Mixed year group classes in primary school

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My daughter’s primary school informed us just before half-term that they will be mixing years 3 and 4 from September. The class sizes will be over 30, around 33 or 34. My daughter will be year 4 in September. I’m struggling to find any positives here, so would be grateful to know about other people’s experiences! Thank you.

Are all the kids born within say 6 months of each other rather than Augusts being in with Septembers? That’s a benefit although surely you’d just split year 4 into a winter born class and a summer born class rather than mix with another year. Is the mixing of the year groups to do with uneven birth rates?

Sorry OP very unhelpful, just never understood ever since my primary school was the same!

It’s not great. Even without the large class it’s a difficult thing to have to teach two year groups at once. It can be good for dc who are in one year group and are working at the level of the other year group but overall it’s got more disadvantages than advantages.

My children have been in a school with mixed year groups all the way through. Both very happy and achieving. Never been a cause for concern.

I worked in a school where the years were mixed, seemed to work ok for everyone! The 2 different years did similar work but different

It’s the huge class that would be upsetting to me rather than the mixed year groups.

The range of abilities across two year groups can usually be met by a good teacher just as easily as the abilities in a single year group.

The question I would ask would be about curriculum/content. How will the topics be taught so that your child doesn’t miss anything. When my DS school started mixing year groups, my DS ended up leapfrogging straight to the Y6 curriculum for that school meaning he didn’t cover the Y5 topics.

My children's school has mixed year group classes (y1/2 y3/4, y5/6) and it's absolutely fine. No issues, and I think it's nice that they get to know the kids in other year groups better than they would otherwise.

I would run a mile if younger y4 dc are seen as lower achieving and put with older y3 dc. My DD as an August birthday got a place at Oxford snd this model of splitting a year group assumes summer borns are the same as the y3 autumn borns. They clearly can be just as bright as any other y4 dc. So it’s poor to assume summer borns are babies and unable to do much whilst the older ones are chosen to steam even further ahead in dedicated y4 class.

Each class should be even handed in age. Yes, class size is a bit big but the school clearly cannot afford 2 teachers per year group. I assume they have around 100 dc in years 3 and 4. That’s got to be 3 teachers unless they are rich.

Quality of teaching is down to quality of teachers. Do you trust them? Are they having a parents evening? How will they teach the very brightest vs low achievers? Will they set? How will topics be covered - eg maths curriculum? In what order? Small schools have done this for generations but it takes skill and hard work. Ask lots of questions about their plans.

Will some dc leave?

Thank you this gives me ideas for more questions to ask the school. I’m worried my daughter will end up repeating the same material as she will be going into year 4. Quality of teaching…..it’s been fine so far, but obviously this is a very different style. It’s not really a small school at all: it’s a 450-odd primary but yes, they’re doing this because numbers are low in some year groups, partly due to a fall in the birthrate. Will some people leave….maybe, but they’ve told us so late that there aren’t many options left.
It’s great to hear of positive experiences though, thank you for those.

My son went to a mixed year groups school all the way through. No concerns. He thrived.

It’s not ideal as a teacher.

This might be down to small cohort and costs. I doubt that the teacher will want this. I'm a teacher, secondary, but would not want this. I remember early in.my teaching career, we taught y12 and 13 together for A level French' did not work. I have heard of it happening quite a bit in primary. Those class sizes ridiculous.

I def had this as a child and don’t recall serious issues
if it’s a 450 school are they combining across year 3/4 or just some of them. I’d be more concerned about the latter if my child was affected.

As a teacher, it makes no difference really in terms of teaching. You get a huge range of abilities in one year group anyway so across two it’s not much different. Curriculum wise it would be a rolling programme so that everything is covered across the two years. Large classes aren’t ideal but unfortunately this approach is becoming the norm where schools were previously told to expand yet now have falling numbers and are forced to do this. Happened to ours too.

I'd only be concerned at class size. Nothing wrong with mixed year groups.

I’m worried my daughter will end up repeating the same material as she will be going into year 4. Teachers are able to deal with this.

I'm a teacher though in Scotland. It's common to have composite classes up here. This year I've taught a P5/4. I think composite is great for the kids. You can challenge those that need it also and support those that need it by using flexible groupings. You also have the space and time to make sure you're individualising teaching as much as possible. The extra physical space in my class has let me set up lots of active independent learning activities, for example.

I've just been working with my colleagues on classifying the classes for next year and we've got many composites again next year. When putting kids into classes it's not based on age, it's based on a lot of things including ability groups (you need no more than ideally three main groups across the class in lit and NUM), friendship groups, personality clashes and ASN (SEND in England I believe?).

My main concern would be the sheer size of that class - in Scotland they're legally capped at 25. Is that with one teacher? Is there a full time classroom assistant? Personally I believe that the smaller size of a composite is one of the major benefits - you can really support and challenge pupils when you've got a smaller class

I think it can be positive if your child is smart as they won't be held back, usually the work is split by ability so it can be very good for them. The class size isn't great though.

There are definitely loads of posts on this on MN as I've posted many, many replies (under different usernames) about how in my experience as a mixed year teacher of 10 years it isn't an issue. Other things in a school can have a far bigger impact. It might seem unusual if it isn't a set up you are familiar with but it works in hundreds of schools across the country.

For what it's worth though, I wouldn't put my summer born child in a school though if they split the classes on age. It only works if you have the same high expectations of both classes and if you have a younger and older class I don't think that can be the case.

I went to a school with composite classes, they were split on age rather than ability and I know my mum was annoyed at the time as I was a summer born but it worked out fine. I spent two years in class 3 (year 2 and 3) and didn't end up in a class with the whole of my year until class 6. Work was differentiated so I was actually ahead of everyone else by year 6.

If you don't mind, can you explain further?

And actually socially I think it helped for me to have a spell as the oldest in the class rather than youngest.

I also think that there was more effort to give differentiated work which meant I was stretched a lot more than I might have been otherwise.

It’s quite common around here as the schools are very small. DS starts school in September and three year groups will be mixed in together - reception, y1 and y2.

I had this back in the 70s, plus larger class sizes too. We definitely had 40 pupils in my final year at primary as the coat pegs and pidgeon holes were numbered and I remember being 39! 4 classrooms for infant years R,1,2 and five classrooms for junior years 3-6. We "skipped" a classroom in both infants and juniors. Worked well, can't remember any problems, quite fun mixing with different classmates.

DS had it too but at his primary (in the noughties), it was a bigger school with more classes. Same 4 classes for infants R,1,2, but they had six classes for juniors 3-6, so he ended up skipping two classes in one go, which we thought would be too high a leap, but he was fine and still achieved "top" table.

We’ve had this in a way it’s been quite good as my kids were older for the year and joined group above. They are bright and have been stretched as they often do their own work then have a go and next year up for maths. So working at an exceedingly expectations level for a few subjects.

They split by age rather than ability. Some kids in the other group left the school as felt teaching was to the lower year group level. The class will be back together this year so it’ll be interesting to see how kids get on together after a few years apart.

My DS had a couple of years mixed classes. They did English and maths separately in ‘usual’ sets.

What I thought was more bizarre was when they put circa 6 kids from year 6 into the year 4 maths sets. I’d imagine the year 6 children will have felt rubbish about that. I know my year 4 child was quite perplexed by his sisters peers being in his lessons.

My children were in mixed classes last year nursery/ reception and year 2/3. My eldest daughter thrived being with older children as she is a September baby. They still separated the classes for certain lessons. I feel like my youngest in Reception didn’t develop as well as my eldest when she was in Reception and her current year 1 teacher (they are back to normal classes now) says all the class are behind what they should be. Im
not sure if this is down to the mixed class though. I think with a better teacher who was supported better it probably would have been fine.