Sending a child home for wetting or soiling.

[onmykneesandsinking22]

Hi! My ds (5 years old) has an ongoing problem with toileting. Been seen by an OT, nurse, doctor but no real advice so there's not a diagnosed "condition" but he just goes through phases of wetting and soiling daily. He did this at the start of Reception but settled down after half a term, had a two week wobble mid year but has been fine. Until a teacher apparently shouted at the group that my ds was in telling them that asking to go to the toilet was "ridiculous" so he wet himself instead. This seems to have triggered a downward spiral and he's now wetting and soiling daily again. Today he got sent home from school for soiling then wetting. Dp collected him but I'm just wondering if they can keep sending him home for this? I'm panicking really as dp can accommodate this to a certain extent but I really really can't just take off from work, as a one off maybe but not regularly. So, where do I stand? Can they insist that he goes home every time he wets or soils? Thanks!

Teachers are there to TEACH
They are not employed to act as day time parents or nurses for our kids
If a child is ill or has an issue and needs to be looked after then they should be sent to see a school nurse but ultimately the parents should be responsible for making provision to take care of the child and any issues they may have.
I’m not talking about the OP or her son particularly as I don’t know them personally but our teachers are stretched already and are having (in some places) to go above and beyond to provide extra support/care and in some cases to pay(out of their own pocket) for basics like pencils and jotters etc
They can’t be expected to drop everything to attend to a child who needs changing, especially if this is on a regular basis

Schools are not allowed to send a child home for soiling or wetting, unless the soiling is likely to be due to a stomach bug or similar, or the child refuses to be cleaned up/won't get changed.

Statutory Guidance says it is unacceptable to require parents, or otherwise make them feel obliged, to attend school to administer medication or provide medical support to their child, including with toileting issues. (page 19) Even without a diagnosis delayed continence is considered a disability.

You will get staff who refuse to do it, and generally class teachers won't have time/be able to leave their class, but the school has to have someone who will (in my school that's me and another TA, in my daughter's school it's the office staff) you need to get the SENCO to sort out a plan.

Wildling - no one is saying the teacher should stop teaching to change a child.

This is a discrimination issue. If a child, due to a medical condition, is being sent home and missing time in school learning then they are being discriminated against and the school by law needs to make reasonable adjustments.

At my school we have several children with complex medical conditions who require lifting etc. Should we just tell them all to go home or get their parents in??

Do the teachers lift those children? Or are there other staff members to support the kids who need extra help?
I’m not saying we shouldn’t help kids who have genuine need, of course I’m not
But it just seems crazy that, as per what has been mentioned earlier in the thread, in theory an entire class of kids could all be wetting themselves and the teacher would be expected to clean them all up? And that none of the responsibility would ever be on the parents of the children to address the issue?
Obviously that’s an extremely unlikely scenario, I’m
Just trying to illustrate how crazy it seems to me - that the teacher is essentially made responsible for the personal care of the kids during school hours.

My child has toileting accidents because of a medical and SEN issue. She's as entitled to be at school as anyone else. Deal with it. Funnily - the school do, it's random keyboard warriors on the internet who don't.

And that none of the responsibility would ever be on the parents of the children to address the issue?
@Wildlingofthewest
Trust me we are taking as much responsibility as we possibly can!! He has been a very difficult child to get even this far in terms of toilet training but we've worked hard, listened to and implemented expert advice, took him to all his appointments, made charts, given rewards. Anything and everything we could and at home and at night he's great now, no real issues as long as we maintain a solid, consistent routine with him. The only issue is school as this is not an environment we can have much impact on. It's extremely frustrating to read a post that implies that if children have toileting issues it's simply because their parents aren't trying hard enough. Sometimes children just have difficulties in this area and it's not a failure to parent any more than a child who struggles to read, or sleep well for example. Of course a teacher is not expected to take all the responsibility, they are, however, expected to include a wide range of children including those who's difficulties make them slightly more difficult to have in the class for whatever reason.

As I’ve already said - my comments are not about you or your son. I’m talking in general terms about children and teachers.

Also - I’m not a “random keyboard warrior”

Get off your high horse

I’m just curious and genuinely wasn’t aware how much teachers are expected to do

No wonder so many of them leave the profession

Wilding - you may have been curious, but as an observer you come across as judgemental. Many parents whose children are wetting themselves at school are very stressed, both because of this and also because there may be (as yet undiagnosed) SEN issues in play. A bit of compassion wouldn't go amiss

Of course the child shouldn't be sent home for this. That would mean that a child with a medical condition (or any other issue that might make the wet themselves frequently) will miss huge portions of their education. Of course that's unacceptable. Can DS dress himself? If not I would make it a priority to teach him to sort himself out in that situation.

There was a little girl in DS's class who only stopped wetting mid way through Y1 (she was young for the year). No diagnosed condition and it eventually sorted itself out. She certainly was never sent home. She'd always have spare clothes in school and would just wipe herself up and change.

Wildlingofthewest

Of course any teacher who deals with young children will have realised that there will be accidents and children with (possibly as yet undiagnosed SEN or just general settling into school issues) which they'll be expected to deal with. There is no way this will come as a surprise to any teacher. Obviously it would be unreasonable to expect a teacher to potty train your child but t clearly not what has happened.

@PitterPatterOfBigFeet he can dress himself and before we got him clean and dry at home we'd got him to the stage where (if he was at home) he'd quietly slope off and change and out his wet clothes in a basket. Frustratingly the skills he has don't seem to have transferred to school and it's really hard to work out why.

- letting her take her time on the loo and letting her use the iPad in there (to make the loo something that appealed rather than to be avoided)

We started out with my DD doing this as she had been sitting down, saying "I don't need a poo" and getting straight back up again.
Then she went on to sitting down with the iPad for 5 minutes and doing nothing, then when I said "OK time's over" she would need a poo.
(she is also on Movicol).

NOW we are on to "you do a poo and then you can watch the tablet" and she goes and does one straight away at least once a day. Hmm....

We are however not quite there, she's starting in September and school have just said bring spare clothes (they have masses in the classroom anyway) and let us know the right strategies.

I am going to get her checked for a UTI (the continence nurse said this might also be a problem, and currently she has more issues with wee).

he can dress himself and before we got him clean and dry at home we'd got him to the stage where (if he was at home) he'd quietly slope off and change and out his wet clothes in a basket. That's great! Probably better than my 6 year old would manage! It definitely sounds like you should have a meeting with the school to discuss how to support your DS together. Firstly he should absolutely be reassured that he can go to the loo whenever he needs to and secondly maybe there is a better way of handling accidents in school. Obviously at home he knows where the clothes and dirty laundry basket is so it's less scary for him to sort himself out.

For what it's worth when I went on my DS's Y1 trip (and this was at the end of the year) there were still a few kids who were reminded to go to the loo by the teachers obviously because they were likely to have accidents!