Very bright but won't write - should we worry? DD is 6

[pippilongsuffering]

DD is 6 and in year 1. She is very bright (taught herself to read at 3 blah blah), has the most phenomenal vocabulary and a fantastic imagination but hates writing and refuses to do it. She is doing no work at school on this basis. She gets the top level homework, but getting her to do it is like pulling teeth. She produces very very little written work in the classroom and spends most of the time staring off into space. Her excuse is that she doesn’t like writing, or that the work is too hard. She says she should just be able to tell the teacher the answer.

I also regularly get told by her friends that “oh DD doesn’t ever do any work at school”. (I might mind this particularly today as she didn’t make the Mother’s Day card the rest of the class made because she ‘needed a nap’). She has just started going to Rainbows which she loves, and interestingly participates in all the activities there and comes home buzzing with excitement.

She has been on the SENCo radar at school since she started in the nursery there and has seen the EP on several occasions. They were first involved because of her failure to socialise. This is now starting to improve and she has several friends and there no longer seems to be concern over this. The concern is now her failure to do any work. The EP has said that she is simply very very bright and very very bored and disengaged with the work presented to her and that by the time she gets to Year 2 or 3 she will naturally become more interested as the teachers will be teaching her more things she doesn’t know. The EP says no one is to worry until then, even if her report says everything is ‘emerging’ rather than ‘exceeding’ and that they can teach her everything she needs to know in year 1 in a week if they have to.

I can sort of accept this, but am increasingly worried about the lack of physical writing practice she is getting and whether I should do anything about this. Also we don’t know whether to take a punt on it and hope it works out or whether we should move her to a different kind of school where she could work more to her own interests. There is a Montessori school near us which is lovely and a possibility, but part of us is reluctant to move her now she is settled socially.

She doesn’t seem to mind going to school. At home she is generally lively and funny, definitely quirky and unbelievably stubborn (beyond a normal level of stubbornness). It is difficult to argue with her as she is usually right, and wise in many ways beyond her years. She does come across as socially immature though, though, as I say, improving. She reads and understands books at about a year 5 or 6 level, but as she won’t write it is very difficult for her teacher to give her appropriate extension work.

Has anyone been in a similar situation and come out the other side? Or going through it now? Or have any useful advice on how to deal with the frustration of seeing your child refuse to jump through the hoops and appear to underperform as a result? (perhaps latter most difficult!)

Do you think it might be perfectionism? That she knows that if she tries it won't be good enough in her own eyes? My Y1 DS's teacher picked up on this trait in him, that we hadn't really registered, but in hindsight it could explain several of his quirks back to babyhood.

Hi, yes I do think this is the problem, or at least part of it. I think if she is asked to do something like write a short story about x, and given 5 lines to do it on, she struggles with both the fact that she could tell you a very long and quite fantastic story about x, but that she physically can't get down what she wants to say and therefore doesn't try at all. We have started swimming as something she has to learn she has to practice before she can do it, to try and make her understand she won't wake up one morning and be able to write perfectly, also hoping to start music lessons for same reason. Limited crossover benefits so far!

Ps did your ds's teacher have any good strategies for overcoming it?

I'm very surprised at the EP's advice. I would have thought it would be their aim to support the school to find ways to engage your DD, not just say- oh she's too good for your lessons, just leave her alone.

Do you suspect other underlying issues? Maybe a trip to your GP with a full history would be in order?

I would say that it's unusual for a Year 1 child to have a nap. Does she normally still have a nap in the afternoon at home, or is it just at school?

So, maybe she could record her story by talking into an ipad and then write it down in chunks by listening back to it. Or type it up if the physical act of handwriting is a problem?

But not just be allowed to sit there!

Can she tell the story in the same way as she would be asked to write it? For example, does she use openers, connectives and adjectives in each sentence?

DS is also 6 and sounds just like your DD. Loves school, taught himself to read early, massive vocabulary but hates writing with a passion. He gets homework every week where he has to write 2 sentences and it takes days to get him to do it.

His teachers are not overly concerned at the moment, he does go to a writing group once a week to practice with big fat pencils. Any extension work he will complete as a presentation rather than forcing him to write and they think the more they push, the more he will dig his heels in (also bloody stubborn!)

I also make sure there is always pen/paper where he can get it, and very occasionally he will write me a line or 2 but I'm just trying to chill out about it for now.

How are her fine motor skills otherwise? For example does she hold cutlery properly and use them effectively?

Will she participate in other activities that will help develop her fine motor skills like play dough and lego?

I'm a bit surprised by the Ed psycs recommendations too. DS1 was disengaged and is very very bright (also diagnosed Autistic and clearly was at that age). The ed psyc recommended differentiated work. Stretching him on topic beyond what the others were doing. Use of IT so he could research topics to the nth degree. One of my favourites doing two running laps of the playground after finishing each work sheet (personally I always felt that was out of great sympathy for his teacher). DS also had 1-1 support so help for the teacher on sorting this differentiated work load.

DS didn't write either, he could though. He is only just writing now at school at 11. He started last year with sentences (that he could write at 4) and finally in year 6 he will write paragraphs. Hopefully he'll get his writing into the acceptable range before levels at year end. He's reading GCSE texts and enjoys them, just can't see the point in writing. He's very good on a pc and can type quickly so his spelling, grammar and punctuation have come on even though he hasn't really written.

The EP has made suggestions that haven't been implemented, or only in part. Eg taking DD out of phonics lessons with a couple of other fluent readers and have them do extension activities as a group. Dd no longer does phonics but sits in a corner by herself reading a book because her teacher doesn't want the others to miss out on training for the phonics test. The EP does have montessori type leanings, but I do think she has the measure of DD, much more so than her class teacher.
I have been to the GP and got a reluctant referral to CAMHS but they phoned the school who said they had a behaviour plan in place that they were confident would work and in their opinion there was no need to proceed the referral. This was about 6 months ago. I used to think there were underlying issues but not so much now. She had very severe undiagnosed glue ear and had grommets put in a year ago and has come on socially tremendously since then.
Fairienuff - she doesn't really have a nap, it is just one of her excuses (others being 'I can't write as I'm saving the ink in the pen for the next person who wants to use it').
I am going to ask the school if they will do a lunchtime handwriting club.

i'm not exactly sure what she does, I think it probably started with praising when he did a little and then lots of encouragement. Maybe 5 lines are too intimidating and she needs to start with just doing a line, and getting praise for that. Impermanent stuff (whiteboards) might be better than paper. A mat showing how to form each letter could help but might hinder. Do you think she would copy writing? If so maybe that could be built up to her copying most of a sentence and just supplying the last word herself?

At home we have modelled non-perfectionism, but there's an element of convincing him he can do it rather than fixing that issue. I write him notes, you could start with ones requiring 1 word replies ("Dear DD, would you like ice cream for tea? Love from Mummy". You could even ask her to write the answer in the box below, and draw a box.)

DS was happier with numbers rather than letters, so he wrote a lot of sums before he did his first sentence. Mazes (Usborne do a gorgeous book) or colouring will let her practice the movements without writing.

Missfor - that's interesting. I do think Dd could do with a term or so of 1:1 to get her on track. She will only do anything with a teacher or TA next to her.

Does she ever write for fun? I think a handwriting club would be the worst possible option for a child who is reluctant to write. Better to do finger writing with paint, writing in sand or foam.

If she likes making up stories, she could draw the pictures and label the characters. Anything to make writing fun and more interesting to her.

Funding for 1-1's unfortunately changed quite dramatically last year. The first 12 or 16 hours are now funded direct by the school and the LEA top up beyond this point.

A good starting point if you don't already have one might be to request the school write an Individual Education Plan ( IEP) for your DD including the EP's recommendations, who was going to action them, anticipated outcomes, support required to achieve these targets etc. IEP's need to be periodically reviewed. I would suggest a half termly/ termly review at this stage would probably be appropriate if small targets are set. This starts a paper trail so you can go to the school down the line if necessary and say 'look, we're not progressing on these points'.

Hopefully if you can politely but firmly engage with the school it wont come to down the line. I'm a bit of cynical about the whole process i'm afraid but always remaining polite and keeping documentary evidence definitely helps. Email back up confirming actions etc. from any informal discussions.

She has an IEP but little progress has been made on it. I think we need to get tough!

Thank you all for taking the time to reply, I really appreciate it.

With over twenty years in primary schools as TA or helper, it strikes me she could be TOO clever, and staff haven't yet managed to get onto HER 'wavelength' and she certainly isn't going to bother to get onto theirs!

When I worked with 'reluctant' Yr2 writers, I would get them to DICTATE their stories to me and I would type on the computer to their dictation. Boys who wouldn't do more than a word or two with a pencil, could dream up great stories, once the chore of handwriting was removed.

So (as Charles said) let her use a tape recorder, or some other recording device, to get her ideas down. She can then vet it, amend if necessary, and in due course, write or type it.

[I sometimes mention 'voice recognition software' at this point, and I really must find out where this emerging technology has progressed to.]

Hi Pippi
what you wrote could be the very description of my son, now in Year 2, so much that I posted a similar note to yours on Mumsnet several months ago. Also very bright, bored and stubborn, also extremely reluctant to write. School was very unhelpful, so we ended up paying a small fortune for all sorts of private assessments. Turns out his processing speed is significantly below average (8% percentile) while both his verbal and his perceptual intelligence are significantly above (92% and 94% respectively). This makes it enormously frustrating for him to write because he literally can't keep up with his thoughts (this shows clearly on the rare occasions when he does write through missed words, missed punctuation, handwriting that progressively deteriorates etc). His slow processing speed is down to visuo-motor issues, so we have now started occupational therapy to address that. It's early days to say whether it will make a difference but I'm hoping it will—otherwise, he'll probably get a formal dysgraphia diagnosis and will have to be taught to type rather than write. Meanwhile, we are using the dictation method mentioned by Ferguson in the thread and are working on a couple of other suggestions from this American blog: bitsofwisdomforall.com/2011/10/29/finding-the-right-help-to-build-processing-speed/. School has implemented virtually none of the Ed Psych recommendations but we keep lobbying and are making changes at home and with homework etc.
Has the Ed Psych formally assessed your daughter with tests like WiSC? If not, I'd dig deeper: children at 6 are not defiant teenagers and, if they fiercely refuse to do something, there's usually a deep-seated reason for it!
Hope this is helpful

That is really helpful, thank you. I had looked at potential plus' assessment and was going to go with that to see if there were any sensory or processing issues. I told school and the EP said she would do it this term, but now that might not happen, and another term is wasted. I actually like her school and I realise it sounds like hey haven't done anything, we probably need to be much former. But I think Ferguson is right about her current teacher at least simply not getting her and I hope next years' will be better.

And it is like you say Worried - she's not a teenager and she is usually right about what she will and won't do, we need to find out why. And I need to find a way to get less frustrated when she won't write more than 2 sentences for her homework. I think I will scribe it. And look at that blog, thanks.

I have a similar year 1 ds, great at reading but hates writing and writes very slowly. He does minimal writing at school, but we did some dictating a story recently and it was great. For now we are doing colouring/lego/drawing to help (he never really enjoyed drawing till recently) and hopefully things will improve. It's great to find a thread that shows we're not alone!

Hi. My DS was very like this. It is very frustrating /concerning , especially if the school does not see it as a problem. Our DS continued not to write and was finally diagnosed with dysgraphia , dyspraxia and ndd. Like other posters, he scored highly on ability etc but came out on a very low percentile on processing and actual ability to write. It took years to get the diagnosis, by which time his self esteem had plummeted. I would push for more action - in the end the occupational therapist identified the dysgraphia and dyspraxia , confirmed by ed psych , along with the ndd. We went to the Dr in the end, and got help via the paediatrician . It took a couple of years for my son to get the help he needed ( and a change of school). I regret not fighting for him earlier.

When my son was in primary he didn't write at all and the EP said not to worry as he was extremely bright blah, blah, blah ... the school did what Ferguson suggested ... the result was he saw writing as something he didn't need to bother with ... great until Year 6 and he couldn't record his tests!

I was a writing refuser. My hands couldn't do the writing as fast as I wanted to and it was too frustrating when I had to stop thinking in order to do iyswim. I grew out of it as I progressed through primary.
Much happier typing as I can do that far quicker as an adult.

Mrz, your post is my concern! I have just scribed her homework for her, which we spent all weekend arguing over her refusal to do more than 2 sentences. She just dictated a page and a half of fairly sophisticated text..sigh...
It is so helpful to read all these posts. I do know it is a reasonably common thing amongst potentially higher ability learners but it is hard at the coal face!!

I listened when everyone said not to worry because he was obviously bright but wish I'd worked more at discovering why writing was such a problem. Have you asked why she doesn't like to write? It could be something simple like writing is physically difficult which can be addressed with exercise.