Preparing at state primary for selective London girls’ schools at 11+

[MTHRVRD2030]

Hi everyone,
I’d really appreciate some advice from parents whose daughters attend (or have gone through the process for) top London girls’ schools such as SPGS, Godolphin & Latymer, etc.
I have a bright 4-year-old daughter. She has been reading since around 3.5 and is currently reading comfortably at Oxford Reading Tree Level 4–5. She enjoys books, discussing stories, word search-type activities, and loves Numberblocks. She’s been at an independent prep nursery/preschool since she was 2 and is very happy there. She also has weekly piano lessons, which she enjoys.
However, due to financial circumstances (I’m an international PhD student and we have two older children in state schools), we won’t realistically be able to continue with private primary education, although they offered us 50% bursary.
We’ve been offered a place at an outstanding local state primary in Leeds, which we are considering.
My question is: how feasible is it to prepare a child from a state primary for highly selective London girls’ schools at 11+ (especially with the aim of scholarship/bursary)?
I’d be really grateful for any practical advice on:

1. What makes the biggest difference in preparation (beyond just academics)?
2. Whether being in an independent prep is a significant advantage at this level
3. How best to structure early years (ages 4–10) if aiming for these schools
4. Any specific things you wish you had done earlier

I’m not looking to over-pressure her; she’s very happy and curious, and I want to keep it that way, but I’d like to make informed decisions early if possible.

Thank you so much in advance.

It honestly would not have crossed my mind for my four year old, especially if I was living in Leeds!

It’s very easy to get caught up in getting children into the “best” schools when actually you should be looking for the “right” schools. Focussing simply on these top academic schools hundreds of miles away, for which you would need scholarships / bursaries is a BIG ask. So many things would need to fall into place.

My daughters got into some of the top London schools but in the end we chose one that doesn’t even really feature in the league tables. It was just a much better fit. They have scholarships and are absolutely thriving.

11+ prep from a state school really doesn’t have to start until they are in Y4. In the meantime just read widely and check that maths is secure and comprehensive. Encouraging story telling and choose hobbies the child genuinely wants to do instead of ones that tick boxes. I do honestly believe that children end up where they are meant to be in the independent sector. SPGS is very good at seeing through tutoring and being able to identify genuinely bright girls, for example.

We lived in an area with both girls and boys grammar schools which selected from the 11+ also known as The Kent Test. However these schools are an anomaly with the majority abolished in the 1970s with the adoption of the comprehensive system- as such state primary school teach all children and do not coach for or in anyway prepare pupils for the exam. That is down to parents to organise - either themselves or with specialist tutors.

I'm mum to an 11 boy, at a "good" rated state primary. He has always been at the top of the year (full marks in maths yr 2 SATS, for example). We have supported him a lot at home in terms of theatre trips, museums etc. He's done lots of extra curric activities such as martial arts, street dance, etc. and is still an active member of the Scouts.

He can be quiet and reserved in new situations but warms up once he gets to know people. Luckily he makes friends easily.

We looked at our local comprehensive and two independent schools for year 7+. We all preferred the independents, and so we employed a tutor for an hour a week from the beginning of year 5. This covered all of the year 6 work and also VR and NVR, which isn't covered at all in state schools.

He got offered a place at both independents (did well in the academic assessments and also in the group tasks and one to one interviews) and is now excitedly looking forward to his new school in September.

I would let your daughter enjoy school. Her strengths and weaknesses will emerge over the next few years and that will help you find the right school for her - be it independent or state. I truly think 4 is way too early to start preparation for something happening 6 years down the line.

You need to realise that most schools will only offer a percentage of the fees as a bursary / scholarship. Let your daughter be a little girl for the moment and see how she develops.

Thank you so much for all the comments and suggestions. I really appreciate the time you all have taken to reply.

I think I may not have explained myself very well in my original post. I’m not looking to start any kind of structured preparation at this age, and I’m definitely not planning to hire a tutor now.

What I’m really trying to understand is how best to support my daughter so she can naturally develop the skills that would later help her access a high-quality education, if that continues to suit her. She is very curious, asks lots of “why” and “how” questions, enjoys reading, numbers, and has recently started piano. All of which she genuinely likes.

I also have two older children (18 and 13), both academic. My eldest is actually heading to a top university in the US on full merit-based funding, but she was very self-driven and I wasn’t particularly involved in shaping that journey. With my youngest, I’m noticing her interests earlier and wondering whether there are gentle ways I can support and stretch her potential without over-directing or “prepping”.

So I suppose my question is less about formal preparation, and more about:
what kinds of habits, environment, or experiences at this age make a difference later on; how to nurture curiosity and confidence in a way that keeps things enjoyable; Anything you found helpful (or wish you had done differently) in the early years.

I am very much pleased that many of you have suggested activities such as museum, trips, sports, music, chess that develop her curiosity. These align with what I have been thinking of too.

I’m finding the discussion really helpful. Thank you once again.

Thank you RatherBeOnVacation for your post. I was wondering why ‘living in Leeds‘ would not have crossed your mind?

The schools you mentioned don't have boarding so you'll need to live in London.

My question is: how feasible is it to prepare a child from a state primary for highly selective London girls’ schools at 11+ (especially with the aim of scholarship/bursary)?

Completely feasible. Home environment and regular study and practice are key.
My dh and I both did it. I got 90% he got 50%.
We intend to do similar with ours.
We will have 2-400k net or so saved in advance of oldest going in case of no scholarships and to ensure continuity of education. I strongly recommend this i saw first hand via friends how disrupted secondary can negatively impact children (going back into state is an adjustment) and wouldn't want it for mine.

1. Being well rounded.
2. We both believe its a waste of £180k net earnings per child.

3.set the standard at home. Exposure to the wider world . School was our job as children... school will also be "their job".

1. We will start around age 8/9 and go low and slow.

Separately... let's be real its unusual to say the least to be considering NLCG / SPGS / Habs / whatever at £30-40k pa in 8 yrs...
When

• you are an uncommutable distance
• with 2 older children in state
• a third child in a (northern ie cheap) prep your cant afford. As context Highgate, manor Lodge etc are all about 20-30k from 4+ once you.add in the extra bits...

Its unusual generally to live in Leeds / scotland/ wales/ cornwall and be looking at schools in london unless theres boarding facilities.

OP is a PhD student. Hopefully, they won't still be working on their PhD at Leeds in seven years time.

Why "hopefully", it may be lovely there? 😁
I just explained why it sounded strange (because it did to me, too).

If shes struggling to afford northern prep fees for 1 child... it would be a very specific set of circ that would mean her (and her husband?) have the ability to service the mortgage on a 1m+ home in london... plus uni x1 or 2for older kids plus the requisite 40k or so net for SPGS (which is prob what it'll cost in 8 yrs)

No shade on Leeds... but 8+ years working on a PhD is rarely a good sign. I assume that they view their current situation (as a student) as temporary rather than permanent.

Why do you assume they will be buying in London? There are people who rent, y'know.

SPGS offers generous bursaries.

@MTHRVRD2030 It was more that your daughter is 4 and you’re currently living in Leeds. Who knows how the next seven years will pan out for you - your life may take you elsewhere in the world, not just to London or even within the U.K.. It just seemed a little odd to be mulling over “top” schools hundreds of miles away such a long way in advance.

There are some amazing schools in the North too, both state and independent. Altrincham Grammar in Manchester is one of the top performing girls grammars in the U.K. The Perse in Cambridge and King Edward’s in Birmingham are top performing independents outside London.

All I would do is encourage a love of learning where children actively look for answers themselves and do independent learning outside the curriculum. Obviously parents facilitate this when children are younger. As they get older it is clear that those who are self motivated to learn do better. It sounds like you’re doing a great job already at this age.

First, they may expect a significant increase in income once they finish their PhD... I happen to believe that most students' incomes increase after they earn their degrees. You're free to disagree.

Second, their oldest is 18 so should be completely independent in seven years. The oldest is also "heading to a top university in the US on full merit-based funding". Their second is currently 13 so should be almost done with uni by then and OP may be hoping for a similar level of financial support.

Third, the average house price in London is about £675,000, the median is about £500,000, and there's no reason that OP might not be planning to live in a property cheaper than the median. Plenty of children at the top schools have long commutes from well outside Zones 1 & 2.

Fourth, there are no shortage of threads on mumsnet asking about bursaries and scholarships at top London schools. There's no reason OP shouldn't be thinking about this, especially if jobs in their field are concentrated around London. And, practically speaking, most bursaries at private schools go to children with well educated but not particularly well remunerated parents, such as academics or civil servants.

Honestly, why don't you look at Leeds Grammar or Withington Girls? They are not as strong as SPGS, but just one tier below. In fact, Ripon Grammar offers boarding.

If OP's eldest DC got a free ride from a US uni, they don't actually need a generic advice on how to develop a child 😁

Thank you @SalmonOnFinnCrisp

I completely understand your point, and you’re right that from the outside it can seem unrealistic to think about London schools when we’re currently in the North.
That said, our situation may change in the next couple of years. I’m in the final stage of my PhD and expect to finish within the next year. We are also considering a possible move to London, partly because my 13-year-old son is very keen on applying to King’s College London Mathematics School for sixth form. He is very passionate about maths and has been doing well in maths olympiads over the past few years, despite being in a state school.

The idea (still very much a plan at this stage) would be to move to London around that time, potentially renting there while letting out our house in Leeds.
I completely appreciate that a lot depends on finances and how things work out, so I’m trying to think ahead rather than assume anything. My main aim is simply to understand what is realistically possible and how best to support my younger daughter in the early years, without putting pressure on her.

Thanks again — I really value hearing different perspectives.

I have looked at GSAL - a nice school. The plan is move to London in the future after I finish my studies if my DS gets an offer from his target school.

My older DD has received an offer from a very good (Top 13) university in the US. She is very self-driven, but most of her academic development and extracurricular activities were shaped back in our home country. She only moved to the UK about a year ago and is currently in Year 13 in Leeds doing her A-levels.
Before that, she attended a British International School on a full scholarship from Year 1 to Year 11. So her journey has been quite different, and I haven’t had much experience navigating the UK system from the early years.
That’s really the reason behind my post. I’m trying to understand how things work here from the beginning, and to learn from those who have gone through the process. I’m especially interested in practical insights on how children are typically supported in the early years and what actually makes a difference later on.

"All I would do is encourage a love of learning where children actively look for answers themselves and do independent learning outside the curriculum."

Thank you for your perspective- and yes, I agree with you. Outside the curriculum learning would work wonders. But the question is how do you organize outside learning in the UK? Do you sign up for ay learning clubs other than sports and music/drama? For example, my 13 year old does extra math with https://virtual.aopsacademy.org/my-academy. This is an American math teaching program and I could not find something similar to this in the UK.

That's more clear now, thank you.

We did 4+ for super selective schools in London as 11+ for them is brutal so that would be my practical insight - prepare for a lot of stress.

Girls, especially those who come from single sex schools, are usually very confident (even if it's a quiet confidence) and often quite competitive. State school is not going to develop this so make sure your DD is doing some competitive sport outside of school (if you're American, that's a must anyway, I guess?)

Schools differ widely in their assessments and preferences so you would need to research each school at least a couple of years before entry (there are clashes between open days so one year wouldn't be enough but some schools don't register earlier for open days). The most popular schools will not necessarily be the best fit for your DC, for various reasons.

Re. extra curricular activities - there are lots once you're in London, House of Science, maths circles etc. Not sure about online schools but I would be vary of gluing a 4-5yo to a screen, they learn better in real life at this age.

DD went to SPGS from a state primary (very ordinary and not in the least pushy or high achieving). They actively discourage competitiveness between girls - the ethos is much more about doing your own best and focusing on your own development. She did no competitive sport outside school and that was minimal at best (tiny playground and not much space for that kind of thing). In fact she hates and is bad at most sports. She did play an instrument (not to a particularly high level) and that was good in that she was doing something that wasn't immediately easy to her and she had to work at it to progress.

We did no specific preparation until the spring of Y5 and that was mainly aimed at teaching her how to take an exam as she'd had little experience of this.

Before that, like your daughter, she was clever and curious. We didn't do anything to particularly foster this but we did obviously take her to theatres and museums and art galleries and stuff. She wasn't interested in chess so we didn't do that. I think in your shoes, just follow her lead and if she expresses interest in something help her find out more about it or do a club related it or whatever.

Just to add a bit of balance and similar to the poster above- both mine went to very academic London independents at 11plus having been to a state primary, as did lots of their friends. Did some tutoring from year 5 to get them used to exam techniques etc . They did a few after school activities, none of which they carried on at all. One did barely any sport, the other a bit more.
Certainly no hot housing, no chess etc. No particular pressure and both got into several schools as did pretty much all their friends. I really wouldn’t stress too much. There is a huge amount of hype around it all, much of it generated by Prep Schools and Tutors!