Mixed year group classes.

[Clevs]

Currently considering a couple of schools for our son to start in reception in September.

School A has a small (15) reception class then a year 1/2 class, year 3/4 class and year 5/6 class. Each year group has 15 pupils meaning each class has 30 pupils.

School B has a mixed pre-school (15) and reception (30) class but then each year group is just that year (30 in each class).

My current preference on school just for the general feel of the place when I looked round is school A. But would like experience of parents whose children are in mixed year groups. Do the younger ones struggle to keep up? Or the older ones held back because the younger ones also have to be considered? Apparently they are separated for things like maths where there is a big difference in ability.

Ironically I was in a mixed year group class for a couple of years when I was at primary school but can't really remember any benefits or issues!

My DC briefly went to a primary school that did mixed classes but they didn't do it when we were there, HOWEVER, I got to speak to quite a few parents whose older kids had been in mixed classes. Everyone I spoke to said it was really lovely and that it was nice for the kids to spend time in a more varied group. Apparently they did activities all together as one class, but generally they had separate teaching materials for the different year groups, e.g. they would all be learning about space together, but the younger ones would be focusing on colouring planets and the older ones would be learning to write about planets. Something along those lines anyway. It sounded really lovely but I would assume it depends on the school. The school my DC attended was a tight knit, smallish rural school so the whole school spent lots of time together and all classes mixed in some way or another.

Hopefully someone with more experience will come along shortly!

It's abit late to be deciding for Sept. applications should have been made before 15January and places are allocated on 8April.

@Plumbear2

It's abit late to be deciding for Sept. applications should have been made before 15January and places are allocated on 8April.

We've already got an application in but are moving house to another area and need to change schools so it will be a late application. As long as it's in before Feb 28th it will still be considered with the applications that were in on time.

Thanks @SpaceyCake , that's good to hear! It was my favourite school out of the two but I just wondered how mixed classes work in reality.

My kids school got bigger after they had started there, and they brought in split classes. I was concerned at first, but it was fine.

I teach in a mixed year school and honestly think the standard of education children get is outstanding. It brings the younger ones on - I teach to the higher year group generally and scaffold for the younger children where necessary. I have never heard of a parent who has concerns about our set up, although it is probably the norm rather than the exception in schools in this area.

My DS has been in a 1/2 and a 3/4 and it works well when your child is in the younger year as they tend to get brought up and come on loads.

When he was in mixed 1/2 as a year 2 it wasn't great to be honest. But that may well be the school/teacher - I think mixed year teaching takes a skilled teacher.

I personally think it doesn’t work at all and the children don’t get as good an good education compared to single year classes - particularly apparent in the younger years where they are learning more of the basics.

My children went to a school that sounds very similar to your school A.
It was great. If anything I think the younger children moved a little faster than they would have done otherwise. Possibly the children in the middle (ability wise) were the least well supported as the teacher had to differentiate so much that the lowest and highest abilities tended to be better catered for. But I'm not sure whether that was because of the split classes.
It was also in the era when there was a TA in each classroom which really helped.
From a social aspect it was fantastic.
But - as with all things - it's probably very school dependent. A bit like you can't say "independents are better than state" (some will be, some definitely won't be) , you probably can't judge all mixed class schools the same.
I'm a believer in trusting your instinct when it comes to schools and knowing where will suit your child.

The huge problem with small schools is friendships. Your child realistically has 7/8 possibilities when they are older. Older DC tend to move away from the cuddly school outlook that parents like in YR. They might actuality benefit from an orchestra or competitive sports teams. With small schools it’s missing. Friendships eventually need to be with own cohort as this group move on to secondary together.

Where I live, we don’t have primaries going through to y6 with 15 in a year group. The tiny schools go to y2 only and then DC go to a bigger junior to get everything I’ve described.

My friends, in a different county, had endless problems with a small school when DC got to y5. Friendships and limited opportunities really hit home. Go with the bigger school. Mixed classes in a bigger school are not really as issue - eg 45 in each cohort. The finances in small schools are often an issue too. 15x7 years isn’t many children or much money for a primary.

Don’t look at a school purely from a YR point of view. Small village schools can be ultra cliquey and close knit. I think DC benefit from a broader spectrum of friends and educational opportunities. 2 year groups is best or even bigger I think.

@TizerorFizz. This as well - friendships and the social learning is a huge issue. Not many to choose from at all particularly if the school is mixed. I did think it was cosy before we started and now I can see the problems. Also can’t really play any team sports.

Wow we have 90 in each year.

My children's school is mixed year groups. Ive always been very happy with it, as have they.

@taj0112
I do see parents on MN always looking at schools purely from a YR point of view. If they are infant schools, that’s ok and you then gave only 2 more years to look at. In a through primary, just looking at YR and arrangements for starting school is a tiny part of school life for the next 7 years. I always as I are bigger schools if you can get one. I think they develop the whole child more effectively.

As a teacher, I hated it and found it much harder to plan for all the children's needs. I avoided schools with mixed-age classes for my own children. However, I have only taught it when there has been the occasional mixed-age class due to fluctuating numbers. In schools where every class is mixed-age they are probably better set up for it and have more experience. I teach year 2 though and the difference between year 1 and 2 is vast. I can't see how teachers can prepare Year 2 pupils for SATs etc and meet the needs of all the Year 1s. I expect they need a good TA and not all classes have TAs these days.

Our children had 2 years in 1 class and it worked well as the children are v mixed ability anyway. The camel's back broke when they went to three years in a class. Our child was 6 and some others were 9. And they gave the class to the NQT. I feel the wheels came off. We moved schools.

A school that only has 100 children will be cut to the bone in terms of resources and the teachers are likely to be on their knees in view of the current ofsted framework's requirements in terms of subject leadership.

My children went to a primary like this and it benefitted both the ones who were "gifted" and the ones who were behind. The teachers are working on a wider range from the go so were more on the ball with supporting the individual needs than they were in the 60 intake infant and 90 intake juniors they came from.

On MN small schools get a bad rep I find. Personally I found the small schools worked together and my children had wide ranging friendships

@bluebubblebar

My DS has been in a 1/2 and a 3/4 and it works well when your child is in the younger year as they tend to get brought up and come on loads.

When he was in mixed 1/2 as a year 2 it wasn't great to be honest. But that may well be the school/teacher - I think mixed year teaching takes a skilled teacher.

The difficulty of year 1/2 is that year 1s are having to adapt to a 'sit at your desk' setup which is a big change from reception, so often it can be difficult managing the neediness that brings, and also challenging the brighter year 2s. Everyone I know who has worked in year 1/2 has found it tough.

I've done 3/4, 4/5 and 5/6 and it's much easier. That said I'd love a single year group. I've never actually taught one year group on its own. It would be so, so much easier.

@2reefsin30knots

A school that only has 100 children will be cut to the bone in terms of resources and the teachers are likely to be on their knees in view of the current ofsted framework's requirements in terms of subject leadership.

Yep I work in a school like this. That said I honestly think small schools have to have the best teachers because one teacher in a school like mine is responsible for not just teaching a mixed class, but also lead several subjects. Nothing against teachers in bigger schools, but of you're not great you won't last long in a small school, in my experience.

@2reefsin30knots

A school that only has 100 children will be cut to the bone in terms of resources and the teachers are likely to be on their knees in view of the current ofsted framework's requirements in terms of subject leadership.

My school has around 70 children and we are in a good position financially, even paying for experienced teachers. Yes it is hard work but I don't think that affects the pupils.

We've got 95 children and we're actually in a lot of financial trouble because of the supply costs of staff going off with covid, and caretaking costs with a caretaker basically doing a crap job for a lot of money. Had to use relief caretakers while we try to find another.

We're at a point where we may have to go down to 3 classes, which means mixing year groups even more.
We'll lose a couple of teachers if that happens. There's no way on earth I'd teach 3 year groups, especially after all the work we've put into our curriculum.

@taj0112

I personally think it doesn’t work at all and the children don’t get as good an good education compared to single year classes - particularly apparent in the younger years where they are learning more of the basics.

Just because your children didn't get a good education doesn't mean that you can conclude that all small schools are bad

Mu children went to a small school and had an excellent education - should I assume they are all good?

Of course not, that would be silly. You can't generalise about any type of school you need to look at only the ones you have to choose from and their specifics

You can certainly generalise in the knowledge that toy tiny schools won’t have sports teams. Of hosts of children doing music. Or a huge choice of friends.

Absolutely I can’t generalise from our particular school - however I think it’s fair to think about how difficult it is to teach one class with a variety of abilities and then think how much more challenging it is to teach across two year groups as teachers on here have said, particularly the younger years? Our school has done the very best it could but even they admit it’s not ideal. Teaching one topic to two year groups you can never pitch it to suit everyone so my children are getting a less than ideal teaching experience because of that.