If primary schools didn't have SAT tests --

[flack]

-- how would I know how my child was doing, academically, in an quantitative way, compared to other children, nationally?

Because I would quite like to have that information.

Is that a bad thing?

Could parents just have SAT results without them being published in League tables, maybe?

the teacher would tell you

because a teacher is a professional

and SATS tell you nothing about your child's abilities .. they tell you how much emphasis the school is placing on learning how to sit SATS with a slight leaning based on your child's ability to answer the questions set on that particular day

continuous assessment tells you far more about your child's abilities than a one-off exam .. that some schools cheat at anyway

SATS are meaningless. Children are 'taught to the test', - they can pass an exam, but that's not real learning.

To find out how your child is doing, spend time with them. Read with them, go shopping and see how they manage with adding up, do their homework with them. Ask them to write thank you cards, a menu for a lunch party, keep a scrap book of days out and ask them to write an account of their trips they can decorate and illustrate it, too. Take them to a museum - are they interested? Go on a nature walk. Go swimming or play football.

The bottom line is that we parents are responsible for our childrens' education. Schools just play a part in that.

I agree with Twiglett (well, I would wouldn't I, being a teacher...)

My teachers tested me regularly. They used their professional experience and judgement to advice my parents on my education. Their predictions regarding O and A level performance were spot on. They didn't need the SATs to do it.

Advice? What am I on about?

But do SATs give you that info? You may have a mark for your dc but will you know what all children nationally did? If you child gets a 4 then that tells you that they've met the government target, but don't you need to know how many children got a 5, or less than a 4 for it to be in any way a meaningful comparison?

I agree that SATS per se aren't the best way to assess, but I guess it depends on what sort of assessment your dc will have later in terms of GCSE and A level.

I'm not impressed with the "because a teacher is a professional".
Sadly, like all other professionals teachers do not always tell the truth. Know this from first hand experience.

If the teachers are doing a good job then they are a waste of time, but they don't always do that.

Also parents often hear what they want to hear.

SATS are far from perfect, and yes there is a problem with schools trying to get good numbers.

I'd be happy to see SATS replaced by something better, but abolishing them feels too much like pandering to the teaching unions.

We dont have SATS here and i know how well/bad my dd is doing without them

Quite- no SATs in Scotland and I can't say I've ever thought how nice/useful it would be to have them. Quite the reverse.

I'd be ecstatic to see SATs abolished

I'd be ecstatic to see most of the bureaucracy this 'education, education, education' (my arse) government has brought in abolished tbh

Private schools often don't have SATS. My children haven't done them at 4 different private schools. But they have very regular and useful school exams. You certainly like to know how your child is doing through one means or another.

My dd doesn't do SATS either. In fact I chose the school partly on that basis.

I'm not overly bothered to be honest how she compares to x in Southampton or wherever. What concerns me more is the factshe is getting a broad education, is developing at her own rate and gets many creative opportunities.

Time enough for exams later.

They are too broad a brush DC. They don't tellyou anything you couldn't work out for yourself really. A Science level 5 looks better than a level 4 coming into year 7, but the difference between a highly coached level 5 and an uncoached level 4 may be tiny. The child with a level 4 may well be the better scientist. There is not enough discrimination.

I'm with you Twig.

We managed without them before and could do again. And before SATs children were taught what they needed to know and not taught just what they neede to pass the blimmin test.

So what do we replace them with ?

Nothing.

Reports. End of year school tests.

There are still exams at 16, 17, 18.

Why do we need them at 11, 14 as well?

So what do we replace them with ?

So what do we replace them with ?

Are you drifting off into a dream, dominiconnor?

I think the answer was 'nothing'. I take it you don't like that answer???

Is there an echo in here?

Nothing except maybe good old teacher assessment.

Agree with many of the other posters who believe SATs are a meaningless charade that tell you very little about your child's progress.
We also chose to go independent to dodge the last gasp of the SATs at 7, a real anti-child abomination IMO.
I don't think it is a bad thing to want to know - I am also curious, but I am working on suppressing that urge because I know ds and dd are happy and learning stuff .
The only glimmer of hope I see in the league tables is the value added aspect, where you can see how much a school is helping its pupils perform beyond their supposed capabilities.

Oooops didn't see this thread

Ignore mine then.

I agree that SATS are a waste of time - think how much more they could learn in Yr 2 and 6 if they do not waste all that time doing practice papers and revising for the test. i did end of year exams every year and tests in most subjects on a regular basis. My parents knew how i was doing.

These days even GCSE's and A lvels are getting a joke - too many teachers can 'help' students at coursework, and the one size fits all exam does nobody any favours. I am already seriously considereing moving the dcs to a school that does the international primamry curriculum (if I can find one) and the international baccaulreate (sp!)

i will withdraw my dcs for SATS week anyway as i do not agree with them

I thought SAT results gave the national average scores on it, in each subject. Not just a target score.

Teachers are deliberately vague in parent reports (parent evenings) about child's ability compared to others. I thought this vagueness was policy. In primary, did they actually used to give parents the results of their own assessments, a final mark at end of each year, with results for other children for comparison?

Am very involved with DS education, parent volunteer in his class, etc. So I ought to know where he is ability-wise according to what you're saying, but I don't. Would guess he's about 50%tile for literacy, and maybe 70%tile for maths, but just my wooly feelings, could be quite wrong on both. Don't feel like I can support him correctly without knowing where he really is, or assess how well his teachers are doing (given what the other children are like, too).

My DD is in year 6. They're working really hard towards the SATS already. The kids seem to be under pressure. They've got revision books to study, are tested on what they've been asked to study, and if they don't know the answers they're kept in at break. They've been doing science all week and DD is heartily sick of it now. She's under the weather, has had bad headaches, exhaustion. I've kept her at home today, she's not well enough for school anyway, and a day's rest should do her good. She even snuggled down in my bed this morning with her revision book. I told her to leave it and get some rest.