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Original poster

Y2 class being taught by HLTA

59 replies

notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 17:04

DS is in Y2 and his class teacher is on long-term sick leave. She has not taught a single day yet this year. For context, she was his teacher in YR and was absent for most of the year, and most of last year too, so I have no reason to believe that she will be returning any time soon.

DS has been taught by another teacher since September. We were told that this was a long-term plan, but last week we got a letter saying that she is reducing her hours and will be teaching 1 day a week, plus covering the new teacher's PPA one afternoon a week.

I have just found out from another parent that the person becoming the substantive teacher for DS is in fact a HLTA rather than a teacher. I feel unsettled and uncomfortable about this - particularly given that YR was very disrupted (and anecdotal conversation with other parents suggests that children in his YR class are behind the other class in reading and English).

WWYD? I'm assuming the school has no funding for a FT teacher, because they are paying sick leave on a long-term basis. It's a small school so likely doesn't have a teacher's salary to spare. Is it legal for a TA to be the class 'teacher' in a maintained school?

I'd like to make it clear that I'm sure the TA is lovely and wonderful at her job; but surely the reason teachers need to qualify is that their role is more skilled than that of a TA?

I'm increasingly frustrated that my child's education is being compromised for a second year. The school has opted out of the SATs for Y2 so there's no accountability there either... Short of moving him to another school, what can I do?!

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PrincessesRUs · 18/11/2023 18:04

This SO sounds like my kid's school (she's in year 2 too) - are you in north Hampshire just out of interest??

PrincessesRUs · 18/11/2023 18:07

If you're where I think you are I think they'd say that the deputy head who is the other year 2's teacher is overseeing both classes

Heartfullofcheese · 18/11/2023 18:23

Massive recruitment crisis. Teachers are leaving mid year with nothing to go to in many cases. Those sticking it out are reducing days to try to cope. In many areas you can advertise and get no applicants at all.
The tighter the staffing stretches the worse it gets. TAs (not even HLTAs) covering. No support for children with SEN. If someone is off sick you miss lunch as there’s no one to watch your class.
Many HLTAs are excellent and very capable. You can’t just pull a teacher from another class to teach elsewhere for lots of reasons.
It’s appalling. No solutions (don’t vote Tory though).

Schooldinner2 · 18/11/2023 18:23

I dont get how the sick leave is so long?
However my dc had a teacher go off sick mid y6. No teacher for about 4-6w then others from in school. Luckily they didnt put that teacher in for y6 this year as they are still off so almost a whole 12m.
Still not great foe whichever class got the teacher.

So did some kids in his year not have this teacher at all? If so they should have been swapped to get her this year as its completely predictable.
My dc got the same strict teacher twice when half the year obviously hadnt had him at all. I was annoyed as dc whilst still struggling did not need to be remembered as they were back then. It was also the only year - out of 7 dc didnt meet maths expectations. And i think the teacher again in y5 didnt see past that as by y6 they were exceeding

Octavia64 · 18/11/2023 18:31

As your son (and presumably either all the rest of his class or half the rest of his class if they mixed them up) is being hit by this twice, it would be reasonable to point this out to the school and ask that his class has a full-time teacher and a different class takes the hit this time.

whatsappdoc · 18/11/2023 18:34

It's not ideal, especially for the HLTA! But the pupils who normally have the HLTA will be suffering too; possibly a rookie TA will be pressganged into taking those classes. Any warm body will do in this dreadful era of state education.

MrsHamlet · 18/11/2023 18:38

LilithImpala67 · 18/11/2023 17:19

If it is an Academy or an Independent school they do not have to be qualified teachers . State schools run by the council are required to have qualified teachers.

Actually, even maintained schools can decide that someone is "qualified enough"

larkstar · 18/11/2023 18:44

As a full time class teacher, I have worked with HLTA's who I would regard as outstanding.

Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 19:44

PrincessesRUs · 18/11/2023 18:04

This SO sounds like my kid's school (she's in year 2 too) - are you in north Hampshire just out of interest??

Yup, sounds like it's the same place!!

OP posts:
Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 19:50

wildblue07 · 18/11/2023 17:47

Many schools are facing the same issues. Teachers are leaving the profession mid year and therefore the school don’t have many applicants at that point so have to do their best to cover. This may be a long term supply or a HLTA. I’m a teacher and know of many schools struggling with staffing issues. It’s nightmare and does impact on children’s education.

This is the difficulty, isn't it. I'm very sympathetic to the situation that the school is in, and have the utmost respect for the teaching profession; I never said a word to the school during YR mad actually think it's overall a great school. But this just doesn't seem like a good solution - for the children, the HLTA, the teacher doing the planning or the other members of staff having to do more supervision to cover the fact there's no qualified teacher leading the lessons.

OP posts:
FloweryName · 18/11/2023 19:51

It’s legal and it’s becoming much more common. I know a few people working as unqualified teachers right now.

It might be that the school are going to support her through teacher training soon.

Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 19:52

cansu · 18/11/2023 17:48

It is poor but not that unusual. Schools have been using TAs and unqualified instruments tors for a while now. It is partly to cut costs but also due to difficulty recruiting. I would be complaining tbh. They could of course look at the children who have already been affected and do some staffing changes to make sure the same kids are not affected again.

The classes were mixed after YR so there's a 50% chance that they'd be affected again when the teacher on long-term sick was moved to Y2 this year. I don't know why they didn't just leave her in YR to be honest

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Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 19:52

WASZPy · 18/11/2023 17:55

Doing a whole week's planning while only being paid for 1.5 days is a rough deal for the teacher. I wonder how long she will stick that out.

My thoughts exactly, I'm sure it's not what she signed up for!

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Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 19:53

Squirrelsonthescaffolding · 18/11/2023 17:57

I agree with cansu. I would focus my energy on the unfairness of the same children being affected for a second school year. This is something they might be able to do something about by moving staff around. Is there a parallel class who ‘had’ this teacher last year?

The classes were mixed, so it would affect 50% of the children in either Y2 class. We just drew the short straw

OP posts:
Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 19:57

modgepodge · 18/11/2023 18:04

It’s really not ideal but quite possibly the only solution they have. Teachers are like gold dust at the moment even if they have the budget to pay one. You mentioned the other class - in a 2FE class you may find the other y2 teacher is doing all the planning and regularly catching up with the HLTA to see how lessons are going and supporting as much as she can. If a member of SLT may be. As year group lead for a 3FE school, this was part of my role if we have TAs covering classes or supply for any period of time.

I agree it seems unfair that the same class has been affected for 2 years. I think it’s worth complaining, if it’s going on the rest of the year they should consider moving a teacher to his class and another more settled class having thr HLTA IMO.

I wouldn't mind if it was short-term (until Christmas maybe?) but the impression that was given from the letter was that she is going to be the class teacher moving forward. I am sure that they think it's the best solution, possibly least disruptive solution, they can come up with. But I believe the children, and the staff being expected to pick up the slack, deserve better

OP posts:
LadyPenelope68 · 18/11/2023 19:57

Soontobe60 · 18/11/2023 17:29

Schools cannot opt out of KS1 and KS2 SATS.
I know some amazing HLTSs BTW. (And some pretty awful teachers)

@Soontobe60
Your information is incorrect, from September 2023, Schools can choose to opt out of KS1 SATs

Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 19:58

Heartfullofcheese · 18/11/2023 18:23

Massive recruitment crisis. Teachers are leaving mid year with nothing to go to in many cases. Those sticking it out are reducing days to try to cope. In many areas you can advertise and get no applicants at all.
The tighter the staffing stretches the worse it gets. TAs (not even HLTAs) covering. No support for children with SEN. If someone is off sick you miss lunch as there’s no one to watch your class.
Many HLTAs are excellent and very capable. You can’t just pull a teacher from another class to teach elsewhere for lots of reasons.
It’s appalling. No solutions (don’t vote Tory though).

Don't worry, no matter how bad it gets, I'll never vote Tory!

OP posts:
Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 20:00

Schooldinner2 · 18/11/2023 18:23

I dont get how the sick leave is so long?
However my dc had a teacher go off sick mid y6. No teacher for about 4-6w then others from in school. Luckily they didnt put that teacher in for y6 this year as they are still off so almost a whole 12m.
Still not great foe whichever class got the teacher.

So did some kids in his year not have this teacher at all? If so they should have been swapped to get her this year as its completely predictable.
My dc got the same strict teacher twice when half the year obviously hadnt had him at all. I was annoyed as dc whilst still struggling did not need to be remembered as they were back then. It was also the only year - out of 7 dc didnt meet maths expectations. And i think the teacher again in y5 didnt see past that as by y6 they were exceeding

It's so hard isn't it, when it's your child that is not getting what's best for them. Unfortunately the year group was mixed after YR so half the class would have been affected this year, no matter which class got her. We were just unlucky

OP posts:
Original poster
notanotherclairebear · 18/11/2023 20:03

larkstar · 18/11/2023 18:44

As a full time class teacher, I have worked with HLTA's who I would regard as outstanding.

I'm sure she is wonderful and I hope she is one of the excellent ones. All the staff at the school are honestly great. But it sort of makes of a mockery of teaching qualifications if you don't actually need to be a trained teacher to be the class teacher.

OP posts:
mammabing · 19/11/2023 07:50

It’s so difficult. Lots of HLTAs are absolutely amazing and for short term cover are a godsend but for long term something else should be put in place. However, there are no teachers.
I teach in primary and when my mat leave was advertised no one even applied for the role. They ended up getting various supply teachers which didn’t help with consistency and I wasn’t going to plan lessons on my time off.

endlesscraziness · 19/11/2023 08:01

My daughter in in year 6, so a fairly critical year and 2 days a week taught by a HLTA.

My friend is a HLTA and if the year 1 parents had their way they would oust the teacher currently in there and have her instead as she exceeds the teacher in every way and the qualified teacher is useless. The HLTA reorganised the class and ensured it was age appropriate, massively improved behaviour and then the teacher came back and screwed them up again. At that age the knowledge of how to get the best out of children can be better at the HLTA

TellerTuesday · 19/11/2023 08:12

I sympathise OP as my DD's class always seemed to get the raw deal too, it's only the last couple of years, Y4 and current Y5 that they've had stability of one constant teacher.

I do know that in their school there are 3 qualified teachers that for different reasons have chosen to step down and work as TAs so it could be the case that the TA is actually qualified.

And I do agree that having one constant TA is better than a different person taking the class each day, we had about 6 months of that in Y3 and it was just dreadful.

Longma · 19/11/2023 08:47

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Longma · 19/11/2023 08:51

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lavenderlou · 19/11/2023 08:57

It's crap and unfair on the class and the TA. Contrary to popular mumsnet lore most TAs are not qualified teachers who prefer to do a TA role. There are a few around but I've taught 20 years and never come across one. It takes advantage of the TA who will be getting low pay and disadvantages the class. My school are covering a maternity post with a TA. They barely tried to find a teacher because it's cheaper to use a TA and the school has no money.