Falkner house boys vs Garden House

[lbclbc1212]

My DS is offered a place in these school. We would live near the choosen school so commuting is not an issue.
Any ideas on these school? Do not know which one to choose
Thanks a lot

Do you know any parent at reception in GH?

I have heard since they are not preparing anymore for 8+ a few parents are not happy about the academics , a few with older brothers said there is a big difference with the Oreos ration and the level is definitely lower compared alkready to last year

We don't but I'll ask around.

The early years assessment at 4+ was one of the hardest DS did and back then we were in the room at the same time so we saw it all.

Back then so many children were failing to pass that assessment to the point everyone we knew who applied got rejected and the year before the rumour was there was only 1 enrolled outside the nursery cohort and sibling policy.

It was a super selective pre-prep but if they don't have that luxury anymore I can see how that could change.

@elij thank you very much

Wetherby is intense. You need to want intense academic push for the 7+ or 8+. Nearly daily homework, rankings, tests regularly and lots of parents around you tutoring. Parents are in very close touch with the teachers all jostling for as much help for their sons. It's competitive.

Garden House is more relaxed. It did always used to get good numbers into top schools at 8+. I know the girls side has lots of senior management fairly newly recruited from top academic schools like Kensington Prep and Bute. I don't know so much about the boys side.

Eaton House is more in between. Prepares well and is strong academically but not so intense. It has the distinction between pre-prep and prep. So it doesn't mind you leaving or staying. It can fill spaces as it's also a 7 or 8+ destination. The school has more boundaries as to how much parents can push compared to Wetherby- in a good way!

@plusaumoins i hope you are right about nothing much changing after the headmaster at wetherby leaves. However, from what I am hearing, most of the senior management has also left. I also think Snell had a good connection with SPJ/WUS and his reference carried a huge weight at those schools. Whoever comes in his place will have huge shoes to fill. In such circumstances I would actually go for EH or FH

@Monton81 Parent expectations are sky high, I'm sure Alpha Plus will do all they can to find a suitable replacement.

Mr Snell has been brilliant, his philosophy permeates down to all the staff so hopefully the ethos will remain.

GH is not a feeder to the top London academic day schools and UK boarding schools so you'd need to get outside support sooner rather than later, if these are your target schools. Of course, there's rampant tutoring everywhere but even then other prep schools get a higher percentage of children into these academic schools than GH.

This data is from 2022 but it is relatively the same the past five years.
www.westminster.org.uk/admissions/13-plus-feeder-schools/

GHS only goes to 11 so wouldn't be on that list. I know the WUS numbers for GHS and as a ratio of the cohort to those getting into WUS it's objectively one if the highest.

There are GHS kids in every year when GHS is sending out a dozen at 8+ while EH/Wetherby is sending dozens and dozens over Y2 and Y3 to apply.

If Wetherby/SH were better feeders ratio aside and there was for example a quota suppressing the numbers they would all be top of every year group. They simply aren't it's a healthy mix.

As of 2022 GHS was still a WUS and SH feeder. It might change but that's the case today.

I don't know any Wetherby/SH family who didn't do work outside school to get into one of the top 3 schools.

I'm not sure I follow everything you said, it's confusing. Not sure when you joined WUS but I had several boys there over a period of 10 years and only Wetherby stood out as sending a large contigent of boys, esp last 5 years, never GH. In fact, I don't think we met any GH boy in any of my kids' classes.

I'm sure there are academic boys/familes at GH but it's not widely known as a top feeder like Sussex House or The Hall. It's a fact.

I forgot to mention the Ludgrove exits which have been consistent (only choice for boarding at 8+/11+)

I think it's easier to spot GHS kids if you went there. There was a discussion in WUSPA recently that this year was one of the smallest GHS intakes (1 at 7+ and 1 at 8+). WUS offered 3 to GHS only 2 accepted.

Sorry if my messages come across rude

@elij Garden house's website say in the period from 2017 to 2021 21 boys have gone to Westminster Under. Whereas Wetherby Notting Hill's website says in the past 5 years it has sent 55 boys there. It seems pretty obvious Wetherby is a significantly bigger feeder to Westminster Under than Garden House. Can't argue with the figures!

I try to be as open as possible on here especially around GHS and WUS as these are schools we are close to and sometimes they get an unfair wrap.

Wetherby sends tonnes of pupils through the application process and only a small number get in. As they send so many more than other schools (with EH) that ultimately means more get in (in terms of absolute numbers).

MS1 in GHS is 2 small classes and only about half go into the 8+ process. Last year it was max 14 and only 4 applied to WUS (3 of those got offers)

The first stage last year was in person so it was easy visually to see how well represented Wetherby/EH was verse 4 from GHS.

This year it was online and second phase doesn't appear to have any GHS (a first in about 10 years AFAIK).

Every WUS year since I've been keeping track nearly a decade has at least 1 from GHS. When DS did a tour many years ago of WUS he was shown around by former GHS boys and there were at least 8 of them on that day.

@Mamakins2021 you really have to look at the size of the cohort, Wetherby expanded massively and have 100+ boys per year group (if you count Wetherby Kensington as well). Of course they will send more to any school than a school like Garden House, but the truth is a HUGE number of their cohort actually end up going to Wetherby Prep where they have guaranteed entry.

Any school with 80 - 100 boys per year group could boast about sending 10 kids to WUS or SPJ. It's their marketing model. There is a good reason they don't publish detailed numbers.

@ncsurrey22 GH has around 50 kids per academic year spread in 3/4 classes

In their leavers destination page it is written they feed Eton College / wU/ SP but in the last 6 years years, and it is unclear how many kids sat at the exam, and if it is at 11+ and / or 8+, any at Eaton college and very few at the other considering that they are probably summing up 8+ and 11+ for 5 years, so over around 600 kids, 40 places where accepted at WU and SP.

But I am just guessing, so I so der if there were some parents who went through 11+ at GH and had some feedback

OK so GHS has no ties to Eton, there's a school in between (like SH) so it's best to ignore that (it's like claiming a uni).

From MS2 while we were there the boy's year dropped to under 9 students (this year is the biggest MS2 in its history). Historically those remaining boys weren't focused on London day schools.

Last year's 11+ (6 kids):
A few left the country.
ASL, WCCS, SH, Ludgrove, Wetherby

We won't know GHS competitive exits at 11+ for 3 years as that will be the first through batch (everything before was transitional as most left at 8+).

The only way to read into potential 11+ exits is based on the 8+ (which has been OK) but historical 11+ won't be useful.

2 classes of under 20 per year... Unless you're including the girl's school?

the point is if you are taking a WUS year 3 class of 20 kids, there will usually be 1-2 boys max from any school and maybe 5 from Wetherby, which makes people believe that Wetherby is so good, but they simply have 100 boys doing the 7+. Same at SPJ, I often hear ppl say "there are so many wetherby boys in my son's SPJ class, Wetherby must be so good", but a school like Merlin or GHS getting 2-3 in is equally impressive as Wetherby sending 10 boys. Just keep that in mind.

@ncsurrey22 fully agree with you, basic math… can anyone confirm here is it true that since GHS no longer do8+ the school will be in ones way if one tried? The head of boys told me something along the line there will be no support letters from the school as they actively discourage 8+ is this how it is in reality or just them trying to discourage parents?

I assumed the same but my GH reception DS’s teacher has advised us what we need to work on if we plan to do 7 or 8+, so it doesn’t seem to be the case

Letter doesn't matter, the process at 7+/8+ is objective. Remember all the hot housing schools are doing is building up exam endurance and lowering errors. They're not teaching a secret syllabus.

The only major change with no GHS support is they won't arrange transport of boys to SH (for tours and assessments) as they've become a direct rival. That old relationship with SH made the process so much fun.

Well what hot houses are doing is getting so much practice into the kids that come exam they so to speak fly through it, as they have seen it and done it many times before. And have attained hand. Whereas if your school did not train you to do it at all as it’s not part of curriculum and the parents / tutors were not equally consistently training the kid at home the children will be blatantly disadvantaged when attempting 7/8+, no?
i am having those questions with myself as I am the one who wants her DS to have a childhood (GH better?) but also ideally a school that does 7/8+ (Wetherby better?) so the dreadful 11+ along with the whole country as competition can be avoided.
please share your valued opinions on that topic. And in whether you would bother with 7 and 8 + or just 8+? Thank you

We prefer 8+ to 7+, 7+ feels too early (especially if you're not a winter baby): we do feel 7+ is good preparation and context for 8+ if you want to try a year early even if 8+ is the target trajectory. Schools with both a 7+ and 8+ intake do have good methods to incorporate the new boys.

In GHS missing MS1 (leaving at 7+) means missing out on some of the extras that make it a good experience (graded level music, theatrical productions etc.)

Some schools like Latymer don't have an 8+ entry, you do need to be mindful of prep goals.

In WUS, incumbents do the 11+ (not the 13+ unless going for the Challenge) it's not clear how other schools deal with this (keeping up with senior school entry) but generally the 8+ is the easy part :) There is always an exam around the corner.

Tutoring is ultimately a form of outsourcing, they're pre-prep age children and everyone was a child at some point. You either do homework with family or pay someone else to do it. It's not so much tutoring or nothing (both are technically tutoring).

I feel 7+/8+ are based on curriculum marterial, the 11+ is, 13+ is, GCSEs are, A-levels are. And yet at each of these entry points families will be tutoring (usually as they started doing it from day one and you depend on it forever).

In my opinion get the home environment right, make homework part of the ritual (review and further research around the ideas). Keep on top of the material that is based around the 7+/8+ but approach it in different contexts (outside of a desk with a pencil) like play time or games that have a NVR dimension for example.

There are other ways to build up speed and endurance used in exam conditions (but developed in home life) without every month doing a mock 8+.

There is this idea of the "flipped classroom" where homework is done at school and material is reviewed at home. I feel it succeeds as the homework experience isn't enriching enough and people just try to get it out of the way.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Flipped_classroom

I think what I'm saying is -- track progress, don't make it boring and everything will be fine at exam time. The finding a tutor 6 months before an exam feels very lastminte dot com.

@elij totally agree that getting home environment right is so important as well as making home learning part of routine! Thanks for your tips!! Do you have any good recommendations for games with NVR elements? 🙏🏼