Ok, so when a teacher is telling you off for your child's behaviour ...

[NotQuiteCockney]

... what are they looking for from you? Are they hoping to annoy/upset you enough that you'll take it out on your kid? Or what?

I'd welcome a "he's doing this, it seems to be triggered by this, how is he at home with this" sort of conversation, but to be told off by two teachers in succession about a particular (very bad) day, just ends up pissing me off ...

Is there something I need to say to make them stop telling me how bad the behaviour is? Obviously I've had chats with him about it, etc etc etc, obviously I need to know he was horrid, but the conversations were so long and tiresome ...

think there are ways of expressing how your child is behaving at school....and it can be done constructively or negatively

if you have reassured them you are trying to tackle it then why can't they give you a chance for things to change...esp. with younger kids...

i think they need to know you are backing up their expectations of good behaviour at home....but no need to bang on ...makes you resentful

i think they do want you to know so you can back up at home lke lulumama said. i used to find the lack of information or help really frustrating. didn't the teachers offer any practical suggestions?

how old is he?

• my DS's behaviour in first term of reception was abysmal - i asked the teacher to come down hard on him and i was hard on him too....after that - good as gold! he is in year two now and no problems since that first term..

How old is he?

When ds2 was in yr1 his teacher used to often buttonhole me at the gate with recounts of some misdemeanors. It was not a good time or place for a constructive chat (I had 3 mins to get round to the other end of school to meet ds1), and it did not improve ds2's behaviour.

In the end (after Christmas) we requested a sit-down meeting with the teacher, and managed to get her to think that a home-school report book was her suggestion It worked wonders, because twice a day she had to write in it, and she had to look for positive things to write as well, at the times when he wasn't being daft. He responds very well to that sort of praise and encouragement, and it helped her relationship with ds2 as she recognised that he wasn't actually being naughty all the time. He was angelic for her ever since.

He's just gone 5, he's in reception, but old for reception, iywsim.

The problem is, he's not listening. Well, and today, while being told off for not listening, he laughed at the teacher. Who told him not to laugh, so he laughed again. He was sent to the head of pre-prep, who told him off thoroughly.

How do you get a child to listen better? If I knew how, I'd have done it by now! I am trying to point out to him (getting down to his level, getting close etc etc) when he's not been listening, and DH has been working on getting him to look at people while listening.

They want to do a sit-down meeting with me to "set targets". How do you set targets for listening?

I've confirmed that he's in big trouble (he said, well, only two teachers are mad at me, that's not too much!), I've explained it's a big problem. He didn't get to play Lego Star Wars tonight, and knows he won't get to if I hear bad things from his teacher.

I've also offered that, if he gets better at listening, and his teacher says he has, I'll let him wear scent to school ... he really wants to ...

Some children (ds1 is one) just don't react well to threats/punishments/withdrawals of privileges: but they do respond brilliantly to praise.

So for example, your ds clearly loves Lego Star Wars, so it's a powerful bargaining tool, but you need to put a positive spin on it, not a negative one. Sit down with the teachers; try not to be defensive (it's hard I know), make sure you all know you're on the same side, and see what practical but creative ideas you can come up with.

With a child this young I would want tiny targets, and splitting the day up into small periods of time. So you could maybe get him a little notebook, and draw in it a simple chart for the day with 5 squares in. Decide with the teacher what each square is for: e.g. Square one is for sitting on the carpet nicely during morning registration (5 mins), square two is for listening nicely to the story after break ... Try and encourage them to (for now) ignore the bad behaviour, and concentrate on the good. Each time he achieves a target he gets a tick in the square, or a star. Then if he gets 4 ticks/stars in a day you'll let him play on his game in the evening ...

This sort of system is very time-consuming for a teacher to do, so you really are relying on their goodwill. But it can really turn behaviour around, and needs only be kept up for a few weeks.

Finally! What sort of school is it? From your use of the phrase "pre-prep" I have my ideas. Some schools do expect a great deal from very young children in terms of 'sitting still and behaving' and not all children are able to conform to these requirements. So you may want to bear that in mind in the medium term too.

Another thing you can do is model good and bad listening to him. So if you are sat round a table having a meal with ds and another adult. You could say "Look ds I can tell that Lucy is listening to me, because she's looking at me, and she's not talking until I've finished" ... or even better "Well done, ds you listened really well to me just then, I could tell you were listening because ..."

You can also do this the opposite way, when he is trying to talk to you about something, you turn away and start chatting to your friend about something completely different. Then you have a conversation with ds about how he felt to be ignored in this way, and how he could tell you were not listening and were not interested in what he has to say; that this behaviour is rude, etc.

Some children pick up these social rules of politeness automatically and quickly, others need to have them pointed out and explained.

HTH

Oh, very good ideas, Roisin.

DS1 is at St Paul's. I didn't think they were that demanding in terms of behaviour, but maybe I'm wrong?

I do need to work on rewarding good listening, which I am failing miserably to do.

I think I will write an email to the teacher asking for clarification (e.g. is he not listening during lessons? to instructions to the whole class? to instructions to him? What is he doing instead of listening - is he staring off into space, or chatting with friends, or fiddling with things?) and stress that we are working on this ...

I would actually ask for a short meeting after school rather than doing it by email NQC - I think that you would get a better response tbh. It's definitely not uncommon in reception, and the teachers should have some techniques which they will use, and it is probably helpful if you work with these.

And I know its the obvious, but don't rule out hearing difficulties. I think that Steve Biddulph in his book on boys indicates that boys of this age often have an issue - if you're interested I can dig out my copy and cite the relevant bit. Ds1 is at a boys preprep and they've often come up against it (it wouldn't surpise me if they got some cash incentive regarding the audiology referrals!)

Hmm, I'm pretty sure his hearing is ok, but it's probably worth checking. His speech is generally excellent.

The problem with a meeting after school is, I then have DS1 and DS2 underfoot, so a quiet chat is a bit ... tricky.

I would reiterate the comment on hearing - glue ear is very common in this age group and tends to get worse in the winter months (both mine have it )

I would have missed it in my dd when she got it at 4 as ds had it from birth, but thankfully his consultant picked it up unprompted

Hi NQC,
personally I think STPs makes inappropriate demands of small children. They really expect them to sit still when they are just too young. I'd love to meet and talk about this sometime - although I'm the big baddie there because I removed DD after the first year!

Ok, how do I get his hearing tested? GP? Or do I go direct to somewhere else? Or do I need to go to the GP, and then get a referrral?

I guess I'm used to DS1's older school, which I think was more formal and more demanding. I don't think he's struggling with the sitting still, so much as the listening. (And I do see the same problem at home.)

Annoyingly, this morning, I forgot to put plasters on his thumbs, to stop him sucking them. Grr.

Either GP or Health visitor or school nurse should be able to refer.

try this,

i wasn't happy with my childs behaviour at school - so i went and shouted at them!

wwell not shouted as such but still - go on the attack

"why is my child behaving like this - what methods have you got in place to control the class? i am not happy - he is not learning yadda yadda!!!!"

And as for options for how to speak to the teacher, how about asking another parent to look after your 2 in the playground for 15 minutes (it is not going to be a long session). If there is an after school club then could you use that for half an hour. Or time to arrange an away fixture playdate.

Hmmm, I may have cover for this afternoon for DS2, maybe I'll email teacher for a meeting today. They're talking about a meeting after half term, but I'd rather have a chat about techniques etc now.

My DS went through this. It's just part of reception imo, reception year is specifically there to help them make the transition into a school environment. I really don't know what they want you to do about it, probably practice concentration/ listening techniques at home with him, but tbh I agree with Spatz - it's because on the whole, they're too young for the environment and when they're not, it passes. My DS has absolutely no problem at all with concentration and listening now, because he's older and threfore ready. For the teacher of course, the two or three kids per year who take a bit longer to adjust are a real inconvenience. (Not nearly as inconvenient for the kids who might be put off school by our insane habit of sending them too young though.) I'm not sure if it's a good idea to practice too much at home as although it's backing up the school, he may also need a rest from all that major effort of listening - as others have said, it's being noticed that he's not listening, but I wonder if it's noticed when he is? My DS's school used to have things like a fish for every ten minutes they sat still, and then when they got ten fish they were allowed to choose a book or something - basically, positive recognition of the efforts these tiny kids have to make to function in a classroom.

NQC, can't vouch for St Pauls but I think it is true to say that the independent sector as a whole tries to nail the listening thing early and firmly. Ds was meeker than your ds1 in Reception, true, but we were asked to get his hearing tested and concerns were expressed about his dreaminess and absentmindedness.
His Reception teacher was a gem and managed all of this without ever making us or him feel there was any naughtiness involved but I think she is a rare bird. Dd's preschool teacher can be a lemon-faced tyrant and it's all I can do not to start sniggering, scuffing my shoes and flicking inkblots at her ramrod departing back.
Very much depends on your school gates set-up but I am ashamed to say comparing notes of your child's relative deviancy with other parents can be balm - knowing all 15 of them are "giving cause for concern" is surprisingly reassuring
Roisin's advice is tremendous as ever, and I will think about what bits of it I can apply to the World's Apparent Nortiest Little Girl

Just answering your immediate situation-management question, as a veteran of being told off, the sequence is:

1. Be Told Off, in heat of moment, bluntly and (usually) at a time which is convenient for neither teacher nor parent, w/ immediate consequences of massive extra stress, just because of circumstances, not because of the event. Feel Ugly Combination of Guilt, Fury and Injustice.

1. (NB You have a choice here. This is what I have found works.) Arrange for meeting with teacher, emphasising that timing is whenever suits her best. Appear at meeting and listen. Do more listening. Bite tongue. Find something (anything) to agree with. Listen some more. You will I promise eventually get asked what you think, which is when you say appreciative things about whatever it was you could agree with; then offer two or three ideas of your own as ways of helping (so that she can choose between them, & also so that if she dismisses any of them you don't feel that you are being totally dismissed). Leave meeting with plans to meet again.

1. You now have reputation as constructive helpful parent, & mood of all further Meetings will be friendly. Steam may get let off at you again, but there will be an immediate apology.

HTH

I think it is extraordinary that they think they can tell you off! I don't think they know what they expect you to do about it really - I'd love to hear what they suggest!

I know similar things happened last year - I think the school gate suggestion is very good. In Y1 there is a lovely mum, with 3 boys, who was called over to see the teacher 2 or 3 times a week for similar problems. I think he is much happier in his new class, but I'm sure she'd talk to you about it! Send her my love....

NQC - I posted a similar thread last week. My DS simply doesn't concentrate and his teacher had enough ! She asked to see me - DS was really upset - but I have to say that she didn't tell me off. She was fine - did give me a bit of an old-fashioned look when she suggested that he was overtired Even though she was lovely I still felt that I'd had a slapped wrist Don't see why 2 teachers needed to tell you though. DS's class teacher clearly knew about the issue but didn't feel the need to come and tell me as well.

I don't know how you 'make them listen'. If sleep is the issue I don't know how you 'make them sleep better' either. Sorry no help. But you are not alone.

Oh, lots of helpful replies - Bink, I am wavering about setting up meeting, but will do. I think I will try to do it today, if I can.

DS1 does sleep very well, he's down for nearly 12 hours per night, and really does sleep.

Frankly, I think the not-listening and the cheekiness are two separate issues. The not-listening is just how he is at this point. I've had a chat with him about it, particularly about the manifestations I notice at home, but I suspect he's tuning out of "lectures" as well as one-to-one conversations, which is harder for me to address at home!

The cheekiness, I suspect, is a side-effect of him learning to read recently, I think he's decided he's marvellous and won't hear anything different.

I did have a chat with another mum (from Reception), who told me her DS had been sent out for pushing, in the first weeks, and was v reassuring.

I'm going to have to start asking for daily feedback on behaviour, I think.

I suspect the telling off is them trying to get me to understand that it's serious, and a problem. I just don't think it's the best way to go about achieving that goal!