Help!! I truly believe my just turned 4 yo boy is NOT ready for school in sept...... what do I do??

[jemimap]

My just turned 4yo is due to go into reception (in a private school) in sept.. I've always had concerns over his 'readiness' both emotionally and socially, to begin fulltime in sept but having thought long and hard about it over the past month I feel determined that it would be the wrong thing for him at this stage.. I just dont know how best to tackle this. My ideal would be that he attends mornings only in reception, probably for the whole academic year as I dont see any reason to push him into full days until next sept (when he will just have turned 5)

I've spoken to the head who has extremely reluctantly agreed to let him start with mornings only but only until oct halfterm then he must go fulltime. I dont know with it being an independant school whether to just stand my ground and basically say its 'mornings all year or nothing' kind of approach (I have 2 younger children too so the school would be losing the fees of 3 pupils if they say no)

Or should I just keep him at his (fabulous) preschool 5 mornings a week for the next year and start him in year 1 in sept 2009??

any opinions greatly appreciated..

Why don't you go ahead but just, er, find him to be too "ill" to attend on lots of days?

I think send him to the fabulous pre school and reception next year. My ds1 was five when he started primary he was definately not ready the year before. It has been brilliant for him.

So, in private/independent schools it would actually be possible to start a child a year later without depriving them from the experience of reception....I never knew that, you know....

It is so stupid though that age is the main factor, isn't it....I mean, my friends little girl is starting this year in reception, too, and she only missed last years entry by 1 day, as her Birthday is 1. of september, and in a way she was ready starting school last year....hmph....

I think it's up in scotland that they have a later starting age....something with the year they turn 5 or somehting like that.....
Surely even just putting the date a bit back, say, they have to be 4 by april to start in teh summer would work a bit better...or is my logic out on this?

I agree with Juule (as usual)

Do mornings only until October half term.

And then, see how it goes. He might be ready and raring to do lunch in the big hall by then. Or he might be very ready to be taken home at 1230. He might be ready to go to school all day but regularly need Tuesdays and Thursday off. Or Wednesdays off.

As you are paying the fees, and presumably you're not getting a part-time discount, then the attendance of your child shouldn't be a factor at all. The school is providing a service. You are availing yourselves of the bit of the service which suits your child. It's hardly as if there's a curriculum the school is trying to deliver (oh, wait, EYFS does start in the Autumn...)

Otherwise, sod it, stay in the pre-school setting for another year and send him through the whole thing a year younger than you would otherwise. Why the hell not? He'll be, what, 2 weeks older than the oldest children in his class? Would a private school really refuse that if you were going to pay your ££ like anyone else?

Yes private schools would indeed refuse to defer a year - they are subject to the law just like any other schools. The OP needs to remember that this child will always be the youngest in his year - leaving him out of school for the reception year will not only be illegal but will leave him IMO extremely disadvantaged bith educationally and socially - he will have to break into established friendship groups.

Will the pre school actually be able to keep a 4 year old (school age)in? Will the pre school really cover the same ground that he would be doing in school (especially private). At the end of Reception in the private prep school the children will be able to read to a certain standard, write a few basic words, do some simple sums and counting etc. Will the pre school cover all the same ground?

Will he be any more able to cope with a large lunch room in a year's time if he hasn't been exposed to that at pre school?

The offer of half days is quite common and is the best way forward. After a few years the repercussions of being one of the youngest fall away untilk there really is no difference.

Haven't read the whole thred but my DS2 was 4 last week and starts reception in Sept at a private school. He can't wait to go as DS1 is already there. I was a bit concerned that he would get left behind because he was so young. Another little girl who has an April birthday is going there and she was able to write her name and knew her letters well before him. However he is now really showing an interest and coming on in leaps and bounds. I did mention it to the teacher that I wasa bit concerned due to his age but she said it was something they were aware of an would give him some extra attention. It would be a real mistake for him to go half days if everyone else is there all day. It will make him 'different' and he may find it difficult to fit in. Reception is all about play through learning (but it's fun) and if you take him out at lunch time he will miss out on such a lot. You are much better at letting him go and see how it goes. Private schools are much more geared to individual attention as the classes tend to be smaller.

My DS1 is a June baby, he is highly sensitive, the world is a huge and scary place to him and I crapped myself at him starting school.

He was still having an afternoon sleep pretty much every day after spending a morning at preschool.

He started reception last september and I was the only parent who had to escort their child into the class room.

The teachers are trained to deal with all types of children.

My advice would be to send your son in on the part-time basis and reassess, do not try to guess how he will cope.

My own son has sailed through reception and more than kept up. I would have predicted that he would drag behind.

He still has a sleep every weekend to catch up on his sleep despite sleeping 11 - 12 hours a night

I would let him start full time and see how it goes. If you start him part time that will make him different from his peers and he will miss out on what are probably more relaxed afternoons where they do fun things. If he seems tired give him the odd day off to recover.

The dcs are in private schools in London and it is not uncommon for Aug/Sept birthdays to be in the "wrong" academic year, though it does mean that the children have to remain in the private sector or otherwise they have to cope with a jump in classes goign to senior school.

willali, mildmannered already corrected what I would have corrected otherwise....also, if someone wanted too, they could even Homeschool their children in this country...(I was shocked to find out that Homeschooling is actually illegal in Germany, my country of origine...although, to me, personally it would not be something I would want to do. I just think it should be a parents choice, as indeed over here it is.)

However from personal experience, I know that being a younger child can be a disadvantage....a lot can happen in a year, especially in that young agegroup a year can mean a lot. My es struggled for most of his Primary years and has only started catching up now in Secondary school. It was a slow process and took a lot of extra work....whilst I have no proof that it would have really made any difference whatsoever, if he had been able to start in Reception a year later, part of me does believe it would have made his Primary years easier.

Thanks for all opinions.. been out all day..

Very interesting about possibly starting into reception the year after - I hadnt even thought to ask that. It certainky seems that it would be legal to defer a year as his birthday is 3rd august so doesnt have to be in school until september 09. But, as it has been pointed out, it would mean he would have to stay in private education (which we plan to do at present) to remain in the correct year group..

On and upward.. - that is how I felt the private school should react.. ie. we have to pay full fees therefore the 'choice' should be ours as to which bits he attends given the fact that he doesnt actually need to be at school at all this year.. My husband questions the private school ethos as do they not retain 'charitable status' for tax relief and so must provide a 'service' similar to state schools, rather than just being a profiteering venture??

judgenutmeg - I really wish this school were like yours.. did you pay full fees for part-time attendance??

Given how much my daughter has learnt in her Reception year, I would be very concerned about how much a child would miss out on if they went part-time for a whole year. I think that would be a bigger disadvantage than being an August baby, and you could be creating a problem for the future.

Schools are used to dealing with a wide range of children in Reception every single year - some nearly 5, some just 4, some have attended nursery full time since being babies, some have not even gone to a playgroup. A good school will handle it with no problem, and do whats required to settle in every child. I know he's your little son, but every year there are parents concerned that their August baby is not ready for school, by Christmas they are normally settled in fine.

dd (who will be 5 on 30 August) has just finished Reception. She went mornings only until the last few weeks. I just stood my ground. I was very polite, cited the law that says children do not have to be in full-time education until they are five, and the school capitulated straightaway.

I still wish she hadn't had to start until this September,though.

If you defer you will lose the benefit of the Early Years nursery grant for those 3 terms. dd is end of August born and went fulltime at just 4. Go with the part-time for now if it suits you and review at half term. We asked about it but in the end felt that the way the day was structured - learning activities in mornings - long lunch then free play/pe/swimming/art etc in afternoons - actually meant that the day was not so arduous as feared. She was tired by the autumn half term but then didn't look back. Remember they are used to having summer born children in the Reception class and will flag up any problems.

Our local (state) primary allows all children to go part time until the term after their fifth birthday, recognising that parents know their child best and what will work best for them. In practice most children go full time from the start but if you feel your child needs to be part time that is absolutely fine.

All the academic stuff is done in the mornings and they do encourage you to send your child every morning at least so they don't miss out, and you can then pick them up before or after lunch.

All of my school age children have gone part time for some of their reception year, gradually working up to full time. It has worked very well and they've all been fine academically - certainly haven't been disadvantaged IMO. It's such a shame that more schools don't operate a similar policy.

I know children in the private school system who in a different year to the one they would be in if they were in the state system. Ie a late August boy I know very well transferred to a different school and effectively dropped a year - basically repeating the first year of secondary school and going from the youngest to the oldest in the class. The effect on his confidence has been astonishing. From feeling as if he was struggling at everything, he is now confident and happy and predicted very good grades at GCSE. I wish there was flexibility like this is the state system, I really do.

If you don't think he's ready and you have the option, don't send him. See if the private school will defer the place until next year and send him to pre-school for another year. Some kids can cope but if you don't think yours can don't put him in that situation - playing catch up for years is no fun.

DS1 started a few weeks after her turned 4 and it was a total disaster. I tried over the years to keep him back but couldn't. It is only since we moved to Australia and I was finally able to put him back a year that he is coming into his own (he's Year 9 now). The system here is so much more flexible and I really can't see what the UK has to gain by being so rigid. My DD will start school 2 weeks before her 6th birthday next January - she could have gone this year but I put her into 2 day a week pre-school instead, pretty much because I could.

Ds went to nursery from 6 months 3 days a week and is a confident friendly child. he settled in very well to a pre-school aged 2.5 and was not clingy like some of the other children. He's a May birthday and i was not concerned that he would be starting school ages 4 and 4 months and felt he would cope well. We then moved up to Scotland were he missed the cut off buy about 3 months. At first i was sad that he would not start school but now can really see that he has benefited from the extra year. he's much more confident and is starting to read and write more and understands much more. he also has more stamina to deal with the longer days. a couple of my friends actually deferred their boys as they were right on the cusp (so would have been only 4 1/2 ) and the feeling was that boys in particular do not always benfit from being so young and it is better to wait a year.

Why not speak to your school about seeing if he can start reception a year later and talk it through with them.

I don't agree in keeping children out of their year - the school should be able to sort out work based on what he is ready for. He will change a lot over the next year anyway - and at the school I work at the 1st year is play-based learning. Have you other children to compare him too? How do you know he is not ready?

Mind you I suspose it depends upon the school - if it is very formal leaning right from the start then youmay be right, but most schools do lots of play based learning. And if you pull him out you may be liable for a terms fees.

It doesn't matter how the OP knows her child isn't ready for school. She thinks her child isn't ready. That's her decision. She does not have to defend it to anyone, not even a court of law, since her child does not legally have to be in education of any kind until September 2009!

What she needs, given that in her opinion her child is not ready for school in September, is a heap of brainstormed alternatives to sift through.

I hate all this "think of what they'll miss". A child who goes to school at 5 will have 13 years of compulsory education, and people are quibbling about whether the 14th year is vital to their emotional and intellectual well being??? Maybe think of it the other way around. By not starting when he's not absolutely ready, think of what he'll gain. And how glorious that gain might be.

onwardandupward - you are right...however don't forgot unmless you keep your child down a year all the other children will have had at least 2 terms more education...even if they haven't "leant" more - they will be more use to the routines and have formed friendship groups.

jemimap it is your choice? Why not try the schools suggestion - honselty he will gave grown up so much more by October?

but do your pre-school still have a place for him? Will they be able to have him after Oct half-term if it doesn't work out?

Agree with Onwardandupward.

You see, Cazzybabs, there it is again. Look what he'll miss: "all the other children will have had at least 2 terms more education...even if they haven't "leant" more - they will be more use to the routines and have formed friendship groups"

But it's not even true.

1. School is not the only place where education happens. The OPs child is already at a pre-school, and all the time they aren't, they are at home and out and about learning and learning and soaking everything up like a sponge. That's what 4 year olds do. It's in the job spec. The other children won't have had 2 more terms of education. They'll have had two more terms in school. Not necessarily a big deal, or even a little one!

1. "They will be more used to the routines". Are school routines really so hard to adapt to? If so, maybe children would be best going to pre-pre-school to get ready for the routine of pre-school where, presumably they get ready for the routine of reception, where they get ready for the routine of year 1. Hmm. Or maybe a child will adapt best to the frankly quite weird culture of school (if you look at it from outside, like an anthropologist) when they are old enough and confident enough to manage the transition with ease. When they are old enough to ask to go to the loo. When they are old enough to manage another half an hour till they are allowed a snack. Some will be ready for that at 4. But not all, and nor should they be expected to be if they aren't.

1. And are the friendship groups of small children really so hard to break into if you've missed the start of them? Better make sure all our children are in the same pre-school as the children they'll be in school with, then, and in the same nursery as the ones who they'll be in pre-school with... Honestly, this inpenetrable friendship group thing makes no sense to me. When a new small child appears in a group of small children, they suss each other out and they fall into place with the ones they feel most comfortable with. Does it matter whether 3 of the children are already friends when you join and become the fourth member of the group?

There's so much anxiety about somehow missing the boat. I think it's more important to do what is right for a child now and this month and this term and this year, not what WON'T suit them now but we think will make things better 18 months down the line. Children live now, not in the future.

shcool is a mainstream principle of society where commonalities are found

your kid won't know about those social jokes in adulthood will not be able to reminice about "my history teacher" chewing gu m on chair, the johnny's pants fell down or the day miss was hit by a ball in tennis, or the day that kid farted ..................... and on

you can argue your way and what you want to do as much as you want - becuase if you want something enought you can argue it - smokers can argue it wont kill em.

you want to keep your kids at home for selfish reasons unless they are so unable to adapt socially that youhave to take them out.

i unerstand the want to home ed if the school is the wankest ever with high knife crime

but some of this shit is just the adult feeling the need to be needed becuse they are afraid of what to do with their lifes.