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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

My daughter against her own race

61 replies

LondonerWith2 · 02/11/2024 20:36

I need advice.
My daughter is a 6 year old white female. I'm white British and her dad is white British with part Korean.
My daughter has just had black history month at school and has also been learning about the religion of Islam in class.
LET ME MAKE CLEAR I HAVE NO OBJECTIONS TO HER LEARNING ABOUT OTHER RACES AND RELIGIONS
However, I'm becoming concerned, as are several relatives, at the way she views herself. She's recently made comments to myself and family about the fact she doesn't want to be white, wishes she wasn't Christian, wants to be Muslim etc.
She's also asked for hairstyles that her friends who aren't white have, I can AND DO do them on her, however explain that due to different hair textures it will look A little different on hers.

She's made lots of comments about being unhappy about being white and being Christian which is bothering me. I don't know what to do, family members have said to speak to the school and tell them the things She's been saying so that they can encourage her to love herself in her skin and her own culture but I don't want to make it seem as though I'm unhappy her learning about others.
Advice?

OP posts:
MaidOfAle · 03/11/2024 00:00

LondonerWith2 · 02/11/2024 22:46

If I'm honest I'm not sure what the 'majority white and Christian' things are that you think are taught? Maybe Christian but not white. Generally white people are taught about as tyrants (not using specific words obviously) but invasions Henry VIII and all his wives ect. Being white is never glamorised or portrayed as being a good thing (in today's society)
I do hope she grows out of it as her self esteem has had a hit.
I'll continue to do her hair in any way she wants (given I can do it🤣) snd encourage her to love herself.
What white and Christian positive messages are you speaking of? I'm not being sarcastic at all but I'd like to know so I can encourage myself. Thanks for the advice!

Generally white people are taught about as tyrants (not using specific words obviously) but invasions Henry VIII and all his wives ect. Being white is never glamorised or portrayed as being a good thing (in today's society)

Really? Were Marie Curie, Robert and George Stephenson, Isombard Brunel, Douglas Bader, Florence Nightingale, and the Wright brothers not all white? And none of them were tyrants.

Black History Month is one month, to spotlight people whose achievements have historically been minimised because of racism.

Imagine if someone came and started a thread complaining that Women's History Month was making their son feel left out. That's how silly this is.

MotherOfRatios · 03/11/2024 00:02

I don't understand why you're so keen for her to see whiteness so much when her father isn't fully white?

it's bizarre? Celebrate diversity if you go down the route of demonising diversity it's not going to be good for her in the future it could make her a not very nice person

Isitreallythough · 03/11/2024 00:08

MsCactus · 02/11/2024 23:00

"Being white is never glamorised or portrayed as being a good thing (in today's society)"

OP if you look at any TV programme, the people portrayed as beautiful will 9/10 times be white. The hero or heroine will nearly always be white. Same for books, adverts, models - everything media related.

Beauty and goodness is portrayed as white people (generally) in media - that's why there is rightly such a backlash nowadays to get more diversity on screen, but it's still overwhelmingly white

Yes… and she’ll go through her education exposed overwhelmingly to the literature, philosophy, art etc etc of white artists and thinkers. Overwhelmingly. White heroes, protagonists, people of influence and interest will be everywhere in her intellectual upbringing.
Maybe she’s reacting to the deliberate celebration of Black history and achievements in Black History Month. But what she might not grasp is that that celebration is just a small step to counterbalancing the huge dominance of white culture and history in education.

ReggaetonLente · 03/11/2024 00:17

My white 6yo, in a diverse area of central London where like yours she is a minority in her school, regularly tells me she wants to have darker skin because it’s more ‘fashionable’, and beads or braids in her hair. I deal with the hair thing by acknowledging that she wants to look like her friends but that it’s more complicated than that and that our hair can also be an expression of our ancestry and culture, which it’s important to be respectful of. However she did come home from a Ghanaian friend’s birthday party with braided hair and beads, done by the mum, so maybe it’s just me wringing my hands over cultural appropriation!

The skin thing I let go. She’ll come to understand the complexities of race issues in the UK in time I’m sure. Right now she just wants to look like her friends because she sees them as beautiful, because she loves them, and I love that.

We used to live in Asia and both my blonde, white girls used to draw themselves with black hair when we were there. They stopped when we moved away. I actually forgot about that until now! Children just want to fit in with those around them I think. It’s part of how we’ve survived as a species for so long!

StrawberryCobbler · 03/11/2024 00:22

Surely you should be encouraging her to love herself in her skin and her culture? I think you have the right idea about encouraging her but are looking in the wrong place for it.

Also I know that everything seems more diverse these days but there are still many people who do not see their identities represented often.

jen337 · 03/11/2024 00:41

whiteboardking · 02/11/2024 23:47

She's 6. She wants to be like her friends. Seriously do not over think it. These are children who can't read fluently or tie shoelaces

No she’s being radicalised by extremest ideology, clearly a case for the police, possibly mi5

2021x · 03/11/2024 01:24

Any time anyone is in the minority they want to fit in, especially as children.

As long as no one is saying that being x is BETTER than being y then no harm is being done.

She will hear more stories about white people being tyrants simply because in Britain most people have been white. She will also hear about most hero’s being white because most people in Britain have been white. It’s a numbers thing.

curiousS · 03/11/2024 02:46

Not the point but how is she white if her dad is part Korean? She's mixed race surely? I would be teaching her that.

HeadacheEarthquake · 03/11/2024 06:55

Tell her Christianity originated in the middle east and that Jesus certainly wasn't white

Oblomov24 · 03/11/2024 07:03

Her lack of confidence needs addressing specifically more than the religion part. Focus on that first, why haven't you addressed that before?

BoleynMemories13 · 03/11/2024 07:25

She's 6. At 6, children are heavily influenced by their here and now. If you have the local fire brigade in for a talk, then talk about the future careers the children are interested in pursuing a few days later, most will say they want to be fire fighters. It's fresh in their mind. If you're studying India in geography, you'll find many in the class apparently going home asking to eat Indian food, or even asking to visit India on holiday. If you're studying space, most of the class suddenly become obsessed with space for a few weeks and apparently want to be astronauts, even if they'd never been interested before.

I'd say her teachers are doing a good job of hooking her in and making her interested in her learning. She's not just passively hearing things. She has clearly been completed immersed in a way which has made both Islam and Black History seem completely fascinating topics to her. I really wouldn't see her current desire to be Muslim or black as anything more than her taking a keen interest in her current school topics, at this stage. Her interests will likely move on soon, when new topics start.

If she's a minority in her school, it's only natural that she'll also be keen to be like her friends. Learning to love one's self for who we are is something that is drip fed throughout our lives by those around us. It's not something we're automatically born with. It's only natural she will be curious about other races and cultures, and wonder why she is different to most of her friends. It's no different to a child being keen to learn to speak Polish if they have quite a few Polish friends, for example. If she's interested in hair styles, embrace her current desire to look like her friends to indulge her (which it sounds like you have been doing) but also use it as an opportunity to search the internet together for other styles she may like which you know will suit her hair type more. Show her that you're interested in her interest in hair. She'll discover that there are far more styles out there than just the styles she's use to seeing on her friends at school, and she'll enjoy that you are helping her to find them.

There are so many books out there which celebrate difference. It's definitely a topic you can enjoy exploring together. Listen to her questions, embrace her curiosity but, most importantly, delve into her own family history to help her understand where she comes from and what is special about her. I would definitely explore her Korean heritage more. It sounds like something which she will find really interesting.

MissHavershamReturns · 03/11/2024 07:28

There is a lovely book for this age group which has been written by an expert on self image in the primary years. I would really recommend this as it helped my child through a patch where they were worried about how they looked:

www.hachette.co.uk/titles/emmi-smid/minnie-and-max-are-ok/9781785922336/

MyrtlethePurpleTurtle · 03/11/2024 07:31

LondonerWith2 · 02/11/2024 22:46

If I'm honest I'm not sure what the 'majority white and Christian' things are that you think are taught? Maybe Christian but not white. Generally white people are taught about as tyrants (not using specific words obviously) but invasions Henry VIII and all his wives ect. Being white is never glamorised or portrayed as being a good thing (in today's society)
I do hope she grows out of it as her self esteem has had a hit.
I'll continue to do her hair in any way she wants (given I can do it🤣) snd encourage her to love herself.
What white and Christian positive messages are you speaking of? I'm not being sarcastic at all but I'd like to know so I can encourage myself. Thanks for the advice!

I can't think of a single white Disney princess, pop star or actor ...

JeremiahBullfrog · 03/11/2024 07:54

I think when I was six I vaguely wanted to be a Native American. It wasn't based on any in-depth understanding of those cultures, and it didn't last.

GivingUpFinally · 03/11/2024 07:55

Mine had this at a similar age. Dc is mixed race and wanted nothing more than to be "European," which I explained they technically were. Dc was 6 during the brexit vote. We celebrate and educate our kids on where they come from ethnically. They are 3/4 white, but the other quarter is just as Important.

I think you're best off on a route that celebrates and embraces differences and what they can mean overall. Which it sounds like you're doing. This includes being white and Asian for her. Saying it's only small part of her is invalidating and minimising her ethnicity. Embrace what makes her special.

I'm not religious at all and do not understand blind faith, but I appreciate that you need to learn about different religions and their cultural significance. Often, those bits are glossed over and are a difficult concept for children to fully grasp.

I hate how much time is devoted to this in schools, away from traditional core skills. But as I said, I do understand the importance. I would prefer that they taught more about culture and the history of different races and, sadly, the interactions that have led us to an unequal society to better prepare them for the world.

Education, like the one she is receiving, helps to reduce ignorance and to make acceptance universal. It's a lofty ambition and it sounds like her school is doing a great job.

She's 6 and going through a phase. She will come out of it

Boobygravy · 03/11/2024 08:14

It will be a phase. Dc just want to fit in. If it wasn’t race it would be something else.
The interesting thing is that she hadn’t noticed the difference herself until it was brought to her attention. I see that as positive, her classmates were just that and she didn’t define them by colour.

QuickMember · 03/11/2024 08:22

LondonerWith2 · 02/11/2024 22:42

Thanks so much
I do this as regularly as I often tell her how beautiful she is and how she's perfect just the way she is
Thanks so much

You’re very welcome. Your daughter is still young and so there’s still very much hope.

Anothernamechane · 03/11/2024 10:05

LondonerWith2 · 02/11/2024 22:46

If I'm honest I'm not sure what the 'majority white and Christian' things are that you think are taught? Maybe Christian but not white. Generally white people are taught about as tyrants (not using specific words obviously) but invasions Henry VIII and all his wives ect. Being white is never glamorised or portrayed as being a good thing (in today's society)
I do hope she grows out of it as her self esteem has had a hit.
I'll continue to do her hair in any way she wants (given I can do it🤣) snd encourage her to love herself.
What white and Christian positive messages are you speaking of? I'm not being sarcastic at all but I'd like to know so I can encourage myself. Thanks for the advice!

This is the moment I knew you were being disingenuous.

Useruser1 · 03/11/2024 10:39

MotherOfRatios · 02/11/2024 23:20

Your comments are quite distasteful tbh I'm Black and it's exhausting living in a world in the west where I'm seen as an 'exception' and whiteness as the default/norm.

We teach about how glorious the Industrial Revolution was but not about the role of the slave trade which helped this.....

Being white is celebrated by the majority of tv etc still having white actors etc as the lead.

But to your point embrace the fact you're CofE embrace her Korean heritage?

If I moved to a majority black country I'd "be the exception" and would expect that!

Whoyergonnacall · 03/11/2024 10:51

Useruser1 · 03/11/2024 10:39

If I moved to a majority black country I'd "be the exception" and would expect that!

Where does it say she moved anywhere?

workmumma · 04/11/2024 19:00

This is an interesting post and an interesting discussion. Completely understand the rationale that as a six year old she will have phases and then will eventually forget about it. However it still merits an understanding of how the messages of black history month and Islam were passed on.

that should be investigated. Its not the what but 'the how'.

If Black history month is taught more as demonising another race instead of celebrating black then that is indeed a problem and should be challenged massively.
Again if Islam is being taught as a great religion which has not had any troubles or is better than other religions then that is also a problem. It is just another religion thats it. Just like christianity, Judaism etc.

Going by how academics have been behaving particularly in western nations from schools to universities, there is always a case to check there. unidimensional messages are to be avoided and a balnaced view is more important even to a 6 year old. Same is true for anythjing to do with white race, christianity etc.

So, best is to ensure that she moves on from it and also investigate the school is landing the right messages.

Thiswayorthatway · 04/11/2024 19:09

She’s 6. When she learns about Sikhism she’ll want to be a Sikh, when she learns about Judaism she’ll want to be a Jew. My 2 both went through it.

Lovethatforyouhun · 04/11/2024 19:11

.

vladimirVsvolodymr · 04/11/2024 19:57

Good point @Whoyergonnacall!

Lighttodark · 04/11/2024 20:05

LondonerWith2 · 02/11/2024 22:46

If I'm honest I'm not sure what the 'majority white and Christian' things are that you think are taught? Maybe Christian but not white. Generally white people are taught about as tyrants (not using specific words obviously) but invasions Henry VIII and all his wives ect. Being white is never glamorised or portrayed as being a good thing (in today's society)
I do hope she grows out of it as her self esteem has had a hit.
I'll continue to do her hair in any way she wants (given I can do it🤣) snd encourage her to love herself.
What white and Christian positive messages are you speaking of? I'm not being sarcastic at all but I'd like to know so I can encourage myself. Thanks for the advice!

Obvious ones: Easter, Christmas - not just at school, society as a whole.

“Being white is never glamorised or portrayed as being a good thing (in today's society)” - not being white is the very reason minority ethnic groups face many challenges