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Non decodable books in reception

234 replies

Sleeperandthespindle · 23/09/2016 19:38

My DS was so excited to bring home his first book with words today - then disheartened to find he couldn't read it. He is doing well with blending with the phonemes and graphemes he knows, but of course hasn't been taught 'pp', 'er' and 'wh' yet.
Is it worth mentioning this to school? They must know that it's utterly pointless sending home such books? There's a printed page at the front of the reading record that mentions 'looking for clues' and 'encourage to guess'...

OP posts:
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Feenie · 24/09/2016 13:39

Through must be a challenge for them then.

Not really - as I said before, they just know that is an alternative spelling for /oo/.

Vocabulary acquisition is taught alongside any reading strategy, of course it is.

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 13:39

I'm persuaded by the findings of Australia's National Inquiry into the Teaching of Literacy, which emphasises the importance of teaching systematic, explicit phonics within an integrated approach. Which actually sounds like what some of the teachers here are advocating but for some reason it's heresy to suggest it's not purely phonics. Which in turn can come across as a little absolutist and didactic on the subject, which in turn will concern some parents. But again, only matters if you see parents as partners in this stuff.

The executive summary states, "The evidence is clear ... that direct systematic instruction in phonics during the early years of schooling is an essential foundation for teaching children to read. Findings from the research evidence indicate that all students learn best when teachers adopt an integrated approach to reading that explicitly teaches phonemic awareness, phonics, fluency, vocabulary knowledge and comprehension." The Inquiry Committee also states that the apparent dichotomy between phonics and the whole-Language approach to teaching "is false". However, it goes on to say "It was clear, however, that systematic phonics instruction is critical if children are to be taught to read well, whether or not they experience reading difficulties."

In the executive summary it goes on to say the following:

"Overall we conclude that the synthetic phonics approach, as part of the reading curriculum, is more effective than the analytic phonics approach, even when it is supplemented with phonemic awareness training. It also led boys to reading words significantly better than girls, and there was a trend towards better spelling and reading comprehension. There is evidence that synthetic phonics is best taught at the beginning of Primary 1, as even by the end of the second year at school the children in the early synthetic phonics programme had better spelling ability, and the girls had significantly better reading ability."

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 13:44

Why wouldn't they be?

If they were taught by an advocate of the idea that phonics is the only strategy required for teaching reading, or that any word can be 'decoded' accurately using phonics alone and no other skills.

Feenie · 24/09/2016 13:47

Jessy, you won't find any phonics advocate arguing with anything in that report. Vocabulary acquisition, enjoyment of reading and comprehension are taught alongside any reading strategy, whether it's phonics or whole language.

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 13:50

Google has shown me a fair few, but I'm glad to hear that's not the approach generally taken in the UK. With a child starting primary it has been a concern.

mrz · 24/09/2016 13:52

Since spoken words are represented visually by written symbols we call letters they can be decoded accurately using phonics

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 13:54

Since spoken words are represented visually by written symbols we call letters they can be decoded accurately using phonics

Seriously? With no other skills to decide which of four different sounds represented by a single combination of letters is the correct one?

Yes, you are exactly the sort of teacher I worry about.

Feenie · 24/09/2016 13:58

Yes, those teachers who have taught whole classes of children to read successfully sure are scary!

mrz · 24/09/2016 14:00

"Findings from the research evidence indicate that all students learn best when teachers adopt an integrated approach to reading that explicitly teaches phonemic awareness, phonics, fluency, vocabulary knowledge and comprehension"

Or as Rose said

Non decodable books in reception
mrz · 24/09/2016 14:01

I worry about those who think guessing is a good reading strategy

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 14:03

Do you think I'm one of those, mrz?

Feenie - as an immigrant from a country with higher literacy rates among 16-24s, I have concerns and particularly that the balance is too much on phonics and not enough on comprehension, exemplified by things like the phonics check.

Feenie · 24/09/2016 14:03

If they were taught by an advocate of the idea that phonics is the only strategy required for teaching reading, or that any word can be 'decoded' accurately using phonics alone and no other skills.

It's the only strategy required for decoding - teaching reading involves other skills such as comprehension, vocabulary acquisition, etc but - again - those skills are taught alongside any reading strategy. But guessing is just guessing.

Sleeperandthespindle · 24/09/2016 14:05

My dyslexic DD has been failed by teachers who believed in guessing, skipping and predicting as reading strategies and led her to think that phonics was a last, rather than a first, resort.

DS does not have the same difficulties but there will be other children in his class who do.

OP posts:
MaryTheCanary · 24/09/2016 14:06

" It's a vey successful independent school known locally for their a high % of children leaving the school with academic scholarships."

Yes, I've seen schools like that many, many times.

The thing about independent schools is that they have, pretty much by definition, highly educated and education-aware families using them. So they can get decent results no matter what their teaching is like--because the parents are busily working away at home, filling in all the gaps and teaching stuff that the school is not teaching.

OP, the books your school is sending home sound grim. Just ignore them, and get yourself some decodeable books--I like "Read Write Inc" ones, or there is a long list here.
www.spelfabet.com.au/phonics-resources/07-decodable-books/

kesstrel · 24/09/2016 14:06

Must say, I found it amusing that someone who extols her own reading ability despite her lack of phonics, would consistently read Mrz as as Mrs....that's where a look-and-guess reading approach can get you, and many children mis-identify far more important words....

mrz · 24/09/2016 14:06

Are you a teacher Jassy?

Feenie · 24/09/2016 14:07

Feenie - as an immigrant from a country with higher literacy rates among 16-24s, I have concerns and particularly that the balance is too much on phonics and not enough on comprehension, exemplified by things like the phonics check.

The phonics check is a check that tests decoding only. A school who failed to teach comprehension would be hard to imagine, but would be just that - a school who didn't teach comprehension properly. It wouldn't be because they taught phonics. It's a bizarre concern with no basis in fact.

MaryTheCanary · 24/09/2016 14:08

"For the reason I just said. Some words are not decodable for early readers as they haven't been taught (rightly so) alternative pronounciations for every phoneme."

What on earth does "alternative pronunciations for every phoneme" mean? A phoneme is a unit of sound. Do you mean "alternative pronunciations for allographs"?

An allograph STANDS FOR a phoneme.

OP, sounds like you have your head screwed on. Stick to your guns. Ignore the school's books. And get yourself some decidable ones :)

MaryTheCanary · 24/09/2016 14:10

DECODABLE. Damn autocorrect.

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 14:10

I've already said I'm not. More accurately I've never been a classroom teacher.

Obviously this disqualifies me from reading comparative academic studies, questioning what the optimum teaching methods might be based on those studies, or suggesting that the approach of some teachers in describing their approach may be alienating to parents who would otherwise be generally supportive of the approach they are taking (which has been my point all along).

Have I captured your position correctly?

Feenie · 24/09/2016 14:11

The thing about independent schools is that they have, pretty much by definition, highly educated and education-aware families using them. So they can get decent results no matter what their teaching is like--because the parents are busily working away at home, filling in all the gaps and teaching stuff that the school is not teaching.

Yes! I did some consultancy work for a top local independent school - what they didn't know about teaching reading was scary. What they did have was interested parents and approximately one adult to every five children though.

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 14:13

The phonics check is a check that tests decoding only. A school who failed to teach comprehension would be hard to imagine, but would be just that - a school who didn't teach comprehension properly. It wouldn't be because they taught phonics. It's a bizarre concern with no basis in fact.

Great, but will you accept that there are different approaches to the teaching of phonics, some of which are more successful than others, and that all most parents have to go on is the way teachers describe what they do and externalities like the phonics check? And that it's ok to have questions and concerns given our literacy rates in this country?

Feenie · 24/09/2016 14:14

Obviously this disqualifies me from reading comparative academic studies, questioning what the optimum teaching methods might be based on those studies, or suggesting that the approach of some teachers in describing their approach may be alienating to parents who would otherwise be generally supportive of the approach they are taking (which has been my point all along).

Everyone here us debating all those things with you. Why would you think you are disqualified from having an opinion? Confused

mrz · 24/09/2016 14:14

Do you think I'm one of those, mrz

Then the question doesn't make sense

JassyRadlett · 24/09/2016 14:15

Mrz's entire tone throughout the thread and the 'are you a teacher' with no context.

I've encountered teachers who see parents as an inconvenience in the past, including when I was working in schools.

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