floor, tap and radiator.

Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
Did I get fleeced by my builder on bathroom remodel?
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Hanamuslim · 28/04/2020 06:20

I would have actually said 8 grand for your bathroom. I know London is expensive but I am in Surrey and even that is too much for here. Honestly , go to small claims court and have printed any conversations on your phone printed and any emails printed and just what you have and make a monkey out of him.

The bathroom is nice, very nice but obviously at a closer look, the finishing isn't great. I hope you get this sorted. God bless

Hanamuslim · 28/04/2020 06:21

You should watch homes under the hammer, specifically properties in London and see how much people spent on their bathrooms and compare lol. I am actually being serious. I love that programme.

Smallgoon · 28/04/2020 13:02

@Hanamuslim I actually LOVE homes under the hammer! Always surprised by how much people managed to get done by spending so little. But I've learned the hard way that honest builders are a rare breed and that I can't rely on websites. Recommendations from friends is the only way I'll go moving forwards. My brother's best friend is a carpenter, and thankfully once lockdown is lifted, he should be able to sort my flooring and kitchen. Relied on another friend of the family to have my boiler and sink plumbing moved - all done in a day without any issues at all, and for a very reasonable cost.

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Smallgoon · 01/05/2020 09:48

Question: Given my poor experience with a builder who supposedly had 100% positive feedback on MyBuilder, clearly I won't be touching MyBuilder with a barge pole, and judging by what I've read on this forum, check a trade is just a bad. I have a fair bit of work that still needs doing on my flat. I'm a FTB and truth be told, not sure of where I could get recommendations seeing as most people my age haven't had extensive work carried out. What is the advice for how I find somebody trustworthy to carry out the rest of the work, if I'm to avoid MyBuilder like the plague?

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earsup · 01/05/2020 15:31

@ smallgoon
local face book pages are good to find people or friends etc that have had work done....and always be wary of ones that can start the next day as good people have a long waiting list...before i found peter, i used a chap called mark smith and his wait is appx one year but worth it.

Muchlywrong · 01/05/2020 15:58

If you have people who have come and done work for you and you think they have done a good job for a good price, then ask them. Tradespeople will always have other people who they work with and will see their working patterns and how trustworthy they seem. Neighbour's are also good sources of information.
Best thing to do is hold them down to a price on anything that is agreed. I generally over quote by a day or two on labour, as this should help cover for most unforeseen circumstances and the psychological effect of being pleased that they've come in under budget at the end also helps. A 10-15% contingency should also be factored in to your budget. Mostly though, whomever is doing work for you should be communicating with you if not daily, at least every three days, so that you know of any problems that have arisen, whether they may be with you later as they have to pick up more materials and any extra costs that may occur. Face to face is the best, but if you are out at work, a 10 minute phone call will suffice

MarieG10 · 01/05/2020 17:19

Recommendation, recommendation and finally recommendation.

Neighbours, friends etc

Whenever I have used anyone other than recommendation I have had problems

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