New Year 4 Teacher Shouting; Banging Desks; Physically Pulling Kids Into Line....

[roses2]

Hi,

My DS in Year 4 (age 9) goes to a small outstanding rated school. Three weeks ago he got a new teacher as the old one "suddenly" resigned (we only got 1 day notice!).

The first two weeks he was coming home crying; said she shouts a lot and sends him out of class. Granted he can be disruptive but each year so far all the teachers have found a way to hold his attention without disrupting the class and sending him out.

DH went to speak with her; gave her a firm talking to that the shouting and sending him out isn't working and she needs to try another strategy which we will happily work with her on. Since then she has stopped sending DS out of class although the shouting continues.

Since last week DS has been coming home crying saying she has been hurting his friends. This is where I am now concerned:

• she shouts a lot
• Bangs the table of kids not listening
• DS said she is physically hurting his friends. Another school mum contacted me yesterday to say she is taking her child out of school today because he was the one she physically pulled to get into line. DS actually gave me the name of another child the teacher did this to, not this child!
• There is no longer a TA in the class, just her. So no other adult witness

I have a meeting with the deputy head this afternoon. Shouting at kids, banging desks and physically manoeuvring children to the point they cry is not acceptable.

I want to log this formally with the school but not really sure how to.

Can anyone help guide me on the process so I can articulate myself clearly when I meet the deputy head this afternoon?

It's normally a loving nurturing school with a great ethos. This is the first major issue we have had (and heard of).

How did the meeting go, OP?

This...
DH should be giving your child a good talking too.

Keeping disruptive children in the class is to the detriment of others.

One of my primary teachers used to hit the wooden desks with a ruler to get our attention/ stop us mucking about. That doesn't sound very different... fantastic teacher, I gained passion for a lot of new subjects that year!

I was at a stay and play for reception, and the teacher physically moved a year 2 child refusing to move (mixed year reception-year 2) and put her in a time out. I'm sure children would have described it as dragging a screaming child and dumping her on a bean bag, or perhaps the floor. Kids exaggerate.

Sometimes it's necessary to give children a nudge... as a parent, are you tell me you never need to gently move/nudge your children?? Why can't a teacher with 30 do that?? She probably had to nudge Jimmy, Sam and Tom because they were too busy mucking about and wouldn't listen. Chinese whispers etc in the playground and I'm sure she yanked them... They obviously don't like her because she is stern / actually disciplines... Not liking the teacher is a big factor in this story.

Absolutely not okay to be shouted at or physically harmed by a teacher. Follow the school's complaints procedure.

"Pulling" can be a grey area. I have "pulled" children to a different place by gently touching their arm or shoulder to move them. But I'll be saying "can I just move you over here?" to let them know. I suppose if another child didn't like me they could see me "pulling" an arm and tell their parents.

Please work with school to help your DS not disrupt the class, so every year another teacher doesn't have to "find a way" to get him to pay attention and not disrupt others.

Thanks to those that posted sensible replies. Several parents have now spoken to the Head and one of the children who was "pulled" has put in a formal complaint which means the LEA will investigate.

Banging on desks and scaring kids really isn't acceptable.

What was said in your meeting? A formal complaint doesn’t normally go straight to LEA

I was going to say that if a formal complaint of physical abuse is made against a teacher, it will have to go to the LADO for investigation.

It does if it's a complaint of abuse by a teacher. Schools don't investigate that themselves, LADO steps in

Also struggling to get past the DH/ talking to bit.
Take it up with the Head and let them sort it out.

What are you doing to address your DS’ bad behaviour in school? That seems to be the key to stopping the shouting / removal from the classroom.

It’s not pc but if teachers wait for ever for kids to get in line or do something it will never happen. Sometimes teachers have to “pull” kids into line or physiclly move them. There’s literally no other option. It’s just practical.

But what happened at YOUR meeting?
As others have said, a physical abuse complaint won't go to the LEA.
Who told you it would? How very odd.

LEA probably means the local authority designated officer, who would be the expert in dealing with allegations against a teacher. If the teacher is exonerated you probably won't find out any details but he or she will have gone through investigation, horrible but necessary and stay in post.

Let’s say a kid is told to do something. They don’t do it so the teacher is louder about it (shouting), they still won’t do it so the teacher says it and bangs something, they still don’t do it so the teacher has to physically move them.

You say your son has beahviour problems - how is a teacher meant to deal with him if he simply won’t do as asked?

I pity teachers today who get reported for raised voices or pulling kids in line by the parents of the little angels.

@ThatAnnoysMeToo

Completely agree. How are teachers meant to get kids to do anything if they won’t listen if they can’t use a raised voice, or if they won’t move how can a teacher get them to move without physically moving them?

Id like to see how the parents deal with that situation so they can hand it on to the teachers (who also have 25 other kids to worry about at the same time).

Some parents don’t think, they just don’t want their child exposed to any kind of discipline other than from themselves. But what is their practical suggestion to get kids to behave in school and not disrupt class?

Whatever the teacher’s methods for dealing with the class, you clearly need to work with your son so he isn’t disruptive in class. With no additional needs, it’s not acceptable that he is disruptive (which will absolutely impact the learning of others) and he’ll encounter a lot of problems moving through secondary school if he doesn’t stop this.

I’m a teacher and I’m flabbergasted that your husband went to give the teacher a firm talking to because she was attempting to deal with your son‘a disruptive behaviour. I’m cringing for you and your husband.

Your son needs to start behaving himself in class, and them the teacher wouldn't need to shout and send him out of the class.

It's disingenuous to say, 'granted, he can be disruptive.' What about the rest of class whose education he is disrupting?

At the meeting the head mostly listened about what I told her DS had witnessed. She said if an allegation is made then it is investigated externally and it's a very serious incident.

For those of you asking how I am managing DS' behaviour, she said he was performing very well; completing all of his work; he wasn't disruptive. Usually I am told he chats too much and doesn't complete his work so I suspect this was damage limitation from her. I also have a reward system for him at home where he receives weekly pocket money for good school performance.

This is the first time in five years I've heard from the school that his class in general is disruptive. The kids have been there since Reception and now in Year 4 albeit missed almost 1 year due to covid.

Anyway, it's out of my hands now. I've spoken about my concerns and so have other parents. Let's see what happens next.

Ah remember all the bad stuff is the teacher's fault for not trying hard enough.. 😑
Another who can't believe that the DH went into the school and gave the teacher a firm talking to flabbergasted by the arrogance of you!

Maybe the teacher can put in a complaint about the husband and get him banned from the school grounds

Your sons behaviour isn't out of your hands though, I'd be looking into that.

Why don't you read the full thread and see what I've done at home about his behaviour instead of posting stupid comments about how I am trying to blame the teacher for everything.

The accusations are out of my hands now. Not DS behaviour. Which apparently the school doesn't have any issues with based on what the head told me.

How can the school not have any issues with his behaviour when you say in your op
Granted he can be disruptive but each year so far all the teachers have found a way to hold his attention without disrupting the class and sending him out.?

Yes, you've said you pay him for good behaviour. Way to go.

It does seem odd that you recognise yourself his bad behaviour, then say the HT has said he isn't badly behaved (which presumably she has heard from the teacher)

@toomuchlaundry Hopefully. We've banned two verbally abusive (male) parents this term so far.

There are a lot of teachers who leave the job after parents not supporting or the opposite complaining constantly when a teacher is firm and disciplines disruptive pupils. Agree with those saying that you need to sort out your ds. Remember vast majority of teachers are just trying to do their job and it's not an easy job. Teachers who don't challenge poor behaviour are not good teachers

You offer him money if he's behaved? Cool seems to be working a treat doesn't it.