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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Original poster

Do primary schools seriously object to you taking your dc's out during termtime?

53 replies

strandedatsea · 15/04/2010 16:27

Dd1 is due to start in reception this Sept (although we are overseas at the moment and probably for another year, so this will only really become an issue in 2011). Dd2 will start school in 2012.

How much do schools in the UK really object to you taking them out during term-time - and does this get worse the higher up the school they get? I presume it's different from school to school so would be grateful to hear your experiences.

Just wondering whether we need to get all our "cheap" holidays in within the next year!

Thanks.

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SoupDragon · 15/04/2010 16:34

Yes they do object and yes, you need to get all your cheap Homs out of the way now.

our school used to be fairly easy going but have tightened up on this considerably over the lasT few years.

DecorHate · 15/04/2010 16:35

A lot of schools are taking a stronger stance now - used to be that most would allow up to 2 weeks but I have heard of many applications being refused recently. Obv you can still take your dc out if school but it will be recorded as unauthorised.

Tbh I am not really sure why schools are doing this - would have thought unauthorised absenses look worse...

I am not really in favour of taking kids out if school anyway, would only do it myself for a family event sort of thing rather than to have a cheaper holiday.

Earthstar · 15/04/2010 16:36

Schools don't normally authorise absence for term term holidays anymore - even for reception age

mrz · 15/04/2010 16:37

Schools are under a great deal of pressure to ensure are actually in school learning.
Now they are given attendance targets and while individual schools may understand that parents want to take advantage of cheap holiday offers they have to answer to LAs and the government if targets aren't met.
In our recent Ofsted I had to answer questions about what we were doing to make sure children attend and what sanctions we use.

Kewcumber · 15/04/2010 16:42

and many places now impose fines per day for unauthorised absence. Makes the holiday not quite so cheap!

Original poster

strandedatsea · 15/04/2010 16:42

Oh blimey thanks that all sounds very serious. My two are currently at a private pre-school and when I asked them about their policy on taking dd1 out when she starts in reception (same school), they looked at me blankly and thought I was asking about a discount in fees for the time they would not be there!

I am suprised about this as I can't personally see you are going to massively damage your child's education by taking them away for a week during term time in reception/year one etc. And it really makes a HUGE difference in prices when you go away. I am sure you all know this already, I have just been sticking my head in the sand for too long....

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BendyBob · 15/04/2010 16:44

Ours have always been ok with it on the few occasions we've asked for it. It's never been for long or very often though.

I think they take into account good attendance and attitude towards school in general. It's a two way street. They are reasonable if you are.

Original poster

strandedatsea · 15/04/2010 16:51

Thanks Bendybob - that gives me a bit more hope. Mind you I am assuming that a lot of parents continue to flout these rules. I live on a "holiday island" and see plenty of children here during term time....

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prh47bridge · 15/04/2010 17:13

Schools can allow up to 10 days authorised absence in a school year provided you apply in advance of the holiday and there are special reasons for the holiday. They have to judge each request on its own and can take into account the time of year, overall attendance, holidays already taken and a few other factors. They are not allowed to take the availability of cheap holidays or the availability of your preferred holiday into account.

Schools are under pressure to cut down on absence, both authorised and unauthorised. Whilst you might think that unauthorised absence looks worse, it helps the school because it is the parents who are at fault and it can lead to sanctions against the parents if the child has a lot of unauthorised absence.

MumInBeds · 15/04/2010 17:16

At my DC's schools they each allow 10 days total over the child's time there (so 10 days over 3 years in infants and then 10 days over 4 years in juniors) and absolutely no more.

Original poster

strandedatsea · 15/04/2010 17:36

Just out of interest (if anyone knows) what if you Home Educate? Does anyone keep an eye on how many holidays you take?

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mazzystartled · 15/04/2010 17:42

some schools mind more than others

i think there is a rule about up to 10 days at the discretion of the head.

at our school number of sick days etc would be taken into account when head made that decision.

i'd be very surprised if schools "fines" for unauthorised absence were in any way enforceable.

PixieOnaLeaf · 15/04/2010 18:36

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piscesmoon · 15/04/2010 18:47

Our LEA has told schools that all holidays in term time are unauthorised absences. Some schools fine the parents. It is very unfair-those who need the cheap prices can't afford the fine and those who have the money still find it cheaper to pay the fine and go.

BirdyArms · 15/04/2010 18:47

It does vary a lot from school to school. My dc's almost never authorises absences, they definitely don't seem to take attendance into account.

We recently took ds1, who is in reception, out for a week. We were sent a letter saying that we would be referred to the local authority and would either receive a fine or be taken to court. In fact nothing has happened, I suspect because he was only 4 and therefore not legally required to be at school at all. He won an attendance prize the previous term.

PixieOnaLeaf · 15/04/2010 18:51

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DilysPrice · 15/04/2010 18:52

Our school is under huge pressure to cut absences otherwise OFSTED will downgrade them. They have announced that no absences will be permitted for any reason other than sickness or medical appointments. I took the kids out for one day for a family wedding, and it will be on their record for the rest of their time there - see if I care.

Original poster

strandedatsea · 15/04/2010 18:55

Pixie - I have to disagree on the impact of taking a child out of school for a week. I agree taking them out all the time might impact negatively, but I really don't think a week or two away once a year will harm a child's ability to make or keep friends. If it did, what about the summer holidays?

Where we are, people are forever taking their children in and out of school for trips or for whatever reason and they all seem to fit back in happily with their friends when they are back.

We are taking dd's to Florida for two weeks in about 10 days time and I don't think dd1 (4 and a half) will have any problems re-adjusting when we get back. But maybe I just have quite an adaptable child as we have travelled a lot with her!

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Original poster

strandedatsea · 15/04/2010 18:58

Birdy/Dilys - it all seems to have gone a bit far. If only flight prices/holidays etc weren't so astonomically inflated during school hols this probably wouldn't be a problem.

Dilys - I can't believe they weren't even allowed one day off for a wedding! I'm starting to think twice about going back to the UK at all.....

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PixieOnaLeaf · 15/04/2010 19:01

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DilysPrice · 15/04/2010 19:04

No authorised absences, no exceptions. I wrote a letter, as instructed (though I'm not really sure why), saying May I have permission? the head didn't answer, I took them anyway.

They're probably going to be downgraded from Outstanding to Good purely because they won't meet their attendance target, so I see their point, but I wasn't prepared to miss the wedding, or to make up a convenient illness (sets an appalling example to the kids).

Original poster

strandedatsea · 15/04/2010 19:09

Pixie - I would ask for your evidence on this but recently read a thread where someone complained about how much they hated being asked for "evidence" all the time so I think we'll just have to disagree on this .

I see plenty of children taken out for quite long absences and their friends accept them back very happily when the return. Most children start playing with total strangers within about three minutes of meeting them so I doubt they would shun a friend they hadn't seen for a while.

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PixieOnaLeaf · 15/04/2010 19:20

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mrz · 15/04/2010 19:23

My school usually authorises 10 days holiday per year (not during SAT week if in Y6).
As a teacher I have never known a child excluded by the rest of the class because they have been on holiday usually they are very happy to see their friend return.

The law says that parents do not have the right to take their child out of school for holidays during term-time and that only in exceptional circumstances can schools allow parents to take their child out of class for up to ten days in a school year.

news.bbc.co.uk/1/hi/education/8496345.stm

Gigantaur · 15/04/2010 19:27

of course they would object.

Itis a legal requirement for you to send your child to school unless ill.

its a bit like saying 2 do the police really dislike you not using a car seat for your 2 year old"

why do some parents find it so difficult to accept rules are designed for everyone and not just everyone else but them?

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