8/9 year olds to know their times tables within 6 seconds

[noblegiraffe]

It has been decided that 6 seconds is the time limit for children to know their tables for the new Y4 times tables check, to ensure that they are recalling them, not working them out.

schoolsweek.co.uk/pupils-will-get-6-seconds-to-complete-times-tables-test-questions/

I think that's reasonable with the caveats that (i) instant recall should be backed by what multiplication means practically and (ii) for some the target of 6 seconds is not reasonable/acheivable.

The test seems to have been dumbed down since the idea was first announced

That's actually quite slow. DD3's school uses TT Rockstars for timestables practice and the kids in DD3's class were answering questions in 1.8-3 seconds when she joined the school. She really had to up her game to her up to speed, and within a few weeks of using TT Rockstars, she was answering questions just as fast.

Regular practice with randomised questions, for the average child, will improve recall and speed. There will always be children who find it more difficult, and they'll need more focused and different approaches, but most kids just need frequent and consistent practice.

Although, I am not keen on the possibility that reporting and recording of these targets could detract further from a more holistic education. I think it would a more useful in-house tool.

It’s a 5 minute online test of 25 questions concentrating on the 6,7,8,9 times table so they’ll probably just be straightforward facts no division.

Does it really make any difference if they do it in 6 seconds or 7 seconds?

What really matters is that they can actually use the knowledge to answer the question, not how fast you can answer, surely?

I am from the country that really do well on PISA. Never experienced limited time to do the times table.

6 seconds is fine in the classroom - it's the response time on ipads/ laptops I'm interested in. Will it take longer than traditional pencil and paper? My guess is yes.

I'm hoping we're accepted on to the pilot.

That's more than 10 seconds per question...

Also: I don't believe that the results are reported in the way SATs results are, more that they are like the phonics screening.

“Year 4 pupils will get six seconds to answer each question in the on-screen test, which should take no more than five minutes to complete, the government said. The time limit on answers is to ensure pupils are recalling the answers, rather than working them out.”

Says the article.

Does it really make any difference if they do it in 6 seconds or 7 seconds

The speed is a proxy for how secure they are in their timestables. The answers should be almost reflex, similar to numbers bonds.
Once you have cracked these then mental maths because so much easier.

I think 6 seconds is a 'long' time for instant recall.

That said, neither of my DDs would have been able to achieve that as both have slow processing and recall issues. When DD1 did the (old) SATs we just wrote off the mental maths test.

What do you think noble ?

By the time they hit secondary, how much of a pain is it if pupils don't have good fast recall of times tables?

Do you find otherwise capable higher set children don't know times tables, or is it just lower set general strugglers?

That's by the end of Year 4 and more than reasonable and achievable for most students.

I don't think this will be new for many schools. DD3's school already does daily times table tests. It's just part of their routine.

Ds2 is in year 3 so will be in the first group to sit the compulsory test in 2020.
He does a lot of times table work including TT Rockstars and he can already recall most of the times tables. School have been preparing for this test since the beginning of year 2 when they first announced it, I bet If he sat the test now he would pass.

Maybe answering 25 questions in 5 minutes is not too bad. But I still think the speed isn't the answer.

I think knowing the meaning of it is more important than how fast you can answer it.

I think the test should be like phonics screen check, not time limited, and not pressured, since I do think most of children can achieve, and those who do, it's no point of giving them extra pressure.

*and those who don't

DD is in Yr4 and does TT Rockstars. She regularly does around 25 questions in 3 minutes and gets them all correct. She's in the top third of her class

"She regularly does around 25 questions in 3 minutes and gets them all correct. She's in the top third of her class"

The thing is my ds was given the programme to do the 50 question in 1 1/2 minutes, or faster, or completing 12 x 12 times table chart within 3 minutes or faster, or something even worth, once he achieved the goal. But what does that make any difference? Especially, if it was on computer, the speed you type makes difference, and if you do written, it will make so much difference how fast you can write.

But they will easily be able to work them out in six seconds...

Yes, of course, if they have no difficulty processing, etc.
Why do they need to time the speed? If they want children to be secure, time isn't a big issue. If they work out instead of instant recall for whatever reason, what's wrong with that?

Because if you don’t know that 78=56 and have to work it out by doing 710-7*2 or whatever, then you’re not going to recognise 56 as being in the 7 times table and struggle to simplify 56/63.

By the time they hit secondary, how much of a pain is it if pupils don't have good fast recall of times tables?

Massive pain. One of the first Y7 topics we do is Highest Common Factor and dear god getting them to list factors of a number is a trial.

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