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I've been had by my landlord and it seems he has form! Advice please?

57 replies

NeedLegalAdvice · 28/04/2015 01:46

Serious essay – Advance warning!

So where to start....

Rented a house just over a year ago on an original 6 month AST.

The house was not perfect but all of the issues SEEMED aesthetic.

The landlord gave the impression that he had been living in the house and that he wanted a 'family' as they look after houses more than singles and students. It turned out, on later talking to the neighbours, he had been renting the house out continually over 8 years.

The housing market is hot around here. This was literally the only house at the time which was not agency managed. This made it more attractive and slightly cheaper.

Rent was £450 per week versus the local market rate of £480/£490.

He knew the house was slightly dated and said that he had reduced the rate to reflect this. On starting the tenancy he said we were free to add a lick of paint so we did! We covered over internal and external damp trusting that he had told the truth about them being rectified issues. We paid for a professional deep clean and a carpet clean. One of the walls with so called 'old' damp was also crumbling so we patched this up and as the house is quite large the bill came to around 2.5k for all of this as the labour price was naturally quite a lot.

One month in no problems!

A chunk of garden fence was missing; the landlord had said he didn’t want to ask the neighbours to fix it as they were really nice people who ran out of money after renovation work. Their dog bit my child! Of course, turns out the fence was his.

A toilet didn’t work. He said he would fix it, it was just a single part issue. Similarly, a light switch (pully) didn’t work for one of the upstairs bedrooms. He called his builder round on multiple occasions to ‘quote’ for work. Of course nothing ever got done and on one visit he basically told me to leave the room. I hung around and despite my landlords best effort, I saw a half built flat in the roof! I assume the toilet and the electrics didn’t work as they had to be re-routed to supply the flat.

Lots of little niggling issues crop up. There are ceiling leaks which literally means a shower comes into the room on heavy rain. It comes through a stained roof area, again, apparently damp which had been corrected!

The house is infested with rodents which becomes more apparent as the weather gets colder.

There is damp covering one whole ceiling, two internal walls and even kitchen cupboards which touch the ground. Mushrooms are now accompanying it!

I am telling him all of the issues and as I start suspecting him at this point, a lot of correspondence is intentionally written via email!

Anyway, around this time we finally get approved for a mortgage. Being what we now know as unnecessarily honest, we let the landlord know. He tells us that he would like to take the opportunity to sell so we remain on a rolling contract on the condition we allow viewings. This works out quite well for us in real terms!

He places the property on the market with the famous London agents who over over over inflate vendors expectations. In 3 months he gets 1 viewing!

We find a place and give him a months notice. He says he will be travelling so our deposit will take a little longer to return, no problem though all okay, we have been good tenants, not on his back for risk of being chucked out, ridiculously clean and rent always on time.

One day later we get 4 calls on a Saturday to view the house which we allow. The following week I am inundated with honestly around 30 calls to view, some of which I allow and some of which I don’t because of convenience and routine with 3 small children. The landlord didn’t even bother to communicate that he had put the house back on to let. Agents walk around promising my furniture as part of the let and this is when I find out the property is on for rent again. None of this is my business or makes any difference to me apart from the fact the level of viewings AND number of phone calls is just too much. I give the agents keys and say you can view anytime during the day Mon-Fri but please otherwise leave me alone. I will be gone in a few weeks regardless and you can do as you like.

I also need to mention that the landlord and the agents now reckon the house is worth £650 per week. In such a hot market, even at that price, any house on the market for any longer than a week has issues or is hugely overpriced! In the month we allowed viewings he had no lets.

Fast forward to our move out day. It’s the Sunday before the bank holiday. I underestimated how much rubbish we would make and how much we would throw away. Because it was the bank holiday I couldn’t get collection arranged for the Monday morning so I went back to the house on Monday to bag all the items as neatly as possible on the driveway with the aim to arrange collection for Tuesday morning which I did! As I was on the driveway, I literally saw my landlord who’s on holiday might I add, turn the corner! He drove straight by and pretended he couldn’t see me! It felt like I was in a movie scene.

Of course he had to say something at this point so an hour later I got a message saying he had rearranged his holiday dates to come back and see us earlier to ensure we could get our deposit back faster!

Fully acknowledging he was a bullshitter at this point, I said brilliant, seen as were all here, lets do the inventory now to make this even more efficient. He said he was actually quite upset with us due to my rejection of 30 viewings a week and that he would rather not see us and could we just drop keys through the letter box. After a lot of eye rolling we did. We had no choice.

After various calls, texts and emails asking when we would receive our deposit back, we didn’t hear a word from him until a letter came to my work place basically saying we will not be getting our deposit of around £2k back as he will be taking that away from the £6k we owe him.

We owe him £1.5k in loss of rent due to not allowing viewings all day. We owe him another 3.5k for him having to remedy our terrible paint work and we owe him the rest because of some sought of issue with how we gave him notice!

I suspect the ridiculousness of this figure is an attempt at reverse psychology where we say ‘OK please just keep our deposit and be nice and write of the other 4k’.

I would actually like to be compensated for the money we wasted on effectively covering damp! My poor, once animal loving child is now terrified of animals. After everything I am so angry at this fraudster and I would like to take him to court.

My questions are….

The house had not been decorated in at least 7 years! I suspect he had to repaint because the agents said you will not achieve £650 per week or even the £450 we were paying with damp spots ALL OVER the house. The agents have some lovely pictures on their website which display our perfectly normal paint job and lots of beautiful damp if you know where to look! This bad paint job was so bad you used pictures of this to put a £1,000,000 house on the market might I add. Can I use these in court?

Can I request witness statements from my neighbours and the estate agents with regards to the condition of the property?

One neighbour suggested he has done similar before? Can I request information from our tenancy deposit schemes to see if this is a pattern?

Can I take him to court without paying tons. We are broke for a long while after this house move?

Lastly I suspect my money is gone! I have been doing some research and apparently he used to be a hotel owner. It looks as though his business went under and if the vast majority of his reviews are anything to go by, he has form for being an aggressive, lying bully. A lot of dishonest behaviour is described by his hotel guests. I am confident I am dealing with a fraudster, can I use this information to build a case.

Any other advice, does anything stand out? What do I need to prove/disprove? What can I claim for? How can I claim? Can I get any legal assistance?

Much appreciated and hopefully this thread can help those who may find themselves in similar positons.

OP posts:
HelenF350 · 28/04/2015 02:30

Was your deposit protected as it legally should have been? You should be able to raise a dispute if it was. I don't think he has a leg to stand on with either claim. You are not obliged to allow viewings, and if he has not decorated in 7 years he should not be able to charge you for it!

rootypig · 28/04/2015 02:40

Either your deposit was legally protected in a deposit scheme, as it should have been, and you can raise a dispute; or the deposit wasn't legally protected, as it should have been, and you can go after him for that.

www.gov.uk/tenancy-deposit-protection/overview
www.gov.uk/tenancy-deposit-protection/disputes-and-problems

If he didn't put it in a TDP (you should have been given details at the time), then ring Shelter for advice.

monkeyfacegrace · 28/04/2015 03:30

Could be your lucky day.

If he didn't use a TDP, not only will you get your deposit back, you will get 3/4 times more if you take him to court.

If he did use aTDP, again, he has no chance of retaining any of your deposit anyway without a proper check out.

He is banking on you not knowing your stuff.

Enjoy being in the position of power!

wowfudge · 28/04/2015 07:51

Agree with pps. Take screenshots or download and keep the brochure the agents are marketing with. Any correspondence you had about viewings, keep it. Where is the actual inventory check out paperwork or has everything been verbal?

wowfudge · 28/04/2015 07:54

Given this guy's history and his financial track record, concentrate on trying to get your money back - I think it is unlikely you will actual get more as you may not be able recover it from him. Act quickly. You didn't block viewings so you haven't caused him loss of rent.

momtothree · 28/04/2015 08:15

Hi get a letter from agent stating viewing/keys instructions on viewing. Ask neigbours for witness staements. Get quotes u received and invoices for work done. All adds up.

Nolim · 28/04/2015 08:27

I had a rubish ll once. She did not protect the deposit and and was a firts class arse. Anyway i hired a solicitor to deal with her. The fee was 500 gpb and it was worth it since the deposit was more than that, the law was clearly on my side since the llandord is required by law to protect the deposit and i would rather pay an honest professional than let a crazy unreasonable arse steal my money.

Pm me if you want my solicitor details.

Feckeggblue · 28/04/2015 08:33

You are going to nail him. Go get the tosser. Hope your new house is lovely

suzannecanthecan · 28/04/2015 08:48

The law may be on your side but he sounds very slippery and probably knows exactly how much piss he can get away with taking.
He'll be an expert in wriggling out of things, obfuscation, playing for time etc so that if you chase him it will soon start to seem like just more trouble and expense than it's worth ?

HeyDuggee · 28/04/2015 09:01

He has to have the money in a scheme. He cannot deduct ANYTHING without your agreement. If you don't agree, it goes to mediation (appointed by the scheme he's registered with). The burden of proof is on the landlord.

If there is no check in and check out inventory (preferably by 3rd party), he can prove anything.
If there is, he can only deduct based on that AND he must take into account wear and tear of 7 years.

Paint and carpet have that life expectancy so he can't charge you for new ones, as he would be expected to replace carpet every 5-8 years anyway.

He can't charge you for loss of income as you legally do not have to allow for ANY viewings at all. At best, he could get 1-2 week of rent saying he could have rented it sooner but he would need to take you to small claims as that is not allowed to be deducted from the deposit.

Quality of your diy is irrelevant as he permitted it and it's a risk he took.

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 28/04/2015 09:02

I can't believe you spent all that money on a rented house and agreed to write off £2k deposit. Have you never rented before?

HeyDuggee · 28/04/2015 09:02

He CANT prove anything, I meant

EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 28/04/2015 09:03

And what they said ^ what he's trying to do is unlawful.

Nolim · 28/04/2015 09:05

A solicitor charges less than 2k. Dont let the ll steal your hard earned money. Take him to the small claims court if necessary.

purplemunkey · 28/04/2015 09:31

I got fleeced as a student with ludicrous claims on our deposit. I got about £30 back after the landlord's 'deductions', some of my housemates actually got invoices from him, the cheeky bastard. We'd all graduated and moved away once all this came to light and were probably a little naive in terms of our rights so he got away with it.

A few years ago another landlord tried it on with mine & DPs deposit. The DPS has been introduced by now; we challenged it and got every penny back. We had to borrow the deposit for our new place while we waited for it to get sorted though. I really hope these rogue landlords get black marks against them when they try this on so that persistent offenders get flagged. What would have happened if we didn't have anyone to borrow from? We probably would have had to take the small amount he was offering to return and try and scrape together the rest from thin air Sad

NeedLegalAdvice · 28/04/2015 11:01

Thank you all for taking the time to reply!

He is registered to a scheme but oddly the scheme does not 'hold' the money. He is expected to have not spent the money (which I'm sure he has) and the scheme simply requires that he now puts the money into their account on opening of a dispute.

www.thedisputeservice.co.uk/tenants-overview.html

They can only award me the price of the original deposit and I'm confident that they will BUT I would like to claim for more.

I would have never bothered if he wasn't so slippery but I think it would act as a deterrent and I have no moral conscious to make his life easier.

He told us so many lies and honestly we are such nice, open and perhaps too honest people. We have a young family and our child was bitten by a dog because of his lies. We have been living in a damp and rodent infested house because we spent so much money originally on false promises. The numbers involved do sound ridiculous when reading this back but it is honestly the reality of renting with no real right and no real course to complain for fear of being kicked out.

The timing did dictate a lot but if his behaviour is disgusting enough to claim off a young family for lies I am more than happy to go after him for not meeting his obligations as a landlord.

He is old enough to be our dad and we showed him that level of respect and trust because of this.

Basically can I and if so any ideas how? I have receipts from the paint job, the carpet clean and the deep clean. All of these were unnecessary as he we were covering up damp, an old mouldy carpet and rodent infested, hugely dilapidated house, all of which he concealed.

I also forgot to mention in my OP that we found old paperwork from just before our move in date saying the boiler had been marked unsafe and in need of immediate replacement. We had British gas over multiple times and except providing us with co2 meters they requested to speak to him and left him messages which he never actioned. I didn't probe the content of these calls at the time so didn't know it was that bad until we stumbled upon the paperwork.

I will use the tenancy deposit scheme but considering he will probably not pay them I feel I may as well go after him via the courts and claim more i.e. The money that I have in receipts for what we put into the house at the start of our tenancy, damages for the dog bite, our deposit and my partner also had some serious sinus problems whilst in the house and since and we wonder if the damp kick-started that.

Saying that, can the courts go after his assets of he doesn't cough up the cash?

Similarly, we relied on this money to help us with works on our new house. We have had to hold these off because we don't have the cash and in doing so it has slowed us down to the point of needing to pay for somewhere else to stay. We are still loosing money because of this fraud and it seems all so unfair. Deposit aside, I feel like he should pay but how and how much I'm unsure of!

I could just be BVU! Prepared to be told so....

OP posts:
EhricLovesTheBhrothers · 28/04/2015 11:05

You can't expect him to pay for work you willingly paid for. When you realised the scale of the work your choice was to try to get him to carry it out or to leave. You won't get refunded for that in a million years as you willingly paid for it yourselves and you have nothing in writing to suggest he would refund you.
The deposit however you should get back at least in part as he is trying to claim for things that are unlawful.

suzannecanthecan · 28/04/2015 11:12

?
He a businessman, he's in it for profit, you've seen him as a parental figure and assumed that he will act benevolently towards you.
I doubt that anything you do will deter him from treating others so horribly, he doesn't see you as people who deserve a safe and secure home, he sees you as cash cows to be milked for profit ?

LaurieFairyCake · 28/04/2015 11:21

All the issues you want to claim money for should have been sorted at the time. You are the one who put up with it and deferred to him unnecessarily - ive done exactly the same thing before.

Get your deposit back and then let it go. Trying to fight for more money on top of your deposit will be fruitless.

He can lie, cheat and talk bullshit - those are not actionable.

I have fruitlessly taken 2 people to court over 'unfairness'in my life. Even though I won the actions I never saw a penny. In hindsight I'd let it go quicker and just get my deposit back.

You WILL get your deposit back and now you're moving in to your lovely new place that's all yours. This is a nice horror anecdote for the future.

NeedLegalAdvice · 28/04/2015 11:24

Yep understand all of the above and I am happy to now adopt the same attitude... If I can!

After putting a deposit down you cant just leave the next day.

Similarly we took the condition of the property and his word that the issues visible to the eye had been repaired, in good faith. No reason not to. Maybe I'm stupid for assuming its rare to find a fully grown adult that will outright lie to you in such ridiculous ways.

I have email correspondence with his (later transpired) lies.

There is also the dog bite, the sinus issue and the money we are loosing daily through his unlawful delay in returning the deposit to us. Issues such as boilers and damp are landlords' legal duties.

Basically wanting to know what I can claim for and how.

I understand their are limitations, it would be good to have the help of mumsnet , especially any legal experts to let me know what these are and what is not.

OP posts:
suzannecanthecan · 28/04/2015 11:31

'rare to find a fully grown adult that will outright lie to you in such ridiculous ways'

Indeed you would think so, but he doesn't care what you think of him, to him you are not important and therefore your opinion of him is insignificant.
That's why he just comes out with any old gobshiite?

NeedLegalAdvice · 28/04/2015 11:32

Laurie thanks for your response. Your experiences are what I suspect will happen. I just wanted to know if the courts could go after his assets? It seems in your cases they didn't. Any reason why? I would only claim for what I could prove I.e. The dog bite and the boiler. The sinus issue coincides with doctors visits but that may be a battle that's not worth it. The main bug bearer is the amount of money we are stuck paying to house our family until we basically get paid again as we fully expected our deposit back and we are stuck with house works as a result.

I would go through the TDS and persue him through court independently is I could basically do so with little to no costs. I want to know if there is a low cost way of doing this?

Similarly, can I request statements from the estate agents. They alone can make my case!

OP posts:
NeedLegalAdvice · 28/04/2015 11:36

suzanne of course I agree with you but at this stage I'm not trying to emotionally prove or disprove this guys character. I mentioned these to help build an overall picture of the scenario. Now I'm just trying to see what's possible in legal and monetary terms.

OP posts:
HelenF350 · 28/04/2015 11:45

Open a dispute,send in your evidence. It will be up to him to prove his side. You should get your deposit back, as for anything else forget it. I don't think you have a leg to stand on as you did the work voluntarily.

grumbleina · 28/04/2015 11:45

Ugh. I had something similar on a smaller scale happen to me.

Focus on getting all of your deposit back and try to forget about the other stuff - it's more likely you'll win on that front and it'll be less stressful.

I'm not sure but I don't think the dog bite will be relevant - it's sort of the neighbours fault if anyone's for not keeping their dog secured and/or training it properly, despite it being the landlord's fence.