Boundary issue - with diagram

[Removemyshed]

I was going to take away an old shed in my garden. It’s totally rotten and I wanted to put a table and patio there. I went to tell the neighbour as she has a small dog and the fence won’t be immediately in place. She immediately went marching down the garden demanding to know where I planned to put the fence.

I said i’d just continue the line of the existing fence (as that’s clearly the boundary). She then said no you’re wrong the shed is the boundary and I’d better build it in the same spot. In essence with a weird kink in my new fence.

I have now been bombarded with threatening emails - she’s taken legal advice, she’ll sue me for trespass, she’ll remove anything constructed illegally on what is her garden, it’ll be criminal damage of her plants.

I see what she means that the side of my shed has been the extent of her garden as she sees it. I’ve no idea when the original fence was removed, but the gap (‘wire’ on drawing) has been plugged with a small wire fence that is nailed to the shed and my fence. No idea who did that, but I assume it was to save cost at some point. The gap is created by the guttering and roof overhang of the shed.

Now I’m not really worried, we are talking 20cm, but the kink will look odd and it’ll be more difficult to build - I was going to replace the whole fence.

I’ve looked at the deeds and the line is straight so I think I’m correct in thinking the boundary is (or at least was) straight. Surely you couldn’t build a shed partly in someone’s else’s garden anyway, even if it is just the edge of the roof?

However she’s rather unnerved me. Would I be breaking the law by building on the boundary? If she wasn’t so bloody rude and aggressive I’d be more inclined to take her views onboard, but I’m feeling now that she’s trying to bully me into doing what she wants.

For completeness she has plants growing against our shed.

She’s lived there for 8 years.

The shed must be 40 years old and the fence similar.

Boundary on other gardens are not clear as hedges have been planted.

I don’t want to anything illegal, but at the same time why should I just give her some of my very small garden.

Where should I build the fence?

Apologies for the saga, planning to do this once lockdown is over and stewing on it now.

What does the red outline on your deed say? I'm guessing she's wrong; someone built the shed inside your boundary and she let the old fence fall to pieces unbeknown to you as you couldn't see it. She then just saw the shed wall as a boundary. No-one ever builds a shed as a boundary, they're temporary constructs.

The boundary is a straight line, therefore the shed wall is not the boundary.

If she tries to sue, she'll be laughed out of court and if she does pull down the fence, she's committing criminal damage.

As PP, the shed cannot be the boundary. The fence would have been built first and the shed erected at a later date. Follow the red line on your deeds. Her plants will need to be moved.

download your and her deeds from the land registry website.
hopefully it will show you are right about the straight line boundary.

She says is it has been like that for over 17 years (her and the previous owners time) and so it’s now hers. I’ve googled it seems she does have some claim, that’s what’s worrying me.

The red line is straight @Loofah01

We had this with a neighbour, also when replacing a fence.

She’s essentially nicked a strip of your garden. If the line is straight on the deeds, the boundary is in line with the existing fence.
Send her a photocopy of the deeds and install your fence as you intended. Warn her to remove any plants she wants to retain.

Our neighbour initially kicked off, but the deeds were very clear so she moved her shrubs and we built the fence.

@woodencoffeetable she‘S saying that the deeds don’t reflect reality and that they are disregarded and is quoting all sorts of laws. She’s referenced her solicitor about 5 times now, but I’ve not had anything official except her very aggressive emails.

I can’t afford a legal fight, but feel bullied and now want my rights protected.

She's trying to claim squatters rights.

[[https://www.gov.uk/squatting-law/squatters-rights-to-property]]

How long have you lived there?

The sale of your house (with consequential boundary claims) should scupper her claims.

The overhang of your shed roof is right up to the boundary, she can’t encroach under your shed roof.

The boundary will be straight. Take lots of photos, and then get on and do what you want.

www.gov.uk/squatting-law/squatters-rights-to-property

Sorry, put the brackets in the wrong place. 😳

The shed was placed so the guttering was within your boundary.
You are right.

You should seek legal advice of course but I doubt she will do anything as there will be a cost.

shelter on adverse possession

send her a letter with a picture of the deeds, advising the boundary has not changed, and remains the line as per the deeds and as per your guttering and roof overhang, and that she has time now to move any shrubs that she has illegally grown on your property.
The fence will be going up on the legal boundary, which, as per property law, has been maintained by the line of your roof overhang.
She is being a CF

Tell her you will build it in a straight line, because that is the property boundary. The shed followed it ... via the guttering, which was politely NOT hanging over the neighbour's property.

She's got nothing. If she's banging on about adverse possession then that changed 18 years ago and she'd have had to apply to become the new owner and you would have been notified of this, or it would have come up during your purchase and shown on a new set of deeds (which it hasn't).
If you're really concerned about it, get a letter from a solicitor outlying the position and that if she must immediately vacate all her crap off your land.

@Gingernaut and @woodencoffeetable

I’ve been here for nearly a year. Feel like the new nasty neighbour.

This is what worries me. Reading those links she does have a claim. It’s only 20cm, but she’s very keen on it.

If she has a claim and I put the fence on the boundary, then what? Can she actually sue me? I can’t afford to take it out and do it twice.

I’m going round in circles.

Sorry loads of x-posts!

Check your household insurance to see if you have legal expenses insurance. They usually cover these types of dispute. Boundaries can change over time. As a general rule of thumb, trespasses of 6 inches or less are considered de minimis - too futile to involve the courts, but 20cmnis slightly over that, although arguably you could argue it's de minimis. However, you never know how far a neighbour will go with legal action. I used to deal with these types of disputes and people get really nasty.
The Land Registry used to have a process to determine a boundary - might be worth looking into that as alternative. Good luck!

Also - Land Registry maps only show general boundaries, which can have a margin of error of up to 2 metres as far as I can remember, so I wouldn't rely solely on those maps.

Looking at that link for Shelter, she would only have grounds to the land if the following apply

• there has been a reasonable mistake as to boundaries where the following four conditions are all met:[22]
• the land concerned is adjacent to land owned by the squatter
• the exact line of the boundary has not already been determined
• the squatter had reasonably believed that the land belonged to her/him for the last 10 years, and
• the land was registered, by the legal owner, for more than one year prior to the date of the application.

As she has only been there 8 years, the deeds from her purchase will have shown a straight line. In addition, part of the fence is already there showing where the boundary is, plus as others have said you wouldn't be allowed to overhang your shed across the boundary.

If I were you I would get this sorted now, before she can claim the 10 years. The fact that it was like it when she moved in is irrelevant, and I wouldn't have thought she could claim on behalf of the previous owners of her property. The clock reset when she bought the property.

I would send her the letter suggested by BatInTheAttic, sooner, rather than later. Most people IME wouldn't have even warned a neighbour over the back, and the first she'd have known about it would have been looking at the new fence.

She has no claim. None. However, if you're really worried about it and don't want to be a nasty neighbour then do a straight line fence but remove a small portion of your garden and gift it to her. Insanity to my mind but sounds like it would put your mind at ease, means a straight line boundary and you won;t have any dispute

She sounds like a CF. It also sounds like that land is yours. If she’s that keen on it, then get her to make you an offer for it. I guessing she won’t. Her interpretation of the deeds is funny by the way, why would they be wrong?! I’m guessing as that doesn’t suit her. When you send her the letter then l would send it registered so she can’t claim she didn’t get it

the squatter had reasonably believed that the land belonged to her/him for the last 10 years. I don’t see how she can have believed that, her deeds are straight too!

Part of me would more happily let her have it if she at least paid for that adverse possession thingy. At least it’s legal and not just her pushing me around.

I can’t believe I’m losing sleep over this, but you read of people starting £50k battles over this stuff.

Do NOT move the boundary and give it to her!

You’ll cause yourself nightmares in the future if you wanted to sell.