In-year primary admissions, HELP!

[FreiasBathtub]

I'm tearing my hair out over this one. We are moving from an inner London to outer London borough and DD, who started Reception this September, needs a new school place.

I have found a school that I like. The school tells me it has a place. No waiting list. I phoned the council to find out how to apply from my current address in advance of the move. No dice, they say. You must wait until you move and have proof that you and your child live at your new address before we will even consider you for a place at the school. Closing statement for our current council tax account at the old house isn't good enough. Nor is confirmation of exchange on the new house. How long will the process take from application, I ask? We are unable to tell you. Ballpark? At least four weeks, and don't listen to the school when they tell you they have a place as they are almost always wrong.

Can this possibly be right? What is my DD supposed to do for school during those four weeks? Are we supposed to commute her an hour each way every day to her old school? We are lucky I suppose in that this is an option - but what if we were moving from Newcastle or Exeter? Are we supposed to rent in our old borough and pay a mortgage in the new one until her place comes up?

I understand that the council needs to ensure parents can't game the system to get into a popular school, but this is crazy. Is it normal or is the new council unusually unhelpful? Does anyone have experience that they can share, or tell me what they did during a similar waiting period? I'm going mad trying to figure it out!

Yes, it was the same for us when we moved countries. They quoted 2 weeks but in reality it was only a week. It just depends how busy they are I guess.

I think it is pretty standard for admissions and you will just have to wait, hopefully not for 4 weeks though.

If they have a place then you should be able to apply and get the place regardless of where you live - you would just have a limited amount of time to take up the place once offered.

We moved from Kent to Northamptonshire and applied through our local council to a school we knew had places while we still lived at our old house - we supplied proof of exchange but even if we hadn’t, if no-one else wanted those places then it’s just up to you to get the child there?

Not sure who you are talking to in the LA but they are wrong. You can apply for a school place from anywhere and if there is a place in the year group without exceeding the published admission number (PAN) then they have to offer you the place.
You need to establish what the admission process is for in-year applications, it could be direct to the school or via the LA., though I accept that the final offer of a place will come through the LA. Ask the school.
I would however send an email this afternoon to the LA stating your current address and requesting the place that you believe is available in year X at Y school, with an expected start date, which should be this side of Christmas.
Not sure what the LA will then do but if nothing else you have registered your knowledge of there being a spare place and the date and time you requested it. If you do not get the place then it is a vital piece of evidence in any admission appeal that you have been disadvantaged by the LA approach.

This doesn't sound right for in year admissions. Last year we were in a similar situation but moving much further away. I applied for a space at the new school and because it was an in year admission and there was a space available they gave us the space even though we were still actually living nearly 100 miles away!

Completely agree with Admission. As there is a place available it must be awarded to anyone who applies regardless of where they live.

I would also think they need to offer you the place if you already live somewhere commutable. When families move from another country, they often need to move first before applying but you’re relatively close by.

In terms of the timescales, it shouldn’t take too long but I have seen parents needing to stay at home with their children for a few weeks in some boroughs that were massively oversubscribed and literally couldn’t find a space anywhere.

You need to be in the country but you don't have to be in a commutable distance from the school. If you live in Carlisle and apply for a place at a school in Penzance they have to give you the place if there is one available.

Thank you all so, so much. I didn't think it could be right but between a v stressful house move, a new job and a suddenly non-sleeping baby I was starting to doubt myself.

It's all a bit late now as we complete on the new house tomorrow. My application is in so I guess now we just have to wait it out. But I will write to the council member for education and children as it seems the school admissions team could do with some fairly fundamental training on their own statutory responsibilities...

My dd1 had a place 3 days after moving, took a month and an appeal for dd2. Its standard procedure not to process the application until you complete

Please take the advice of admission ^ and email the LA...it just covers you for if their mess up means you lose the place (someone else may be moving into the area for example).

When we moved this summer, youngest had a space within two weeks (the application was processed first day of term). Eldest was offered another school which hadn't applied for 10 days later, went there for a week after we were threatened with not being reported for not having a child in education... And then got a place at her sisters school on appeal. She started at the school the week before half term.

Be aware... They don't count school holidays in timescales .. or weekends if they do it in days.

I have an update. It's not a good one. DD has not got a place at the school, despite the school telling me that their reception class is currently 29 pupils and they have a place. She's been offered a place at another school, which was OFSTED 'requires improvement' in 2018. I know enough to know that the rating alone isn't the full picture, but the report is pretty damning in terms of staff turnover and so on.

She's not going there. But I'm at a bit of a loss about what to do now. Back to the local authority, I guess, although they have not been at all helpful to date.

Any advice would be so, so appreciated. I am feeling wretched: I tried so hard to make good decisions for DD and yet have ended up in this rubbish situation. I just want her to go to a decent school, fairly close to our house. Surely that isn't a crazy thing to ask?

Oh, to add - the school is an academy, manages admissions through the local authority but appeals are, I believe, made directly to the school.

I am a reasonably intelligent, well educated person who had a job that touches on schools and education, and I find this whole process incomprehensible. There must be a better way.

Do you feel comfortable saying which Borough? Some are particularly crazy.
I would find out from the most senior person you can get on the phone what grounds they have in rejecting your application to the preferred school? If it were fully allocated, it makes sense to give you the neatest school with places. So the question is why they think there are no places. Perhaps they think there is a child there that the school knows is not.

As they have refused the place they should have told you how to appeal their decision. Appeal. If the school you want genuinely has a place available you will win.

Is there any other school in the area with places that you would be happy with? Have you asked the school you want if there's still places?
The in-year application process can be soul- destroying with being told different things by different people.

Oh no, I was hoping for a good update :(

Definitely appeal. I also wanted to say, dont rely solely on an Ofsted report. The school that 2 of mine go to was 'requires improvement' until recently, but it's actually been a lot better in the last 2 years. It went downhill, but a new head came in and changed things around. The school still struggled for a while because of the poor kids that were playing catch up.

You really do need to visit a school and speak to parents (if you can) to get a better feel of what it's really like.

Oh you're all so kind. I'm honestly tearing up here at work, it's just so difficult. I really feel I'm letting DD down, she's so wonderful and I should be able to give her this little bit of stability at a time of enormous change

I spoke to the school this morning and they are also baffled. As far as they're concerned, there are 29 kids in the class (and have been for some time) and the place is ours if we want it. But the LA say no. The school are going to contact the LA for me, see if they can get anywhere in understanding why the place hasn't been allocated.

I believe I can accept the other place and remain on waiting lists for my preferred schools. theneverendinglaundry I agree about Ofsted, we chose a 'good' school for DD over other 'outstanding' options, because we loved it. But this one is just so disrupted, I don't know. And it's over a mile away, in the wrong direction for our commutes, rather than 200 metres.

FanDabbyFloozy I'll DM you the borough, if you don't mind. Any insight you might have would be amazing!

If the place is free that does sound odd- I know different councils work differently but with our application the council had to contact every school in the area to ask if they had spaces. If someone else had applied for that space, the school would surely know. Hope you get answers soon.

If the school is an academy it is its own admission authority. There is absolutely no way the LA can decide to offer you a place elsewhere if the school says it has a place available and is willing to give it to you. Even if it wasn't an academy, the LA would still have to offer you a place at your preferred school if there is one available.

Get everything in writing - email will do. If you have a telephone conversation with either the school or the LA, send an email afterwards setting out your understanding of the call. If the LA continues to play silly games you may need this as evidence.

Thank you prh47bridge. It's so funny, I've read these threads for years and know that you and admissions know your stuff - and that admissions can be complicated - but I honestly never appreciated the madness that you must have to deal with on a regular basis.

I called the local authority again. They have confirmed that there is no waiting list for Reception for the school I want, and the school have confirmed that there's a place. I asked the LA whether the school being an academy made a difference and they said 'no'. Apparently another offer letter has been sent out, but they can't tell me what's in it or when it will arrive.

I'm going to email all of this right now, as you advise, and then at least I know I've done my best.

Hopefully the new offer letter will be a place at the school you want.

And believe me, you don't know the half of it! The real craziness happens in some of the cases that talk to me via PM. I have long since ceased to be amazed by councils who don't understand the Admissions Code.

Oh. My. God. Yet another twist. I called the school again, and apparently they have this morning had a call from social services. The place may be requested for a child who would fall under a higher admissions category (I'm guessing looked after child or social/emotional need).

Can anyone advise whether: (a) if the new, promised, letter is indeed an offer of a place it can be rescinded because someone with a higher priority now needs it? and (b) if we haven't already been offered a place and it goes to this other child, we can appeal on ICS on the basis that the admissions policy was incorrectly applied in the first instance? My application was received by the LA on Monday 11 November, long before this other child appeared.

I couldn't make this up. Not sure my nerves can take much more of it.

No, an offer cannot be withdrawn just because someone with a higher priority has applied. And yes, if they had your application well before the other child applied and you don't get the place you will have a decent chance of success at appeal on the basis that they should have offered you the place immediately, not messed around offering you another school.