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Primary education

Join our Primary Education forum to discuss starting school and helping your child get the most out of it.

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Original poster

What the hell is this?! -Homework yr1-

93 replies

SmellySphinx · 16/01/2017 10:24

Ok it's not hell but what the buggery is all this wiffle waffle??!! Just looking through the homework for my year1 daughter. I've looked on the homework sheet and can't see anything about this

I am referring to the 'words' on the right hand side by the way... I know what you lot are like!!
I mean...pate...yeah, French innit or patè rather. Regardless, what is all this jibber jabber, this flim flam, this fuckery?!?!
I know I can just ask the teacher but I'm at home now and want to know!
Yes, I'm bored :) x

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mrz · 16/01/2017 18:22

Pate is an English word meaning a bald head

user789653241 · 16/01/2017 18:31

Isn't it quite effective way for parents to know if your dc has grasped phonics properly or not? If they can read it phonetically, just forget about it and leave it to school. If not, maybe you should speak to the teacher and find out what's going on/ how to help.

mrz · 16/01/2017 18:43

No it's totally unnecessary and an absolute waste of time that could be spent improving reading.
All the words in those lists contain the same spelling representing the same sound so prove nothing other that the person who made them isn't too sure which words are real and which are pseudo and hasn't realised the check doesn't include words that might confuse because are in other languages.

Practising for the check defeats the purpose.

user789653241 · 16/01/2017 18:51

Yes, I totally agree with you mrz.
But since there are so many inadequate phonics teaching threads these days, I just thought it maybe the first time some parents realise that their dc can't decode. And take appropriate action afterwards.

PassiveAgressiveQueen · 16/01/2017 19:02

Can people really not understand the point of testing that children have actually understood phonics rather than just testing that the kids have learnt words by sight, which is what my daughter does an awful lot.

sirfredfredgeorge · 16/01/2017 19:08

No it's totally unnecessary and an absolute waste of time that could be spent improving reading.

But that applies to any "homework" given in early years surely, yet so many parents expect and seem to require it of their schools.

ellanutella8 · 16/01/2017 19:15

I am confused Mrz. Why is it so wrong? They are practising a_e in a mixture of fake and real words so the children should decode them rather than already know them.

I would not expect children to know of Hades so would read it as /h/ae/d/'s and pate in English is p/ae/t.

Genuine question rather than being arsey. (thought of you when discovering the new ORT books our school has bought into!)

mrz · 16/01/2017 19:21

Why do they need to practise a-e in pseudo words? Answer they don't, it's totally pointless

Pseudo words are used for screening checks to ensure the words used aren't familiar to any of the children (no unfair advantage) and they are actually using decoding skills rather than relying on memory.

mrz · 16/01/2017 19:23

"But that applies to any "homework" given in early years surely, yet so many parents expect and seem to require it of their schools."
If you're asking for /setting homework it should at least serve a purpose.

mrz · 16/01/2017 19:24

", I just thought it maybe the first time some parents realise that their dc can't decode" ask them to read unfamiliar read words

phoenixnix · 16/01/2017 19:37

Yr 1 parent here.

No problem with them doing the screening and I understand the point of alien words.

What I don't agree with however is preparing for the test. It seems to defeat the object of it. We have already had a parents workshop explaining the screening, as well as alien words sent home to look at. Surely it would be better if they just quietly did the screening one day and could really see which children needed the extra support in year 2.

mrz · 16/01/2017 19:44

Couldn't agree more.

user789653241 · 16/01/2017 20:13

Thing is, you can't really prepare for screening check, can they? It's either they can decode or not, isn't it?
(Unless they sent the exact words used in the check?)

I think school like mrz's has nothing to worry about. But there always seems to be teacher commenting how many of their pupils would/did pass, fingers crossed for lower pass mark, etc. Makes me wonder how many teacher out there are actually unsure of children's capabilities.

youngestisapsycho · 17/01/2017 12:34

I'm confused.. how would a Yr1 child know if the word is real or not? They won't know every word in existence.... or am I missing something?

ExplodedCloud · 17/01/2017 12:41

It's a test of how the child uses their phonics skills to read psycho rather than them being asked to identify made up words. Using made up words forces them to use their phonics.

GieryFas · 17/01/2017 12:42

phonixix That's exactly how our school does it. One day in the summer term they come home with a sticker, and when asked about it vaguely say something about special time with their teacher reading some words and some alien names.

They also do a workshop for parents, which is basically an hour's worth of reassurance that we don't need to do anything, and ideally not even mention it to the children. I have to say, I really like it as a concept. My dds learnt to read quickly and easily, and I think they were in danger of just memorising words. This means they can't get away with that, which has to be a good thing for when they meet unknown words and for their spelling.

Mollyringworm · 17/01/2017 12:43

Sade - isn't that where the word sadistic comes from?!

MrsGWay · 17/01/2017 12:47

DD1 was in the first year of this test, her class did really badly as they had been taught by mixed methods. Most of her reading books had been look and say. DD2's class did a lot better but the school resorted to spending lots of time before the test preparing for it. I am not sure which of my DDs' classes actually has the more realistic results.

Purplebluebird · 17/01/2017 12:47

This makes me angry. I might not have anything I should say, due to my background, but I am from a different country, and this would make me very confused. I never assume that I know all the words in a second language, and I would as an adult struggle with this, despite my university education and what not! My son has English as second language too, and these made up words are a bit of a trick I think. Pfff.

BarbInTheUpsideDown · 17/01/2017 12:49

This sort of thing drove me absolutely barmy when DD1 was in Year 1. Homework sheets where they had to sort lists of words into 'real' or 'nonsense' words (and one was a 'real' but uncommon word - like pate - that a child would have no chance of knowing. Can't remember what the actual word was, now).

Or one where they had something like 'peach' and 'peech' and were asked to mark which was the nonsense word.

DD1 passed her phonics test, but no thanks to this sort of rubbish. Not sure anything will have improved for DD2, who's currently in reception. They've still got nothing but look and say books for home reading.

MrsFrisbyMouse · 17/01/2017 12:52

My daughter 'failed' every phonics test she took. This stopped her being in the 'top' group for English in Year 2...

Luckily, I wasn't worried - because I know that 'reading' is a much wider skill set than is captured by Key Stage 1 - and that building up her vocabulary and her ability to infer meaning from context was going to be better for her in the long term, and by the end of Key Stage 2 she was flying.

My son, who has various language issues, will probably pass his phonics test. But that's because he has no concept of meaning and a limited vocabulary, so to him lots of words are 'alien' and he just follows the patterns and says what he sees. But he has little real understanding of the underpinning of language.

anonymice · 17/01/2017 12:53

pate is a real word anyway. It's an obsolete word for the head. Gah.

SantasLittleMonkeyButler · 17/01/2017 12:55

I've got a DD in Yr 1 also.

Stupid is what this is. Stupid. Just another way to confuse 5 year olds.

user789653241 · 17/01/2017 12:57

Purplebluebird, I am foreign too and don't have big English vocabulary, but I see no problem with made up words.

They just need to read it phonetically correct way. For yr1 child, most words are new anyway.
If they ask the yr1 child to identify real/made up words, they are doing something wrong.

Pranma · 17/01/2017 13:16

My dgs who was an excellent reader refused to read 'strom ' in his phonics test. He actually said to the teacher,"This isn't a made up word it is a spelling mistake. It should be storm." His teacher said,"How would you say that word though?" He replied," I would say storm because that's what it is meant to be."
Obviously and correctly it was marked wrong! He said all the other made up words as they were written because they didn't appear to be 'mistakes'.

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