Summer holiday house move and school admission

[Retrievemysanity]

We’ve agreed a sale of our house to buyers who live some distance away and they have 2 primary aged DC. We already own the house we are moving to but it needs some building work doing to it and we’re not in a position to move into it just yet-it’s looking like it will be in the summer holidays when it’ll be ready.

Our buyer has phoned some schools in the area to secure places for September but they told him to phone the LA. The LA have told him they won’t process any application until he has actually moved. They’ve also said they aren’t open in the summer holidays so he’s panicking that they’ll move in august but have no school places for the kids in September. Is this correct and anyone got any bright ideas about what he can do?

He can apply from his current address to his current LA. If there's places they can be allocated.

But technically your LA can't do anything until he lives there.

(Two years ago I had to apply over the summer holidays. One child had a place just over a week after term started. Other started at half term. Then I moved more recently at Easter. Again child A took a week (place allocated on the Friday to start Wednesday). Other child allocated a place on the Tuesday... Also started Wednesday. They canmove very quick if there is space.)

It is correct that it goes through the LA. We are doing the same and were told we could apply as soon as we have a moving date. I am shocked that no-one will be available to process the application over the summer holidays. I would be chasing the council with regards this.

Might it be something to do with the schools themselves being closed in the holidays?

Things do move fast if there’s room in the schools though.
When my DC moved schools mid term, we sent our in-year transfer forms in one Thursday, received a letter offering them a place in the new school the next Thursday, and they were able to start the following Monday.

Thanks for the replies. So @Aroundtheworldin80moves and @80Days what did your children do before starting at the new school? Carry on where they were or home ed?! I don’t think our buyer will be able to keep his children at the current school because it’s too far.

@Themostwonderfultimeoftheyear yes I’m quite shocked! Poor man is getting quite flustered. I’m wondering maybe if we exchange before the hols, they’d do it based on that rather than completion.

I would tell him to call the schools directly to see if there is space in the year groups he is interested in - that will tell him if it is likely to be processed smoothly.
We moved over the summer holidays and were worried about this, but we weren't changing LA so it was more straightforward. We put in the application saying that we planned to move, and since there were spaces in the village school and we were living in the LA we were told by the school we had the places on the basis of the move going ahead.

@Retrievemysanity

what did your children do before starting at the new school? Carry on where they were or home ed?!

We live close enough to the old school for carrying on where the DC were to be possible, although the commuting time / distance was too much for that to be work in the long term.

If the distance had been too great, then yes, we’d have had to home school temporarily. But, as I said, there was less than a week and a half between us posting off our forms and the DC starting at the new school. That’s not a huge length of time.

Plus, we did as JellyMouldJnr suggested and rang around the local schools to check which had spaces in the DC’s year groups first, so we were pretty confident that we’d get a space at the school we’d listed on the form.

It is for the parents moving into the house to organise what they can about school places. Until they actually move into the house they cannot use that address as the address for all admission purposes, though sometimes LAs are slightly more lenient and accept exchange of contract. You need to check this out with the LA concerned to establish firstly what is the actual criteria and secondly who is responsible for "in-year applications" as this is what the two children concerned actually are.
The parent can apply for a place in September from their current address via the local LA but they will be lucky if they apply and the preferred school has available places in the right year groups for their children. They might as well do this as they have nothing to lose by applying. If there are no places available then the parent can make a decision as to whether they should appeal for places at the preferred school. With only about 4 weeks to go till the end of term it is not likely that any appeal will be this side of the summer break. It is correct that most schools / LA do not hold admission appeals in the August break simply because all the people involved will not be available. It is quite likely that the parent could well be in a position that their children will not have a school for the beginning of September but that is the risk of moving in the summer holiday season.

@admission thanks for this, that’s what the buyer has said so I think he is stressing. I feel bad because it’s a delay on our side which is stopping them moving earlier but there’s nothing we can do about that so I’m just trying to think of solutions for him. Hadn’t thought about him applying now via his own LA so yes, that may be a possibility.

Bit random but pp’s have mentioned how quickly it can all happen if there are spaces at the school and I know round here most schools are having 2 inset days before the return for students-don’t suppose you know if the LA would be working then? Just thinking if he got his application in and they dealt with it then, theoretically the kids may be able to start at some point the following week?

They started processing our application the last week of August

Hmm. Our buyers were relocating last year from 4 hours away. Our LA let them apply from their current address, along with a letter from both their & our solicitor with proof of house sale/purchase proceedings. Luckily, our local school had places in the years they needed (councils should give you this information if you ask, I did so for our buyers & got an email with the info within 48 hours).. the LA offered the places provisionally subject to confirmation of the move..

Might be worth a shout? Find out what years they need, ask the council for a list of schools in your area with spaces (my LA sent through every school, spaces or not) & take it from there.. will they accept a letter from solicitors etc explaining the situation?

Yes things can be arranged quite quickly if there is available spaces in the preferred school but as soon as you get to appeals etc that is when the required time frames for the appeals have to be met and it becomes a much more extensive timetable.
I think you need to look how and if there is anyway that you can move out earlier than envisaged. That is something within your sphere to influence and it really does come down to how desperate are you for this house move to happen ASAP. Frankly you cannot directly help your house buyer, that is for them to try and work out they can bring the two dates closer together with anything you can do.

It could be really easy, or he could be home schooling or taking whatever school in the county/LEA has space. Its partly luck with the size of the year group - in my area some year groups are absolutely full (and I don't mean just local school, I mean 6 nearest schools all have waiting lists), other year groups have a lot of space as birth rates are significantly different (weird). However its pretty worrying he is asking you about this and hadn't planned for this to be a problem!

He should definitely check about spaces. I am very laid back as school admissions have confirmed there are spaces in the school and year I want so I assume things will move very quickly once we have a moving date.

Do your buyers have a related sale?

If not, could you agree to complete your sale in day, early July so they can get registered locally but then agree you stay in the property until august? Could you afford to pay a month's rent to them?

We exchanged on our purchase in the July before my dd started reception, we couldn't go on the waiting list until we exchanged for the nearby (oversubscribed school). We only moved a few miles so just had a longer drive to the school she'd been offered based on our previous address, I thought she'd just move schools when a place came up (thinking it would be a few weeks) but she went the whole way through reception year without getting higher than 2nd on the list because kids in a higher priority kept joining the list! We gave up after a year. If we had moved too far to go to the previous school we would have got offered the closest school in the LA with a space (which could still be quite far).

Thanks all.

@admission there’s no way we can move any sooner unfortunately. Both us and the buyers are moving for secondary school application deadlines so as long as it’s by October, that’s good with us but I can see why the buyers want their children to start in September at their new primaries although in my opinion, it’s not the end of the world iyswim.

@HettySunshine no related sale, they are first time buyers. He said a condition of the mortgage is that it’s vacant possession on completion so we can’t do that although, yes that would’ve been a potential option.

@superduster I think his eldest daughter is same age as my youngest and I think that was a relatively low birth rate year. Not sure about his youngest. We are in a highly populated LA but we border others less so and there are loads of schools around here so I hope somewhere will have a place. In fairness, he anticipated being in by end of this month with lots of time to sort out school for September but because of covid, we didn’t do the viewings and I don’t think the agent communicated our circumstances to him.

So, I’ve spoken to a relative of a friend who works in admissions appeals and she said when it’s not a reception or year 7 application, it goes through the school not the LA. So I think he needs to contact the schools now and find out where there are spaces. I must be so naive, never thought it would be this much of a hassle!

We moved over the summer holidays five years ago.

This is what I did -
Phoned school and explained situation , asked if there was currently a space and was told yes.
The wonderful office lady took my details and said she would contact me if anything changed.
Hoped and prayed all would be ok with transaction.
Took DD to look at new school.
Was told we could do no more until exchanged.
Didn't exchange before end of term - contacted school who said to email them as soon as we had news.
Did that as soon as I could head teacher replied in holidays and confirmed place
Filled in LA paperwork at some point once all was confirmed .

It is stressful as none of it is certain until you exchange.
Hope all works out for you and them ok.

My next door neighbours moved in year and didn't get their girls in and ended up driving 7 miles each day to another village ! Not the end of the world but caused a lot of stress at the time.

When we moved the LA could start to look and offer us a school once we exchanged.

It all went through the LA, but the LA had to ring round the schools and do some begging as all the local schools were full for one of my DC’s year group.

Sorry OP, but your friend is not (necessarily) correct. It depends entirely on the LA. In some areas (like ours), all applications other than Year R and 7 are direct to schools. In others, the LA handles all applications. Similarly, some areas will let you apply before you've moved, some seem not to (I'm not sure how this is permissible, as I thought the admissions code said you could legally apply from anywhere, as long as you can take up the place in a couple of weeks, but certainly we've had children move away from our school who haven't been allowed to submit an application until they've physically arrived). Usually you can only use your local address on an application once you have proof of exchange or signed tenancy.

Unfortunately, the speed of the process varies. In our case, we've had a parent apply, be offered and start school in the space of two days, because we can handle the process ourselves. In others, we've had children move from our school to another LA and have to wait weeks or occasionally longer for a place. I think the first thing you or your buyer need to do is to find out whether in year applications are handled by schools or the LA in your area. If the LA, then find out exactly when they'll accept an application for September. If it's the schools, then your buyer should start phoning individual schools now and again asking when they'll accept an application for September, and when they'll accept the local address. (FYI we'll accept September applications from 1st July, but we'll only accept the local address after exchange or signing if tenancy. Someone can apply using their old far-away address, but they'd be unlikely to get an offer as they'd rank so low on our waiting list. If we happened to have a space we'd still offer it though, if they're confident they can take up the place on the 1st of September.) HTH

Similarly, some areas will let you apply before you've moved, some seem not to (I'm not sure how this is permissible, as I thought the admissions code said you could legally apply from anywhere, as long as you can take up the place in a couple of weeks, but certainly we've had children move away from our school who haven't been allowed to submit an application until they've physically arrived)

You can apply from anywhere at any time, but you must do so through the LA where you live. Most parents fail to realise this and attempt to apply through the LA to which they are moving. That LA is entitled to refuse to process an application until the parents have moved, although some will accept an earlier application.

If the LA requires parents to apply direct to schools, the school should accept applications regardless of the current address and allocate a place if there is one available. I suspect some schools get this wrong and follow the LA's rules, not allowing parents to apply until they have moved.

So prh47 I could apply now though my LA and as long as there are spaces in the school on the other side of the country my DS will get a place?

I think that's true (though prh47 will know best), but if your child is not able to physically take up the school place within a pretty short space of time, the offer could be withdrawn again. I think.

Actually prh47 can I check something on the mechanics of this (as I quite often have parents in this situation). If a parent is moving to a different LA and wants to apply for a new school via their current LA before they move, how does that work if the current LA doesn't generally process in year applications? In our LA, the common in year application form has to be returned direct to schools. So how would the parent complete an application for a school out of county via the current LA? Thanks.

Ah thanks, we don't want a place until September

@Themostwonderfultimeoftheyear

So prh47 I could apply now though my LA and as long as there are spaces in the school on the other side of the country my DS will get a place?

Correct, although you will probably lose it if you are unable to take up the place within a few weeks.