What are the main reasons for choosing a private school?

[beelegal]

My sister-in-law and I were chatting over tea this afternoon about private schools for my nephew, who’s coming up to secondary age.
She’s been to a few open days earlier this year and was particularly taken with one school nearby. However, during the headteacher’s speech, he said: “The teaching is the same in all schools — what we offer is more outside the classroom.”He then went on to highlight the school’s pastoral care, facilities, and wide range of sports and activities.

Perhaps we’re being a little naïve, but we’d always assumed the teaching itself would be better in a private school. For example, my daughter once had Maths taught by a PE teacher at her state school. We thought that in the independent sector you’d have subject specialists — a highly qualified Maths teacher for Maths, for instance.

We also imagined class sizes would be much smaller, with more opportunities for a child who isn’t particularly sporty but enjoys academic study. Yet the average class size was around 25, which isn’t especially small.

Pastoral care is so vague that schools all seem to determine themselves if theirs is good. All the private schools claim excellence.

So it does raise the question: if the teaching really is no different, why not choose a state school and simply join a local hockey or swimming club at the weekend — which would be far more affordable?

Given fees of around £25,000 a year, what are the real advantages of private education, and what justifies that cost?

Sorry not 93%. It reduces to only 82% by 16/18yrs old.

Approximately 18% of 16–19-year-olds in England attend private sixth-form education.

So bragging rights for sure, I do it all the time myself. But sadly to fewer people when the kids are older. Depressing or what.

Just the other day we were in Waitrose (obvs), and my DCs were in their PS uniforms / games kit and I felt so proud and boastful. Then I thought maybe we should go to Lidl so we could quietly boast a bit more.

In my experience, the kids that believe they are better than 93% of the population, get a rude awakening and it does them no favours in life. They are usually the ones that eventually fall flat on their face.

Also, the parents that like to boast about it, and believe their kids are getting a zillion times better education than everyone else, often feels years later that they've been scammed!

The kids that do the best from private, usually are humble, don't believe the private school hype and have decent involved parents that haven't assumed paying for private school will make them a glittering success and no need to put in the work.

No but it beats a PE teacher teaching physics!

Simple Google search: Yes you have to be qualified for state (academies can be different) and no for private (but this can be preferred).

You need Qualified Teacher Status (QTS) to teach in English state schools funded by local authorities, but it's not legally required in private schools or some other state schools like academies and free schools. However, many schools, including private schools, still prefer or require QTS for candidates to assess their quality.

For State Schools (Maintained Schools)
Mandatory QTS:
You must have QTS to teach in state-funded primary, secondary, and special schools in England.

Academy Schools and Free Schools:
These schools, which are also state-funded, can employ teachers without QTS, though many still prefer candidates to have it.

For Private Schools
No Legal Requirement:
Private (or independent) schools are not legally required to employ teachers with QTS.

Preferred by Schools:
Many private schools prefer to hire candidates with QTS to ensure they meet certain standards.

Alternative Qualifications:
Some private schools may hire individuals with extensive subject knowledge or postgraduate qualifications, like a PhD, even without QTS, especially if they have teaching experience.

DS1’s needs stopped being met in mainstream state provision, to the extent that they wouldn’t and couldn’t keep him safe. DS2 was apparently believed to be the ‘child from hell’ at the same village state school. We moved both of them to where their needs could be met, and that school happened to be a private one.

DS1 left school with two GCSEs and will never live fully independently, so we weren’t really there for the ‘contacts’. DS2 is in the sixth form at a school which meets his needs perfectly and again just happens to be private.

I think the pp was referring to subject specific qualifications

There isn’t a requirement to have this. Just a PGCSE

A relative with hers at state has mentioned her kids haven’t had a proper maths teacher in years ( senior school ) By proper I mean a person that’s actually done a degree in maths.

" The kids thank her at the end of every lesson (she's still getting used to that!). Politeness and good behaviour is simply expected"
I Lol'd at this. DDs tutor last year was an ex-state teacher in her first year working in independent sector. In our first parents evening she mentioned to me how blown away she was by the pupils thanking her and coming up to her to engage with her outside of the classroom.
I rang her in the last week of term to thank her for all the support she had given DD that year and she was initially a bit wary as in her previous school the only time she spoke to parents was to get shouted at!

I am NOT saying this is a blanket observation of all state schools Vs independent schools because they aren't each 1 homogenous group and that it's a purely anecdotal story.

I wouldn't necessarily choose private over state if I had my time again, but advantages of the private my DCs attended vs the state they attended:

• Discipline in class is often better, esp if DC would be in lower sets in state school, so more of class time is spent focused on learning
• At my DC's private school, there was really good discussion every half term on personal targets for the next half, which was v motivating. While state schools say they do similar, they don't have the resources to do this in the same tailored, individual way IME. Really built growth mindset and self belief.
• Unsporty DCs are forced to find a sport or physical activity that they are prepared to do regularly. At state school unsporty kids can pretty much opt out by KS4.
• The school tries really hard to find and encourage what they see as your talents, but at the end of the day DCs motivation or lack thereof is the main driver.

We didn't find teaching better, but the local private has poached a lot of the maths teachers from local state schools, so I guess there's a better chance that shortage subjects will be adequately covered. But it's always luck of the draw which teacher you get - some good, some bad, some sick and covered by supply.
As you say, sporty kids can be super sporty at a state school by going to outside-school clubs, and can pick the best coaches, rather than be stuck with the coaches that a private school can offer, so no reason for sporty kids to choose private if parents have the time to be a taxi.

On the negative side, in private school you mix with so many people who don't understand their privilege, and that can be rather exhausting.
And if you would be average academically at a state school and end up at a selective private where you're bottom of the pile, that can be bad for self esteem.

That's for LA maintained schools.

State academies still have the freedom and are not legally required to employ teachers with Qualified Teacher Status (QTS), as they are given more freedom to hire professionals with strong subject expertise regardless of formal qualifications to fill subject shortages or attract specialist talent.

This is from Gov.uk:

Schools where is a legal requirement:
Maintained schools are part of the state-funded school system in England – funding and oversight are generally provided by the local authority.They include:

• You must also have to teach in a non-maintained special school.

Schools where is not a legal requirementIn some schools in England, is not a legal requirement. For example:within the English state school sector, academy schools and free schools can employ teachers without QTS

83% of state secondary schools ars academies so in majority of secondary schools, you don't have to be a qualified teacher!

Hope that clears it up for you!

Twisty this reminds me of a girl in my son’s class who moved schools from Private to state as her father had retired and they moved house.
His daughter commented that after she’d been off sick none of the teachers asked her how she was when she got back to school ( she had been seriously ill ). This would have been normal before as everyone knew everyone. She struggled a lot with the behaviour at her new school .

It’s a very different environment

Regarding a previous comment my kids weren’t aware the school they went to was any different from others in terms of paying/non paying. It’s not something we felt the need to push as why would that come up in conversation. It’s just the schools we chose. ( of course they realised a difference as they got older )

I didn’t need the clarification as I said Academies can be different and cited that in the search.

So not sure the point of your post.

And, if the private school is heavily selective, then you want teachers who can extend their A-star hunting class’ knowledge beyond the curriculum. Which in turn means that they probably need at least a relevant degree. And it’s a different skill set to being a great teacher to a wide range of abilities. I know in my heavily selective private school we ran rings round the poor chap who was teaching A-level physics but couldn’t reliably integrate but adored his replacement who’d come from an Oxford physics research group.

I believe there are good teachers across state and private settings, the key difference is subject variety and probably most importantly small class sizes. It’s the latter that sees large proportion of student population receiving above average grades. If a secondary school I’d be looking at percentage of kids getting top grades and the destination university/offers, the school should have this list to hand (if not on its website).

My point that you are trying to undermine, is that majority of state schools don't have to employ qualified teachers.

Just saying "independent schools don't have to employ qualified teachers" = suggesting that the teachers are less than, is irrelevant when most state schools don't either.

The difference is that most independent schools do employ qualified teachers because parents demand it, same as the subject specialism aspect.

The last two paragraphs I’d say are @twistyizzy s point I guess.

I had no idea so many were now academies

Yes around 43% at primary and 80%+ at secondary

Agree
and it’s what we look at when checking out schools as the list of teachers and their full qualifications is freely available
Even the Unis they went to

I have moved my child from a state primary to private for year 5. It is still very early but in terms of comparison.

specialist teaching: this is the big one so far. My daughter is really enjoying having a variety of teachers who really know their subject versus one teacher in primary. This has been most obvious for MFL so far. Massive difference between a non fluent speaker printing off a twinkle sheet and having proper conversations in French.

Behaviour and expectations: this was the primary factor for our move. She was doing very little as behaviour was poor. She has found the teachers can be more chilled out and friendly because they’re not firefighting discipline. Good behaviour is just a given and the environment is calmer. Even if the teacher are the same standard, it’s going to be much easier to teach in a class without disruption than one where you’re being told to fuck off by 8 year olds.

Class size: bigger than I was expecting in the older years but smaller than state. We’re at 24 versus the 30-32 we’d preciously experienced. This wasn’t the primary factor but I’d want smaller for infants.

Sport: more timetabled sport and opportunities tailored to girls. My primary was actually pretty good at sport although more so for boys.the boys were getting lots of fixtures for football and cricket but far fewer opportunities for girls and I could see a drop off engagement with school sport as my daughter didn’t like lessons with the boys . My daughter will be doing much more within school.

Music: went from no music culture- no choir, orchestra etc to incredibly high standard and wide provision. The gap here is enormous.

Other activities: again night and day. There is so much to choose from with a diverse set of things. A lot more focus on creative arts.

Yes our school has a little biog about each teacher when you accept a place. The biog has: university attended, level of degree, teaching status, total length of time teaching Inc at the school plus interests/hobbies

Interesting. Ours didn’t state interests and hobbies but it’s those that often determine extra curricular activities.
which brings me back to our head doing dog training classes during Covid 😁

Yeh they tend to run the clubs they have an interest in.
Dogs seem to be a feature of many independent schools. DDs HSM has spaniels and she lives at school they obviously live there with her. So every morning plus breaks/housetime the girls in her house get spaniel kisses. I think dog training classes are an eminently sensible practical lockdown activity!

Dd had to fill that one in after she signed her contract.

Certainly looks good to have a STEM teacher with a First in her subject, and sponsor's prize for final year.

No experience outside of PGCE though, and who the heck has time for hobbies when you are pushing your own limits for a first... so those got "exaggerated".
Would take the mini bios with a pinch of salt.

Yep
dogs in class and boarding houses was a feature at our boys schools too
They all found it homely and relaxing
even my eldest who had a phobia in his early years

They can't lie about their quals though can they?
Because those can be checked

There are no academically selective grammar schools in our area. so if you want to get a bright hard working child into an academically selective school you have no choice but to go private if you can afford to.