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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Original poster

Told off because he couldn't do something

59 replies

OrmIrian · 12/10/2009 20:19

DS#2 told me tonight that he was told off because he couldn't do him sums or use the number square. Now I know he can use it more or less as we used on for hw recently. But apparently he couldn't in school. So he was told off. And made to sit in the cloakroom to do his work - even after the others had gone out to play

Problem is DS#2 is a stubborn little chap and he won't ever cry if he gets told off. He doesn't seem to know when to back down. His teacher is extremely strict - every child in the school knows Mrs C by reputation and she is not well-liked. To say the least.

He cries when he goes into school. Most days. He pretends he's ill.

Is it right to tell a child off for not being able to do something?

It's parents evening next week. What, if anything, can we say to her. Short of 'you evil witch, stop terrorising our son' ?

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Original poster

OrmIrian · 13/10/2009 09:48

bucharest - sorry, to answer your question, if the head doesn't now he must have his eyes and ears shut Everyone else knows including my older 2 DC who were never even in her class.

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Jux · 13/10/2009 09:56

You say he CAN do it though. So she was telling him off because he wasn't doing it, wouldn't do it or whatever. Not because he can't, because he can.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 13/10/2009 10:13

jux - he could do it with help (as I said, 'more or less'). I don't know how much help he was getting at school, and how much we are supposed to give him at home.

And regardless, I have concerns about how they are getting on together. And that he is scared of her.

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Original poster

OrmIrian · 13/10/2009 12:09

I spoke to his teacher this morning. We didn't have much time this morning so couldn't mention the subject of this thread, but DS seemed not to have any hw. Teacher said 'oh dear, yes he should have had some, I expect he lost it again'. Well yes probably he did but yet again the tone was so negative. And as far as I know he hasn't lost any hw before. I could feel him shrinking away behind me as we spoke

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FlightAttendant · 13/10/2009 12:47

She sounds like a complete cow

Get angry, Orm. Go in there (when you go) and demand she be nicer to your son...how dare she treat him like that?

Goodness knows what she is like when there are no parents around.

bigTillyMint · 13/10/2009 16:37

It sounds like she has classified him as an annoying child who doesn't concentrate / listen / do what he's asked.

If there is some truth in that, he needs support to focus better, etc.

Could you go in and say that you realise she is having problems with getting him to do the above, and that you would like to work with the school to help him. And that he is getting more and more anxious about this which is making it worse?

purpleduck · 13/10/2009 17:00

I would just say matter of fact - "ds mentioned that last week he got told off, and told to do his work in the cloakroom.......?"

I was nervous about telling dc's teachers a few things and in both cases just saying what I wanted to say in a matter of fact emotionless way worked.

Good luck - your poor little guy

Elibean · 13/10/2009 19:10

Its so wrong to tell a child off for not knowing or being able to do something

Not very experienced as dd's teachers, so far, are lovely and not very strict (she's only Y1, so there's time!) but I would think its important to tell the teacher, somehow, how awful ds is feeling about going to school daily. Along the lines of him needing support/encouragement, and asking for her help and advice...?

Original poster

OrmIrian · 13/10/2009 21:11

TILLY - there is more than a little truth in it. But surely her job is not to dismiss the awkward ones? But I guess it will have to come from us

We'd done so well so far too. Never a problem with a teacher till now.

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kreecherlivesupstairs · 14/10/2009 07:34

Could he move to a different class if he is that unhappy. I know my dd's school wouldn't do it, but it could be a possibility for you.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 14/10/2009 10:51

Maybe kreecher. But there have been 'developments'. I have heard it from the horse's mouth (well the mum of DS's best friend in class) that DS refused to do the work. Simply said 'no'! In which case I don't blame the teacher for her actions - god knows he drives DH and I to distraction. But what does bother me is that that kind of stubborness has hitherto been confined to home - and downright defiance is usually a reaction to being very unhappy about something

So... approach is going to be 'help! How can we help you to help him' I think.

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ScummyMummy · 14/10/2009 11:21

My goodness, he's an amazingly brave kid, isn't he, Orm? The teacher sounds terrifying yet he's refusing her requests outright?! There's something to be admired there, I reckon, even though the situation is one that needs rectifying. I remember reading somewhere thast Clement Freud (I think) once said that he was always stunned at the sheer courage of little kids, no matter how unreasonable they were being, defying people 4 times their size with near complete power over them. I always liked that thought.

It does strike me (as someone with a rather laissez faire let the children play type approach to early education, admittedly) that all this homework and number square stuff is pretty full on for a 6 y.o. Maybe he's feeling the pressure a bit as he adjusts into the new school year.

Original poster

OrmIrian · 14/10/2009 11:27

Brave, oh yes! He carries on saying no even in the face of sanctions. I had to tear up his tick chart last week as he kept refusing to go bed. He had earned about 15 ticks for going to bed without a fuss (mind you that took about 3 weeks ). Then he burst into tears but he just can't give in. I am sure that Freud would have many things to say about DS

If anyone out there can tell me how to cope with a child with the will of a granite block and the same flexibility I'd be glad to hear from them.

He is exhausting.

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Original poster

OrmIrian · 14/10/2009 11:27

BTW I agree about hw but I don't think that is the issue here.

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FlightAttendant · 14/10/2009 11:31

I think I'd have cried if I lost 15 ticks! Did it take him a lot of effort to earn them?

Original poster

OrmIrian · 14/10/2009 11:40

Beleive me flight it took huge amount of effort. But it was just as heart-breaking for me, as getting DS#2 to bed before 8.30 is incredibly hard work. Basically all my effort is geared to him from the moment he finishes his meal to the moment he is tucked up, clean and warm in bed. And we have to follow a strict routine - bath, milk and biscuit in bed with story, read to him, clean teath, cuddle. And every step has to be negotiated - how many pages/stories, how many biscuits, and then constantly getting him back into bed when he nips out for a teddy or a wee and then gets distracted. We have already stopped putting him into bed in his own room as he shares that with his big brother and he will stay awake in expectation of DS#2 coming up and doing something interesting.

I have lost it and simply howled at him before now but that doesn't work. Picking him up and putting him in bed doesn't work as he gets out again. He has to be ready for bed and if he isn't you simply can't win. I have seriously thought of putting a lock on the bedroom door but that would only mean he was in bed, not asleep.

Much hair has been torn out over DS#2.

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bigTillyMint · 14/10/2009 11:40

And I thought my DS was stubborn.....

How does ignoring work with him? I mean asking him to do something and then giving him time to come round himself to doing it?

Or using humour to turn it round

Original poster

OrmIrian · 14/10/2009 11:45

Ignoring? Well that depends. On how long you can bear to wait! Most of the major problems are when it's time crucial - bedtime or school mornings when we don't have time to play with. Otherwise we do let things go mostly. We have to for our sanity.

If we say no to something he will then keep asking and asking and asking and asking. Until someone shouts at him at which he will stop for 2 mins and then start again. You can put him on the naughty step or out of the room but it will start again when he comes back. Distraction can work as can humour but not always.

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FlightAttendant · 14/10/2009 11:46

I wonder what would happen if you stopped. I mean if you stopped arguing every point with him, and let him do as he pleased.. not being funny, but I am genuinely wondering if it might help somehow.

After all if this way isn't working for you both...might be worth a try? Or would he do something terrible?

FlightAttendant · 14/10/2009 11:48

What I mean is it sounds as though every minute is a fight. Perhaps another tack would work better?

bigTillyMint · 14/10/2009 11:54

OI, DS is like this at times. It has got a bit better now he is older. Do they genuinely think you are going to change your mind just because they go on and on and on at you?! (DH and I are just as stubborn as him - we will never be defeated!!!)

We never succeeded with a naughty step, but Time Out in his bedroom generally works if you have already nipped it in the bud!

FA, we don't argue every point, but as OI says, it usually comes to a head when you are pushed for time, etc.

Hando · 14/10/2009 12:05

Not sure about the school issues, but I certainly wouldn't use his bedroom as a time out area if he has issues going to bed. It will make ther bedroom sppear in his mind as a place to go when your naughty, and I fear it may worsen your bedtime difficulties.

Use somewhere else.

FlightAttendant · 14/10/2009 12:11

'Do they genuinely think you are going to change your mind just because they go on and on and on at you?! (DH and I are just as stubborn as him - we will never be defeated!!!)'

See, I read this and thought 'Ah!'

Can you see where I am going with this?

bigTillyMint · 14/10/2009 12:37

Certainly can!

He takes after his father, of course!

Original poster

OrmIrian · 14/10/2009 12:49

Sadly DH and I are not at all stubborn. We've had to learn to be since DS#2 came along. It's horrible. My older 2 are by and large amenable and easy-going - they dislike a fight as much as we do, so being relaxed about things has worked. It's taken a lot of hard work to get as bloody-minded as I now am with DS#2 .

hando - we don't put him in his bedroom as such. Just away from where we are. So, in theory, he can't keep up the argument Perhaps we should shut him in the garden so he can join the cat in her silent miaow

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