To think a lot of people who agree with VAT on school fees…

[geeenuoe]

Actually don’t truly understand that to most sending their kids to these schools, it is a massive, massive struggle already.

There seems to be a mentality that if you can afford 20k a year then you’re already comfortable so sod it, you should find more cash now for vat … but do people in general not understand that some families re mortgage their homes to pay these fees? Yes there’s mega wealthy people but there’s many, many more who are not.

On the one hand we hear a good education is a luxury so VAT must be applied, then on the other we are told a good education is a right for all. So… why are we taking away that good education from those who already have it? Why is the focus not on sorting out the state sector properly? We all know the vat won’t fix the state sector. It may help in a tiny way in ad hoc circumstances but there’s so so so much more that needs to be done to state schools to make them ever match what the private sector offers.

I simply don’t get this mentality that those making sacrifices must make more when it comes to bloody education. I say this as someone who can’t afford the fees but if I could I absolutely would… and I also acknowledge that I am unwilling to go to some lengths that others will to pay it. I respect the choice of others to make such sacrifices and have no desire to make it harder and more inaccessible for the masses to access it. Similarly, I know plenty of people driving fancy cars and spending loads on holidays… they’ve chosen that over school fees. And those who have spend loads getting into a postcode of a decent state school… should they be paying enhanced tax on their house purchase?

Why do most people think those who pay schools fees are doing so with great ease? Is it basically because they don’t personally know people paying this so accept the media narrative that it’s the mega rich only?

What exactly do you think you are buying into for the ‘education’ you’ve admitted you’re keen for your child to receive? You’re buying into a social milieu of connected, well behaved kids, whose families support the learning environment their children and other children are in. So it’s just the same.

The private sector has contracted for all sorts of reasons from the 2008 credit crunch and onwards to the cost of living crisis and inflation with wage stagnation (an unusual combination). I don’t remember this level of whining when these things happened. And yes whole schools closed. My city lost 2 independents in the 2010s. Luckily a demographic blip is just working its way out at the secondary level, so the state has capacity.

And yes, some of us have had to have Sen kids in state schools.

Good point!

VAT has nothing to do with luxury. I really don’t know where this misnomer comes from.

I bet many private schools could easily absorb the VAT themselves but they will choose not to.

I'm a moderate socialist who works in a public service where the leadership and decision making is done by people who had nothing riding on how well it works.

Take my (former) MP Philip Davies, who spent a whole career hating on the NHS and public sector workers, jumps the queue for a heart bypass (on the NHS) then raves about hkw good it is.

Frankly he deserved to die in a bed waiting for 3 weeks for an emergency bypass like my dad did.

University is a luxury good and gives advantage. It's not for all children. You know the rules. VAT on private bodies like universities are covered by the current draft legislation.

Sorry forgot to add the big fear for private school parents who can afford the VAT increase, if too many others can’t, the school might close.

It must be scary hearing other parents talk about not being able to afford the fees because if they all pull their dcs out of your dcs school, then your school might close.

Particularly if they do an exemption for military or SEND kids. No point having an exemption if your school has to close anyway.

Actually, to some extent, it is waived on essentials. There's no VAT on children's clothes and no VAT on tampons for that reason.

Oh my god, please tell me your parents didn't waste money on your education with the intelligence you're displaying.

Paying VAT on an item is NOTHING to do with how "good" the item is, it is to do with the monetary value of an item that is not deemed a necessity. Private education is not deemed a necessity, due to the availability of public schools, therefore you pay VAT on it. It's as simple as that. The re-establishment of VAT on private education is not a punishment on pupils of private of schools, its simply a tax that should have been getting paid all along in order to, you know, fund public education etc.

"Re-establishment of VAT" 🤣

If I had my time again I would have sent mine to private, the state of secondary schools is a joke.
good luck to those that can afford it, why not, it’s wrong that they are saving the government money by taking child out of their system to then have to more on top of the fees.

How? 70% of costs are salaries.

Redundancies or removal of bursaries are the obvious cost savings. I’m not sure either are desirable.

Our school is capping VAT at 12% primarily by massively reducing bursaries open to new entrants. That means that in future lower earning families will be excluded.

Hardly the sort of outcome Labour tried to hoodwink people into believing.

Haven't private school fees already increased around 20% in the past few years? I didn't see any long threads about it then.
If you haven't factored in an increase in fees (whether government levied or by the school) then you probably couldn't afford it in the first place.

Apparently we pay VAT on tampons. But when someone suggests we tax an actual luxury item all the pearl clutchers get worried they won't be able to buy 2 new Boden dresses this month

Sorry that was a bit goady. We probably fit into the same income bracket as you OP. We choose to send our DC to a lovely local school and enjoy fab holidays/life experiences instead. I guess that makes us terrible selfish parents does it?

Out of interest what would you consider wealthy vs squeezed middle?

The education is a right, really applies to developing and dictatorship countries where children, especially girls, are denied it. That's what the campaign is for. In a developed country, your child is not denied an education at all, you're choosing to pay for a specific education, so you can't moan to everyone about it.

By all means, moan to other parents at the school you're in, but it's in poor taste doing it to everyone, with the COL crisis and using the "education is a right" to try and justify your choice of private education not being subject to tax rises.

"Scary"? Scary that your children may have to attend a state school along with the 93%.

The biggest shame is that the standard of state schools will not increase. Mainly because of the poor standard of parenting.

Except the chances of it raising any money at all are looking slimmer by the day.

You do realise the Treasury will be writing some whopping big cheques to Eton and other big public schools in the Spring when they submit their input VAT invoices for all the building works from the last x years?

You also realise that a lot of small indies are on a knife-edge. If they become unviable that is a whole school worth of kids suddenly needing state places, and a whole load of teachers, suppliers, caretakers and others, whose businesses rely on said school, left with no jobs.

And all for what - red meat to the uber lefties in Labour and to allegedly fund the mythical 1/3 of a teacher per school. Slow hand clap... only people benefiting are going to be a lot of lawyers. What a great use of taxpayers money.

Frankly he deserved to die in a bed waiting for 3 weeks for an emergency bypass like my dad did.

'Moderate socialist'

My children are at private school (one is deaf and massively benefits from the small class sizes and less disruption) I absolutely get that we are the privileged minority and therefore we pay more tax, that is fair. The issue I have with this is that it will reduce bursaries and community initiatives like the use of the facilities for local State schools (the school
are having to use those funds to mitigate the VAT increase to try to stop families leaving and keep the school running) With the expectation that a lot of families will have to leave the private sector, some state schools will have even greater capacity issues and the gain of the VAT funds won't amount to anything. It will just cause distress to kids that are already settled (especially those with SEN) with no real gain. If I thought there would be a real benefit I wouldn't have such a problem with this policy.

Re-establishment of VAT
🤣

Why are you expecting random strangers to care so much about your child's education?
Some of us are too busy trying to get through to the next pay day. Or indeed save for a holiday. We understand perfectly that the cost increase is going to be hard for you. We just really, really don't care. Bigger fish and all that.

Military families usually need boarding provision and there are some but not many state boarding schools. The state pays a large proportion of the fees paid by the military but the VAT top up will fall on the soldier's share of the fee. Under the current draft legislation.