If primary schools didn't have SAT tests --

[flack]

-- how would I know how my child was doing, academically, in an quantitative way, compared to other children, nationally?

Because I would quite like to have that information.

Is that a bad thing?

Could parents just have SAT results without them being published in League tables, maybe?

if I could affrod it I would go privately just to avoid SATS

hate them

Me too, enid. And the bloody curriculum too. Am in hope that as dd1 is only in reception they will have gone by the time she is due to take them.

I think flack they just want to assess that individual child but some will give the class position if you ask them and some offer it. I think most parents want tho know if their child is getting the best marks in class in spelling tests or the worst or in the middle. Children usually know anyway. They have an instinct to root that sort of thing out.

mummypenguin

flack, do they really have centile charts for children's education???? That's mad!!!!!

Many primary teachers won't give a position in the class for a certain subject because it's virtually impossible! For instance - in maths the children are taught a whole variety of skills - the four number operations, data handling, fractions, shape etc etc, so a child may be great at number work but not so hot at data handling or vice versa. Likewise for science, there are some topics that are very hands on, some that are very knowledge based. To give a position you would need to break down each subject area into it's various parts and then place the child. I would imagine that like me, most primary teachers want to get the best out of each child and are not concerned with whether they are 50th %tile or 90th%tile. The teacher will tell you how well your child is doing, the SATs don't add anything to that information. I think all I'll want to know for my DS when he hits school age is whether he's reaching his full potential or not and knickers to how everyone else in the class is doing!

Sorry, nearlythree, SATs will never go. The government don't appear to trust teacher assessment alone so they will always need a way to prove how wonderful their education policies are .

Okay, so the dcs won't go in that week. Although it sounds like they will have to put up with a lot of s**t beforehand. :-((

I agree with DominiConnor. I see SATs as a counterbalance to the institutional sogginess of primary schools. While they're not great for the higher achievers, they do give schools a powerful incentive to get all the children through the basics and not just write off those whose parents don't spend hours educating their children at home.

Institutional sogginess! SATs don't give teachers any incentive, they give heads and other paper pushers associated with education an incentive to churn out children whose education is being limited imo. I've yet to meet a teacher who writes off a child just because they're not going to do well in SATs. Primary school education should be rounded and help children explore their strengths and weaknesses. It saddens me that all the time the curriculum at this age is being narrowed, or slanted in the favour of 3 subjects that are not every child's strength. Also, many children will do well in SATs regardless of parental support - and some do worse because of it!

My DS1 did the Year 6 SATs last year. He didn't have any problems, but many others in his class did, at least initially. I was shocked at the time, as the standard expected by the test papers he brought home didn't seem desperately high. When the test came, a healthy proportion of the class met the standard - which was just as well, as anyone not reaching that standard would surely have started secondary school at quite a disadvantage. The children were put under pressure, as MummyPenguin describes, and it wasn't nice for them, but I believe it was better than leaving them in ignorance and letting them suffer the consequences later on. Ideally, of course, the school would have made sure the children were on track earlier on, and the last minute pressure could then have been avoided.

nearlythree, I agree with your assessment of the role of parents in education now, but thirty years ago it would not have been assumed that parents had such a major responsibility for their children's education. I believe that shift in attitudes has had serious consequences for equality of opportunity - what about children whose parents can't read?

Isn't the adult functional illiteracy rate something like 60%? Something shocking, anyway.

Ad a teacher who has taught year 6 for many many years, I agree SATs should go. Not to make my life easier (has been implied) but for the benefit of the children. I have been heavily involved in SATs to the point of trying to organise 180 plus children and the bureaucracy of adminstering the tests. Waste of time.

And I do object to the ntion that teachers 'write off' children who don;t have the basics. I really do. SAts do nothing - in fact, if you were to argue in that vein, children with such weaknesses may even be 'written off' more when SATs are here as they will not get a level 4 or above.....something to think about