Forest school for some but not all.

[PurpleElla]

My daughter is in reception. It has come to light (via other parents not any communication from the school) that 10 children from across reception year have been chosen to do six weeks (one afternoon a week) of forest school. The children have been chosen apparently because the school feels these children will benefit most from these sessions. I spoke to the head about this, as I feel that a) a brilliant opportunity is being denied to 50 children from this year group and b) the school should have let all parents know this was happening and why.

Just gauging opinions really. Can the school run this for some children based on what seems like basically a fairly vague assessment of need (no SEN or pupil premium involved as far as I can tell.

I'm sorry if you received less than helpful responses... For what its worth I would be unimpressed by this selection of 10, for whatever reason, to attend forest school. Surely if its beneficial everyone should benefit?

I have a similar issue with our school. DC1 is in Yr1 and last term there were 3 sports events, none of which DC1 was involved in. The school said it was because they want to make sports more competitive and only take the 'team'. DC1 is 5. How will you get in the team if you don't get much chance to play (1 hour per week and when these 'events' are on the rest of the class miss PE as the PE teacher is busy with the event)?? This kind of selection of children at such an early age whether it be for forest school / PE doesn't impress me. I have asked the school and don't really get a straight answer. Our school takes about 24 kids to forest school every week (the whole reception class).

I believe you should be able to ask the school a straight question and get a straight answer and if other people struggle with this then that is their problem. If the school see this as you not trusting them so be it.. The days of 'trust me, I am a Dr, teacher, large corporation' are now long gone. If its funding then perhaps join the PTA and see if you can a) increase fundraising and b) direct more towards forest school?

I don't think you can use the argument that if it is beneficial for one it will be beneficial for all. Different children have different levels of needs and any good school will be aware of that and do things to meet those needs even if it does seem "unfair" to those not involved. You can't compare a sports team to an intervention group.

Sorry but why should

Sorry but why should

Arrg hit enter by mistake..

No I dont buy all this forest school only for the few story. What child would not benefit from forest school?? This is reception where children are meant to be learning through play so why not forest school? If forest school has such select benefit why does my DC's school take everyone? I think its patronising to tell people that the school / teacher know best and parents should shut up or shift out.

I don't see why you cant compare sports to an intervention group? Surely everyone has strengths and weaknesses and again everyone will benefit from more sport (greater self esteem, good habits for life, team building etc etc) as much as forest school. Again patronising...

Well to against the grain - we had similar in our school. Not quite the same but near enough and many parents did ask how selection had been made.

The result was that the school re-thought how the selection had been made and all the children got the chance to do the activities.

However this wasn't a state school so no issues of pupil premium etc. I don't see the harm in asking the question though.

So if the school can't offer something to everyone then nobody should have it? And you see that as fair?

Not every child can do everything, not everything will benefit every child in the same way. Schools must use the resources available in the best possible way.

If the op can help the school bring something similar into school for more pupils that's great. Doesn't mean they are wrong with their current approach though.

What child would not benefit from forest school??

Kids with allergies to grass/oak
Kids who scream as soon as they get wet/muddy/dirty
Kids who hate being outdoors
Kids with Reynard's disease
Kids that are 'runners'

^ all children who were removed from Forest School at the request of their parents.

Oh and OP, I think that is a very good outcome and I hope the HT has been able to set your mind to rest.

Nothing to miss out on.

Forest School is crap, honest. They spend 10 minutes getting their safety gear on/off. They can only move around a very limited space when out there. They mustn't pick up sticks bigger than their own fingers. So many safety rules told to them, it squashes creativity. Nettles, mushrooms all cleared from site just in case (or else the kids told not to touch strange leaves, more rules). Hence nothing alive to be found & the staff would worry about insect bits if any creature was astir. Serious worries about not getting mud back indoors.

Just take them for a woodland walk yourself!!

My son was one of 6 children (out of 90 in Reception) initially selected for forest school - a girl and boy from each class. We were told this was to help his confidence. His gross and fine motor skills weren't that strong and I would say he lacked physical confidence in trying new things. I don't know if anyone questioned it. Anyway more children got there turn later and the opportunity has continued into Year 1. One girl (at least) has done more than one term and I know my son would have loved to do more as he really enjoyed it, but I understand that others may benefit more.

I think schools should just be transparent with these things and say we only have £X for forest school and hence we can only take Y children and in discussion with the reception class teacher we have decided the best use of these sessions is bla bla bla. They could also say to take the whole class once / once a month etc would cost Y, if the PTA can fund raise this we can take everyone. Then everyone knows where they stand?

Unless your child has a health reason why it cannot go outdoors / go near grass etc you need to be pretty wet to take your child out of forest school. I think its a pretty sad reflection of our society if we dont encourage our kids to get muddy etc. At DC's forest school the kids are allowed to run around in a wood wielding sticks of any length so long as they are not hitting one another with them ;-). If the forest school is not much fun then its not being run right? DC has had major maxillofacial surgery but we still encourage running about (with or without sticks).

There is also what do you say to your own kid that did not get chosen? I totally see that not everyone can do everything and some get to do things for reasons not disclosed to parents for very good reasons! But you as a parent have to dodge the questions and I for one have no idea, why some in my kids class gets to do really fun things sometimes like go to an amusement park. Even if I did suspect that there is something to do with special educational needs, that is not something I can tell my son. So what do you say to your DC when this happens and they don't get to go? Not a big issue really, I just said I didn't know and he never asked again but I really don't see a problem with OP asking the question

It can be anything from special educational needs, pupils premium, child protection, mental health, young carers, bereavement ...etc etc none of which the school will disclose to parents. I imagine the parents of the children involved would be unhappy if the head discussed their private circumstances with other parents.

Our forest school involves den building, problem solving, cooking over an open fire, nature hunts, blackberrying, building insect hotels, nature art (Andy Gokdswirthy style) definitely nothing like lljkk describes. Generally it's run by school teachers (we all had forest school training) or by a company who provide bush craft/survival activities, so whole classes attend.

Do yours not spend ages putting on full body protective gear in case of lyme disease?

Ours can't pick up sticks bigger than their fingers so dens wouldn't be possible.

Blackberries: might prick a finger on thorns. Or accidentally eat an insect.

How did your school afford to get everyone trained up??? I am pretty sure ours only 1 x TA is trained to do forest school. If she's ill, it's cancelled. Big school.

Open fire... ha!!!

The school I teach in has forest school. Every child gets a minimum of 8 weeks there. They do all sorts and there are definitely fires and sticks (and axes and knives and all sorts)...
One lady comes in to do it, but we are a small school.

No lljkk they pull on waterproof dungarees and wellies if it's a wet or muddy day or come in old clothes if not topped with a waterproof jacket ... Less than five minutes for a day outdoors.

So no nettle soup or worm omelette? even three year olds happily drag logs around. They are taught to use tools and how to light fires safely.
We are a single form entry school and I seem to remember that we applied for a grant that covered the cost of training as outdoor education was our priority a few years ago.

All of Reception and all of year 1 do Forest School at our primary [2 form entry].
Not all on same day though! Trees are climbed, dens are made, worms and wood louse found and picked up etc. Trained Forest School TA at each session, plus teacher and volunteer parents.
Other parents complain not available for all year groups.
Just wet weather gear and wellies here too....
Out when wet, snowing, whatever...
Opting out strongly discouraged.