Kitchen island plug sockets....

[Chickenandegg8]

Hi,
We’re having a kitchen island in our new kitchen and I’m struggling with plug sockets.
I’ve attached a plan of the island. We’ve been told we can only have them either at A or B as that’s where voids are. Otherwise the back boxes would stick out 2-3 cms out of the end panels of the cupboards.

If we go for A we would may need an extension lead to to reach near the hob and possibly seating area depending on wire length, as the wire would need to come over the overhang of the island .
If we go for B we would need an extension lead to reach the seating area if someone is sat at the island and wants to charge tablet/ phone etc...
I’ve been told that my island is a very odd shape with seating where it is.... I can’t really believe that but I don’t know where else to put any sockets.... any advice anyone?
We don’t want the pop up sockets in the middle of the island....
thanks

Maybe do both, A and B?

If you go for A, why would you need an extension to reach the hob? If you’re using a handheld blender just move the saucepan to the socket.

So A is under the peninsula?

Yes A is under the peninsula.
I did think of both , I think that may be the way forward.
I think the only problem with moving the pan/pot to the socket is when we’re using really metal heavy dishes, we didn’t want to be moving them round when they’re full of boiling hot food etc especially as the socket is right by seating area.
😊

You can get a pop up one in the worktop

Why wouldn't you want popup? They look so cool.

I would go for both A&B. It's a large area and you will need access to electricity at any point along it, and can't assume a cord length of more than about 60cm for many appliances.

Yes I think we’ll do both A&B.
I’ve just never been keen on pop up sockets.

Thank you for your replies everyone!

What units do you have above A (so on the long side) or on the opposite long side (so to the right of the single seat)? Or near to the hob? If they're not appliances, can you have a plug socket built into the unit - so its inside the cupboard?

We have a socket in a cupboard in the kitchen and also in a wardrobe upstairs where there would be a long distance between a wall socket and where I'd want to use an appliance.

Still not ideal with your scenario, but something to consider? Otherwise A and B as canvassed above.

I'm not keen on pop up sockets either but these are a (dear) alternative
www.appliancehouse.co.uk/shop/EVOline-BACKFLIP-1-USB-2UK-Socket.html

Sounds like your builder isn't very good. Put the socket wherever you want. The cable can run up the inside and there is no need for a back box, just drill a hole and screw the face plate directly into the wood of the island. Here's my one with no cavity behind and a drawer there.
drive.google.com/file/d/0B95uOpIIUNvtcWUxdXN0N2NLMEJmTml3S25MelI5SmlRR2lr/view?usp=sharing

Do you know what the inside of that drawer unit looks like @shazzbot? I was hoping to do something like that in our upcoming kitchen but I didn't think you could run the cable up the inside like that as it'd cross over the drawer runners? Looks good!

Go for both and for the ones on the island get sockets that have usb ports as well as normal plugs. Means you can charge couple of phones at same time as using the sockets for appliances etc

Yes the cable actually runs up in the left corner as you look at it and then runs horizontally above the drawer runner to where the socket is. The kitchen unit was bought from Wren 6 months ago. Looking at the runners they have gaps anyway so a cable could be fed straight down from the socket but it would be a bit trickier.

Shazzbot sorry but all electrical sockets switches and accessories require a back box. All terminals must be enclosed. Please do not advise on these matters unless you know the facts. This stuff kills people. Yours, an electrician.

To the OP have sockets in both locations. There is nothing at all stopping you having socket A on the side of a cabinet, you can hide the gubbins by creating a box on the inside of the cupboard. The only thing with having it where you've drawn it is the appliances you might want to plug in there tend to have quite short leads and you're using 3-400mm of flex under the worktop. Also it's not easy to get to and anybody unfamiliar with your kitchen might not realise they're there.

thanks @stevefromdonny, would you be able to quote the regulation requiring a backbox for sockets? The guy was a registered electrician and give me a completion certificate so perhaps I should report this if it is not legal.

@stevefromdonny I see what you mean - the wire could get caught in the runners which is presumably dangerous. Is there a correct way to put a socket on the side of a drawer unit? Do you need to build out a service void at the side?

I don't have a regs book to hand, but you can't simply attach sockets to timber with wood screws. Fire protection for a start, timber is combustible. If it's as you describe then when you remove the drawer then there's exposed live parts behind the socket (you can see the terminals and inner coloured cores of the cables)? Regardless how the drawer comes out this is wrong, live parts should need a tool to become accessible. Protection from shock by direct contact.

Its not a question of legality, BS7671 (the regs) is not a statutory document, but his certifying authority (niceic, napit etc) may be keen to know about what's happened here as departures from the regs should be documented and reasons given. There's no reason not to fit a back box ever. But in the first instance maybe give him the chance to rectify this if the rest of the installation is sound (though how you'll know as a lay person is tricky).

Did the registered electrician work for a kitchen fitting firm by any chance or were they employed by you directly?

Ecthelion, the correct way is to mount a back box either metal or plastic into the cupboard unit and clip the cables to the cupboard wherever they are routed. You can build out the side of the cupboard inside to form a void if you want though this isn't strictly necessary, it just hides the back of the socket. The cables should be routed as much as possible out of sight and out of the way of drawers, possible shelf positions etc etc and possibly use trunking for additional aesthetic and mechanical protection.

Pop-up socket in the Island.

I'm no electrician, but the idea of a live faceplate open at the back with no box is making me wince...

@Shazzbot
From BS7671:2018
526.5 Every termination and joint in a live conductor or a PEN conductor shall be made within one of the
following or a combination thereof:
(i) A suitable accessory complying with the appropriate product standard
(ii) An equipment enclosure complying with the appropriate product standard
(iii) An enclosure partially formed or completed with building material which is non-combustible when tested to
BS 476-4.
526.8 Cores of sheathed cables from which the sheath has been removed and non-sheathed cables at the
termination of conduit, ducting or trunking shall be enclosed as required by Regulation 526.5.

This is potentially a C1 on an inspection report which means it is immediately dangerous, you should have a qualified competent person inspect the works asap. If defects are found the original contractor should be reported. BS7671 may not be statutory but the building regulations are and they state BS7671 must be followed except in a few very defined circumstances. Compliance with BS7671 is also deemed to be compliance with the electricity at work regulations.

Was about to point out all terminations must be enclosed but i see I've been well and truly beaten to it!
Yes you can miss out all sorts and still survive but that doesn't make you a good builder it makes you a cowboy. Customer is not always right and the builder should follow the regs as they're there for a reason.

I was going to say you can or sockets in the island wall like shazzbot has, but with a shallow backbox!! I have them in mine. The island has a finishing panel (18mm thick) and the drawer panel behind (also 18mm thick). With a 25mm backbox cut into the wood I have sockets setup just like shazzbot, but, you know, with a backbox!!

Tell the fitter where you want them an a trade's man worth anything will put them there. I don't see any reason why you can't have them where you want. Can use a dry wall back box

Thanks so much for your responses everyone!
Ideally I’d like them in B and along the side of one of the cupboards- so parallel to A.
I’ve been told as there are no voids (as it’s the side of the cupboard) I can’t have one there ..... I did ask can we not just put a back box in the cupboard or cut out a bit of the cupboard side to put a back box in... but again I got ‘not sure we could do that’
Reading everyone’s responses I think they’re just being a bit awkward!

I will go back to them and tell them that’s where I want them.
Thank you! 😀